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Really worried about ds's voluntary year 3 sats please

(30 Posts)
virgo Wed 18-Jul-07 23:17:42

we pestered the school for ds's year 3 test reuslts as we've not had a good year with his teachers (lots of negative comments etc etc). He struggles to concentrate but seems outwardly egenrally brightish.

His year 2 stas were 2a for reading and 2b, 2b for writing and we were happy with those. Anyway at the end of eyar 3 he's only achived 3c in reading, and 2a, 2a in the other two - which means he's below the national average.
We also asked for a copy of the year 2 sats so we could compare progress. Anyhow we have found the reuslt we were give last year (ie 2a, 2b and 2b) BUT the school have now given us a completely different set of year 2 results (2b,2b and 2c). I'm concerned that they've changed these results to make it look like he's imporved more than he actually has. Anyway - it all looks v confusing to me.....

As a paranoid parent I worry that he now won't catch up at all and under achieve all the way down the line through senior school too. Perhpas he just had a bad day - I guess that these year 3 sats are simply on one day's tests rather than teacher assessed like the year 2 ones.

cat64 Wed 18-Jul-07 23:51:37

Message withdrawn

geekgirl Thu 19-Jul-07 10:47:00

virgo, I posted about this last week some time - my dd1 is also at the end of yr3 and seems to have made exactly zero progress since last year's SATS in writing and maths
several people posted in reply reassuring me that a level 2 or 3 in year 2 is not the same as a level 2 or 3 in year 3.

virgo Thu 19-Jul-07 11:40:02


are you really worried about her or do you think she'll catch up - what were her sats in year 2??

cornsilk Thu 19-Jul-07 11:42:22

What has the teacher said about his ability in general? Are there any concerns or is he OK?

cazzybabs Thu 19-Jul-07 11:43:34

Why not go and talk to her teachers? I think it is in 2 years they are supposed to go up a level - so he has improved - 2a is better than 2b. Why not aslk what he needs to do to get a 3?

cazzybabs Thu 19-Jul-07 11:43:51

Beg your pardon - his - sorry!

geekgirl Thu 19-Jul-07 11:49:01

hi virgo, she got 3 in everything in year 2, and now has 4 in reading, and 3c in both writing and maths. I am not worried because they're still reasonable (and now I know it doesn't mean she hasn't made any progress), I'm more annoyed with her really because she has been so lazy.

virgo Thu 19-Jul-07 11:51:26

He has problems concentrating and with aural instructions...but the teahcer is v fierce and is known for not wanting to disucss anythign with parents out of paretns evening when she's really stirct about the 10mintue slot. When I have braved her and asked a while ago abotu how he is doing - she said not brilliantly - I then asked if there had been any improvement from last year - ad she asai 'probably not no' and then I said what could be done about it she said ' ..I have 28 children in this class and I can't pay special attention to your son especailly when he's not concentrating...'. this was after I had gone in to talk about his slef esteem which is at an all time low - he actually siad (age 7) that 'I am rubbish at everything..' - he cries about being on the 'bottom tables' which according to the teacher are not beacuse of his ability which academically is better than this but because he can't conecntrate for very long without having to be reminded by the teacher about what he should be doing.. Maybe he'll get better as the years go by - he's one of the youngest in the class.

I'm really upset and worried abut the hwole thing - I looked at private schools but really want to stick it out with our village state primary - its where his friends are..

virgo Thu 19-Jul-07 11:52:20

terrible typing - sorry everyone!!!!

cornsilk Thu 19-Jul-07 11:53:35

Virgo - the teacher's attitude is just not on. Can you make an appointment to see the head and discuss your concerns about your ds's attainment? They can't just ignore it if he's not making progress.

cazzybabs Thu 19-Jul-07 11:57:49

That is not on. I will be honset I hate meetings after school but I would always make time to disucss what can be done to improve things. That is what I am paid to job does not finish at 3.30. I would go and see the head.

I am sure his concentration will improve. What about writing a diary over the summer holidays - just a few sentences and a picture. Or making a non-fiction book together - he is a boy and this might interest him. He could find pictures and information on the computer to help him. This might all help him. It sounds like he will be alright because of his you still read to him? Does he enjoy school? Does he enjoy reading/being read to?

cazzybabs Thu 19-Jul-07 11:58:48

It also sounds like his self-estemm needs a boost. I have always said if children want to learn they will - to be switched off school at 8 is not good!

virgo Thu 19-Jul-07 12:00:59

we had to go through the head to get the voluntary sats results - he's great but retiring stressed out tomorrow. There's a new head and deputy head starting in September. This teacher must have refused to give the head the year 3 sats results after we asked as he rang us back and asked us to put the request in writing...

I think she's ok as a teacher if you have a child who's motivated and concentrates - I can see that my child might be frustrating - but surely these little boys are a challenge rather than an annoyance...She ob really dislikes him and has favourites - thankfully he's not on his own she seems to only like about 7 or 8 in her class...I'm really hacked off with it - I don't go into shcool at all. Apparantly they did a group reading test with him (hes really good at reading - well I think so - he's reading famous five books etc) and his reading age is 20m higher than his actual age - btu this hasn't shown up in his sats - he got a 3c for that.

