what are the chances?!!!! [hmm]

[flatbread]

Ok, how likely is this?

We saw a big unwieldy, impractical house that needs loads of work in a moribund seaside town. Of course, we fell in love with it

After months of looking at other more practical options, we decided to go with our hearts (even though we have gone down that route before and swore never, ever to do it again)

Well, on Tuesday we made a cheeky offer. It had been on the market for 6 months and there are a number of houses on that street for sale, and imo, while the one we like is cheaper, it is priced low for a reason - it has loads of roof work, damp proofing etc. required.

EA says no to our offer...we decide not to raise our initial offer. EA then called yesterday to say that there has been another offer on the property and whether we wanted to increase our offer. I said no, please go ahead with the other seller.

Is the EA bluffing or do you think they actually have another offer on the table...? What would be your next step if you were in my position...?

[howlingheadlessmunsters]

Depends on how much you want that house as opposed to being on that street.
Bluffing by EA's has been heard of...
Find out how much this other offer is for and if those potential purchasers are in a chain. ie dig a bit !

[flatbread]

Howling, I asked about the other offer and I wasn't given any information...just something along the lines of we cannot tell you...

My gut says they are bluffing. I do want the house and it is actually perfect in many ways and I wouldn't change a thing about the layout. Which is saying a lot, as I always mentally re-juggle the layout of every place I see. Even friend's homes . The other houses have been done up and I know I would need to reconfigure the spaces

But I really don't want to offer more. Who knows how much the repairs will cost, and our experience is that we will spend 1.5 times the original estimate. We don't want to end up in serious negative equity at the end of the renovation

I just find it hard to believe that after all this time of no offers, the vendor got two within the same week .

[bemybebe]

sounds like blatant bluffing to me.

[Slacking9to5]

Just be aware though, the house we recently sold had an offer on the table which the EA told an interested viewer who put in a 20K lower offer but was in a slightly better position. The buyer thought the EA was bluffing and got shirty so we accepted the other offer. Two days later the guy was on the phone to the EA begging us to reconsider and how he thought he was being led on!

Sometimes there really is another offer!

[flatbread]

Beny, I think so too...but then on the other hand, we might be like Slacking's buyer begging for a second chance!

Slacking, if you don't mind my asking, how long was your property on the market before you got the two offers? Was it in a good area with thriving businesses and families or in a genteel decaying town...? Also, was the EA willing to tell the two buyers what each other were offering?

Thanks for all your perspectives. It seems in some ways a game of who blinks first. I am still trying to figure of the probability of two offers in the same week when the market has been very slow in that area...

[flatbread]

Beny, I think so too...but then on the other hand, we might be like Slacking's buyer begging for a second chance!

Slacking, if you don't mind my asking, how long was your property on the market before you got the two offers? Was it in a good area with thriving businesses and families or in a genteel decaying town...? Also, was the EA willing to tell the two buyers what each other were offering?

Thanks for all your perspectives. It seems in some ways a game of who blinks first. I am still trying to figure of the probability of two offers in the same week when the market has been very slow in that area...

[SolarPrestigeAGammon]

The're bluffing. Nothing is selling. Ne panic pas.

[Slacking9to5]

Oh, it is Solar!

We had fifteen viewers and four offers in five months.

[alabamawurley]

Slacking - yes, four offers in five months. Two offers in two days after 6 months on. Really???? And naturally, the other offer would be higher too. Flatbread, trust your gut - a good starting point when dealing with EAs is to assume everything they say is bollocks and then work up from there . It's not 2007 anymore but unfortunately many EAs are incapable of employing any strategies other than those that served them well in the boom years. Personally, I'd play them at their own game - say if they are interested in your offer, to let you know within the next seven days as you have seen somewhere else you will be offering on if not.

[bemybebe]

Look, it is very simple. House is worth only as much as someone is prepared to pay for it at a particular point in time. Are you prepared to pay more than your initial offer to get this house? Will you be gutted if you miss out? If your answers are yes, then you do what is right within your budget. If no, just stick to your offer and tell them to go with the other offer if they have it. After all, you are not going to flip it and resell any time soon I imagine...

