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Expected v greater depth(25 Posts)
So my dd Y3 got what I thought was a lovely report, narrative about how well she was working at a higher level and ticks for expected outcomes on all areas.
Her dad however said it isn't good enough as she didn't get greater depth.
Can anyone advise how meaningful this is at this stage. Is greater depth a subjective or objective score based on some kind of grading system where the same across different schools?
Her dad sounds like a dick
I would be asking him why he’s not proud.
It depends on how the school have assessed your DD. In Y3 it may well be a combination of a standardised test plus teacher assessment using their professional judgement on her work throughout the year. She is working at the level expected for a Year 3 child. It's a pity her father can't be pleased with that. I guess his disappointment in her results show what a lovely father he is!
Her dad needs to relax. Hope she has a brilliant holiday with the odd fun adventure. Or just a nice calm one where nobody bags her and she can recharge her batteries for Y4.
What a shame your DH is so critical. Did he get all A*, a first class degree and a PHD? Or was he fairly average?
Yes her dad is a dick which is why we are no longer married.
I just wanted a better understanding of how it works, so I can talk it through with her, as prior to his comment to her I thought expected was very good and had hoped hed give her a treat to celebrate when I sent him a copy of the report as the narrative had some lovely comments and talked about her working at a higher level
You cannot explain and shouldn’t try to explain away her dad’s comments to her. He can do that himself otherwise it’ll look like you somehow agree.
She’s where she should be. Some kids might be even further ahead for their age (which is what greater depth means), but that’s irrelevant. She’s obviously tried really hard and put in a great effort. That’s enough surely.
Expected is where she should be. I think only a handful of kids get greater depth. She is so young & his attitude will lead to mental health issues for sure. That feeling of never being good enough. Poor kid.
I would be questioning why her report talks about performing above expectations but she hasn't got greater depth - is that not what her dad means? I wouldn't care either way but there seems to be a discrepancy.
As I understand you can be working at greater depth in many aspects of the curriculum for one subject but if there is one aspect for which you aren't showing greater depth, for example, your writing could be excellent but if you (or rather your child isn't showing proper use of one of the required grammar aspects) they won't be awarded greater depth over all. So, I think you are right that your DD is doing well and you should be proud. Her Dad needs to readjust his perspective. A happy child who is settled and getting a good report is something to celebrate. Expected or exceeded expectations are so irrelevant, particularly in Y3. She may 'exceed' as she gets older, or she may not. But she sounds like she is settled, happy and thriving at school. Be proud
I really wish parents would stop obsessing about primary school education. Your child is 7 fgs !! You have another decade before they sit any meaningful exams.
Working at a higher level means absolutely NOTHING. You can have a 'gifted and talented' child who comes 'top' in everything... who refused to take their GCSEs because they 'just got fed up with school ' .. You can have an absolute 'average Abbie' who never shines, never gets awards , never 'comes top' however what they do have is focus and determination. I have both of these children. First one took 5 years of doing pretty much nothing - before falling in to a creative career that he adores.
I'm attending graduation of number 2 this month where she will pick up a first in a very academic subject. Which she worked very hard for.
The MOST important thing for children is to feel loved, secure, supported and happy. Nothing else! and dickheads who talk about 'greater depth ' for a 7yr old are just that .
The only specific criteria for greater depth are for Year 6 and Year 2. The rest of the time schools are just using their own criteria. It's very difficult to get greater depth at year 6, especially in writing, so in my school we're quite cautious about giving it in other years. I teach year 3 and only gave greater depth to a couple of pupils in each subject.
"Expected" covers a huge range. Some of the children are working right at the top of the expected range and are doing very well. Your husband is an idiot.
Sorry, I see he's not your husband!
Basically the criteria to hit greater depth are really high, so you can be working above age expectations and not get it. And yes, ab above even if they are doing really well in a subject being not quite there with one aspect of it - spelling for example, can mean they get expected and not greater depth.
Pay attention to the comments, as you have, and don't worry too much about the level!
I know one of
Greater Depth really isn't the be all and end all, even at the standard is far more than was ever expected of us at primary school.
I work in schools, I am only a TA not a teacher, I don't even look at the grades my DC are given I read the personal comment only. If my children are well behaved, putting in effort, kind and helpful I am happy regardless of what boxes they tick.
DippyAvocado thank you for directly answering my questions that clears things up for me.
As I justed wanted clarification around something I'm not sure of.
Fontofnoknowledge I know that children need to feel loved and secure so the lecture wasnt necessary.
I dont see any harm in wanting to understand a school report, specifically when the other parent who has more knowledge is being negative about the results.
Equally regardless of whether a persons child is 5 or 15 there is nothing wrong with trying to understand how they are doing.
Some schools have given talks to parents about how they assess children. Could your school do this? It’s perfectly reasonable for parents to want more info on this.
If you are in a high achieving area quite a few DC get greater depth: or the opposite if it’s a struggling area. It varies. Many schools get other teachers to help moderate judgements too so they are as accurate as possible. DC often know who does really well in class (at maths for example) so she will be aware of these DC and they might be greater depth pupils but it’s hard to get greater depth in everything. However her report sounds great and she’s doing well, so ex DH should be pleased. There are three years to go before Sats and time to enjoy school. I hope she does.
@Sunshineandreign in my daughters school they get the general overall mark for a subject such as maths, but within that they get individual marks for say measurement or calculating, so she could get an expected for calculating and greater depth for measurement. Its quite helpful being split up like that to know where they might need a little help.
I find it useful to know where my child falls within a category so I just ask. The range from just into Expected to borderline Greater Depth is huge.
I would suggest to her Dad that if he wants more detail that he should go and speak to her teacher. It does sound like a bit of a discrepancy between the wording of the report and the levels given and if he hears it from the teacher then he will understand better whereabouts in the "expected" band she is.
It’s actually really hard to get expected there’s so much criteria to meet. She’s done really well. The report is probably linking back to the testing at the end of Year 2 with her expected outcomes & it sounds as if she’s very much on track.
As a divorced person my DD is now 15 and we have been separated for 7 years I have negotiated a number of reports.
I read the report with my DD we discuss with her. I reward her independently of her Dad - I reward effort hard, getting homework completed on time and good behaviour. He tends to reward achievement.
In your situation continue with your plan to reward your DD you are quite rightly proud of her and she needs to know. If her Dad chooses to moan about how she's not achieving high enough that's his problem.
Your poor DD
You need to support her against her dick of a dad else he will erode her self esteem