making an offer: have offered 90% of asking price and been rejected

[curryeater]

The house has a "twin" that sold in August 2012 for the same price as our offer, but was in much better decorative condition internally.

I think it was a fair offer as it has been on the market for a while, houses in this area are not moving fast, most come down in price after a few weeks. I am not sure about raising the offer because I think I might be getting too "attached" (in poker terms)

I know I can't make them sell it to me, but do you think there is any point in mentioning the other house, what it went for?

[whattodoo]

You could call the estate agent and tell them you will not be raising your offer as you think its a fair price, esp considering the other house.

Puts the ball in their court.

To be honest, I'd be surprided

[BerthaTheBogCleaner]

How much do you want it? How much can you afford? Are there likely to be other houses if you don't get this one?

There are a lot of houses in our village that have been on the market for ages because they are overpriced and the owners won't accept offers. Other houses come on at a sensible price and get snapped up at 90% or so. The owners of the houses that stay on the market are mystified as to why their house won't sell when so many others do, and offended by all the 'silly' offers.

You can tell them you won't be raising your offer but don't be surprised if the vendors still don't accept. And are still on the market a year after you're settled in another house ...

[curryeater]

Thanks whattodoo - did you post too soon? I am on tenterhooks here - you would be surprised if it made a difference, or if it didn't?!?!?

I negotiate as part of my job and it is killing me that I can't just have a meeting with the vendors! I bet I could swing it if I could see the whites of their eyes

[RCheshire]

Yes absolutely. Rather than simply saying "My max offer is X", you sound much mre credible saying "...because the twin in better decorative order sold recently for X, so I believe this house is worth less than X but I am willing to stretch for X to agree a sale quickly"

[curryeater]

It's not our dream house. We are compromising a few things we'd ideally like, so I am not sure I want to over-pay for it.
I haven't seen another one we like though.

[curryeater]

RCheshire - right, that is exactly what I would do if I were at work, I hold a meeting, be all lovely and nice and apparently empathetic, would share my deep sorrow at being unable to meet the asking price but make it clear that I really can't, then would pick something I don't want that much and offer to throw it in as something we could all agree on was a massive concession that made the deal a fair compromise - so in this case, a small amount of money, but not going to the asking price.... but I don't know how to do this through agents?

[RCheshire]

This was listed for sale on Rightmove on 23rd April 2009! That's nearly four years without reducing the price.

[curryeater]

Sorry, RCheshire, is your point that they are very hopeful in waiting 4 years to get their price?

Has anyone successfully negotiated, and how do you do this when the vendor doesn't talk to you directly?

thanks!

[RCheshire]

Yes it was! It's not one we were interested in, just amazing that someone is willing to deal with selling (i.e. the hassle of viewings) for 4 years without it sinking in...

[RCheshire]

You negotiate through the agent as if they were the vendor. So for the last place I bought I used the arguments I would have used with a vendor with the agent as their proxy. It can actually be better that way as the agent also wants a sale to be agreed as that is (generally) how they get paid!

I didn't get much off my last place (2-3%) as it was 10 years ago and people thought property values would soar forever

[NoGinorWine4Mu1berry]

Is the twin house actually still for sale, or it sold recently?

[NoGinorWine4Mu1berry]

Sorry. I see now you already said. The other house, 'the twin' is sold! So I don't think it's a factor really. It gives you a guide but it's not something that is going to make the vendor stop and think. At one point the buyer might have had a choice but that choice isn't there now.

Saying that , good luck! I thought that most people put their house up at a certain price knwoing that offers would be less. Didn't they used to say that your first offer should be an insult!

[orangepudding]

Maybe they aren't desperate to sell and can wait for the right price, or they have somewhere in mind and need more money from the sale.

Does the agent know you haven't found anywhere else you like?

They may be waiting to see if you come back with another offer, EA's play games sometimes.

[Siriusstar]

But was the price that the twin house sold for fair to begin with? My friend accepted a price drop of 30k with her house but that was because they could take the loss and really wanted the house they were buying. If people looked on nethouse price they would base all later house prices on hers.

[sherbetpips]

1. They may not be able to afford to move if less than asking price
   
2. They may not really want to move - we will sell if we get xxx, you do not want to get into a sale with those sort of people.
   