I dealt with enough EA and other type of brokers and unless you know one very well l would dismiss 90% of what they are telling you as lies.

[JohnnyRod]

flatbread I'm going with your gut. Are you in a good position e.g. no chain, in rental, already sold? For now I'd say tell them you need to think about it and you have it on a shortlist anyway. Prob another case of the buyer/EA thinks it's worth a lot more than it really is.

[flatbread]

We are in a good position...we are not selling our place and hence no chain for us.

The seller thinks the renovations are minor while in reality the house is slowly falling to pieces around him because he cannot/will not do the repairs.

Tbh, my heart sank when I saw the 'under offer' sign on the property in Rightmove, but am not going to go any higher.

[ElderberrySyrup]

I think you are very sensible.
I would love a bigger house and would be prepared to do work on it, but I am too aware of how much they are money pits; you are right to be hard-headed about this.
Something else you love as much will come up, or their sale will fall through and it will come back to you at a lower price.

[ShroudOfHamsters]

No, you are doing the right thing.

You have said 'I really don't want to offer more.' That is your gut feeling and you should go with it... not least because most predictions are that house prices will continue to fall. That doesn't really matter if this is a house you intend to stay in long-term, but if your gut feeling is that you don't want to offer more, and you do anyway, I think that if property values fall you might regret it and feel that you wasted money.

Renovations are indeed a money pit...

Something is telling you that this house isn't worth going all out on. I'd listen to that.

[Slacking9to5]

House prices will fall a bit more then rise again. In a decade they will be considerably higher than they are now. You have to think and plan long term.

[ElderberrySyrup]

really Slacking? The demographics point to continued falls (baby boomers who own most of the property selling/dying; young people entering the workplace with huge debts from university and relatively poor employment prospects). I think stagnation is far more likely.

[Slacking9to5]

Poulation expansion, more divorce, more pressure on existing housing stock, low interest rates.

All these point to a rise.
None of us know, that's for sure but I certainly wouldn't be holding off buying property long term.

[NoseyNooNoo]

The long term trend can only be up - very little new housing, continued net immigration, smaller households and people living longer. We don't intend to move for decades so I have no reason to want it to go in any direction but I'd be shocked if the general trend was down.

[alabamawurley]

Slacking - housebuilding has exceeded population growth for about 8 of the past 10 years - housing was built to accomodate around 30% more people than the population grew by. As I have posted before, prices have risen due in the main to lax lending.

Divorce rates have been falling for the past 4 or 5 years and are currently the lowest they've been for 25 years.

Low interest rates didn't help the Japanese much who have seen their property prices fall by 60% since the early 90s.

Nosey - household size stopped dropping in the early noughties and most likely has increased since then (we'll know for sure when the next census results are published).

Personally, I'd love to see property prices fall - yes my home will be 'worth' less on paper but would be nice to know my kids will be able to afford buy a home just as I did.

[CaptainNancy]

flatbread- think of it this way: any amount extra you put into your offer will be something less you can afford to repair/improve.
Do you want the house if it means you have to live with something that's unrepaired/falling apart?

There are a lot of other houses out there at the moment.

[flatbread]

I am quite torn on this....most of the work is necessary, and something we can't cut back on - damp proofing, roof repairs, repointing to stop damage to stone walls etc. So I don't want to increase my offer if it means that we will not be able to do these necessary repairs.

I do feel a bit sad because we looked at lots of houses before we found this gem. It felt right for us and we wouldn't have to do any of the more 'cosmetic' stuff, like breaking down walls and joining/dividing rooms.

I think as well that prices will fall, as the easy money is drying up, consumer spending is going down and there is the threat of job losses in the public and private sector. Unless we see wage inflation, the house situation here will probably be like Japan, as the other posters have mentioned....

[JohnnyRod]

Flatbread there's no such thing as an unmissable bargain. Houses are difficult because you can't move them around, but really if you pay over the odds because the seller is thick then you just inherit their stupidity, for the length of your next mortgage. You can't get away with not doing repairs I'm afraid. I'd say you should leave them to stew, at best.