I think I will wait for the new head to bed in and then go and see her...doesn't help at all that the school are ab brilliant with my dd (in reception) who's listed as G&T - which doesn't help my older son's confidence at all.

cazzybabs Thu 19-Jul-07 12:04:52

Ohh bless your son - I have dd who loves school and I imagine is a dream to teach - but go dit would be dull if I had a class of her. The problem with the SATS reading test is it tests inference as well...which is part of reading, but that may expain why there is a difference. I hope he has a nice teacher next year who understands boys. there is a difference between boys and girls (I am proberly going to get shot) but most boys don't like writing.

cornsilk Thu 19-Jul-07 12:05:41

It sounds like your ds had a bit of a crap deal this year Virgo. Hopefully his next year's teacher will be better. Go in and see the new head and state your concerns if this is not the case.

cornsilk Thu 19-Jul-07 12:06:32

cazzybabs I absolutely agree with you regarding boys and writing! I have 2 that hate it.

cazzybabs Thu 19-Jul-07 12:09:14

Sorry - I am on a roll - just thinking of things you could do with your son (I don't know wether you want things to do with him or not but this will be my last suggestion) - what about making a comic strip to tell a story. He could make up the story and do the pictures and dictate the story for you to write.

virgo Thu 19-Jul-07 12:14:50

Thanks for all your support - this is what mumsnet is so good for. I really need to feel positive about ds - he is so loving and lovely (some of the time!!!) and loves history and geography etc - he loves looking at his wall map and playing a bedtime game with me about where we'd like to go and explore - Tanzania is his favourite which he knows is off the coast of Africa - so is fairly bright about that sort of thing - but sats as low as 2a in year 3 are really bad - arean't they...??? Do schools go off his year 2 sats for target setting - which were 2a, 2b and 2b. We're in a grammar school cathment here so I just don't know where we are heading later in his life...and the school is completely uncommunicative about it all. One of the reasons we didn't send him to the private school is that his self esteem is so fragile and we didn't want to knock it further by removing him from his friends locally.

cat64 Thu 19-Jul-07 19:28:35

Message withdrawn

homemama Thu 19-Jul-07 21:08:13

Oh Virgo, I feel so sorry for your DS.

I'm a p/t Y3 teacher and I hate SATs full stop. They cause nothing but anxiety.

Firstly, your son's teacher sounds like she has a bad attitude. No child should be sat at a table working at a level below their ability just because they have trouble concentrating. FWIW, IME, all Y3 children (especially boys) have difficulty concentrating. THEY ARE ONLY 7!

I think your main concern should be your son's lack of self esteem. How awful for him to say to you, 'I am rubbish at everything'. Whenever I have had a child come into my class in that state I have formulated a plan which I've discussed with the parents. He needs to be praised to the hills. He needs to be given lots of tasks he is good at, his work should be displayed for all to see and admire. His work needs not to be too challenging for a 1/2 term so he gains confidence in his ability. Doing this initially will ensure that by the end of the year, you'll have a confident little boy achieving his potential.

A good teacher will ask him to ask you to pop in after school so she can show you that excellent piece of work he did for her. It can be anything but she should have made a fuss over it in class,in front of his peers then she'll make a fuss of it to you. He should beam with pride.

As an aside, it is true that KS1 SATs results do not fall in line with KS2 levels and we have worried parents like yourself every year. What I usually do is show them an exercise book from the autumn term Y3 then let them compare it to the one they're currently working on. Believe me the improvement is vast!
Oh and 2A is honestly not too bad. He could have just missed level 3 by 1 mark.

Enjoy the summer and go in to speak to the new teacher in the autumn. Ask for help to boost his confidence and ask for regular updates on his progress.

I hope he has a better year next year.

homemama Thu 19-Jul-07 21:12:46

Sorry that was so long!

Wanted to add that I agree with cat64. If your son has a genuine problem which is affecting his concentration then it's schools job to try and work out what that is and how to combat it.

muppetgirl Thu 19-Jul-07 21:26:49

I agree with what the other year 3 teachers have said re the corrolation of ks1/2 sats, ie -there isn't any!

I found teaching year 3 very interesting, it is a time when the children definately change. They are no longer part of the infants but now the juniors and expectations of them in terms of behaviour, concentration and behaviour step up a gear.
I've found that this is the year where they find out that friends are really important, they have a sense of fitting in and it is the time when a teacher can really no longer say to 2 squablling children 'say, sorry and play together.' You can't make juniors be friends if they don't want to.

Your dc's teacher sounds awful I must say. What do the other parents think of her? A teachers' reputation is generally well known and I'm sure other parents feel the same way you do. What is your dc's next teacher like? What does your dc think of his next teacher? You could arrange for a meeting with the new teacher before the end of term (if time) or not then at the very beginning of the autumn term. Discuss your concerns and ask for regular updates -this is what your dc's teachers are paid to do!

Good luck

virgo Thu 19-Jul-07 23:44:40

dh went to see the head today - despite the fact he retires tomorrow and he was extremely sympathetic and said that a lot of serious complaints had come to light recently about this teacher...but it was too late for him to act on them....

However he cheered us up by saying that ds had improved over the year - despite the teacher saying he hadn't and is on track for 4a's and 4b's in year 6. We feel a bit better about that but still need to manage his self esteem. I think i will see the next years teacher and explain the situation and also be much more proactive with the new head - I really don't want another year like this. One day last term he came home saying it was the best day of his life because the teacher had moved him up a table. A week later she told him that he was to move down again and he was completely gutted - he said that the whole class would think he was rubbish. I said it didn't matter what table he was on but that doesn't seem to wash. I really wish they didn't set classes in this way - it might work for the top tables but has had a really detrimental effect on ds.

I actually feel fairly muderous about this particular teacher - which is terrible isn't it.

homemama Fri 20-Jul-07 15:06:39

Glad the HT was sympathetic, Virgo.

BTW, the tables are set for ability in many junior classes to aid the literacy hour and group reading. Children need to be sat with those of similar ability at that time.

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