3. The agent may not have even passed your offer on.
   

Talk to the agent, ask what other offers they have had and what they are like. If you really want it (which I am not sure you do), put your position clearly to the agent (I presume you have sold/under offer) and ask them to speak to the owners about what they feel is acceptable. In other words make them do there job. If you are not in a position to buy (I.e. sold/under offer/nothing to sell) then go back when you are.

[Chesterado]

Are there any compelling reasons you make a good buyer eg no chain/first time buyer/committed to quick sale etc?

If so I would go back to agent, talk yourself up and remind them what the other went for. If its possible to make the original offer plus 1000/2000k as a gesture i would do that too. If still no interest move on, they are holding out for more and are prepared to at the long game.

[Mandy21]

I agree that you should mention the twin but there may be a reason why it sold at the price it did - the vendors wanted a quick sale (they were getting divorced, about to be repossessed, had a new property they didn't want to lose etc, or perhaps with that timing (i.e. sale in August), they wanted to be in a new house for the start of the school year - i.e. we'll take £10k less if you can guarantee completion by 10th August or whatever). As others have said, it gives you an idea but not the full picture.

Chances are the vendor and the agent are well aware of what the twin sold for, and they'll know you can access that information, so you're not really telling them anything they don't already know. Its a question of how much you want it - you can't force a vendor to accept your offer - its not a question really of whether you think its a reasonable offer, its whether the vendor does!

[PixieHot]

Oh, I could have written this post today - we also made a 90%ish offer which was also refused.

Hey, your first offer is meant to be rejected anyway. It's left us re-checking our maths though, and trying to decide just how much we want to buy this house. I think we'll increase our offer a bit, but I'm not sure that we'll be able to increase it enough for an acceptance.

[curryeater]

Thanks everyone!
We are good buyers because we are renting and are ready to go. The vendors have moved already, so clearly they are not desperate to sell in order to move. I thought they were pretty keen to get rid of the place as they have moved hundreds of miles away but maybe not - maybe it can just sit there empty as far as they are concerned until the mythical figure is reached....


I think I will sit on it for a while, have a look around again for anything new on the market and think about making a small increase - I wish there was something "symbolic" I could offer as a face saver in case they come to want to accept but feel the need to be seen to get something more (at work I usually throw in "rights in the middle east" to do that job, then we sign )

[Rhubarbgarden]

We were in exactly your situation. We gave up on the house and spent another year looking at other places while the house remained on the market. Finally they reduced their price a smidgen; we came back with our offer increased by a token amount, and... it was rejected again.

24 hours later they phoned back and accepted.

I think it is very, very difficult for some vendors to accept anything less than the figure that they have in their head that they think their house is worth. I don't think there's much you can do to persuade them; it's just a case of waiting until they accept defeat.

[PixieHot]

Yes, we're FTB with a mortgage decision in principle, but I think that the owners have a very specific figure in mind, and aren't in a hurry to move (although if they sell, they could then move quickly).

[curryeater]

Ok, thanks for all the feeback. I think I am going to leave it a couple of days and then go back and say:

• We feel that the offer is fair given that [blah blah blah] although of course we appreciate that this is the vendor's decision
  

• We can't tell whether a token amount might sway the vendors or if they are holding out for asking price or nothing and would appreciate a steer on this (I think they have rejected other offers so at this point I think we just need to go and look at other houses, they might be timewasters)
  

The alternative would of course be to offer the asking price but I don't think that would be a good deal for us and I would rather look around and try to keep our options open

[housemad]

Has the vendor found a house they want to move to? Is s/he looking for a place? May be the vendor is not serious about moving. For some people they are forced by personal reason to put their house on the market and ask for too a high a price to make their property difficult to sale on purpose so that they don't have to move. For example: divorce, separation. Because the formal partner wants the money but the one still lives in the house doesn?t really want to let go? etc. or may be other similar reasons.

[mumnosbest]

maybe ring the estate agent n say you're willing to leave the offer on the table for a week but considering its twin went for £X wont be raising it.
They may just not be in a rush. when we sold my nans it took nearly 2 years but we held on because we werent in a hurry.

[AnneEyhtMeyer]

If they have moved hundreds of miles away was it for work? They may be on a relocation package which covers their mortgage for a set period of time so they aren't feeling the urgency to sell. Some packages will cover a year, so maybe they think they can hold out for a better offer.