Yr4 performance

[daffodilbrain]

Dd8 attends a small primary 15 to a yr (max) and is taught in a mixed yr group (3&4) most of the year 3's are behind where they should be due to a poor teacher in yr 2 who is no longer at the school. Dd is one of the lucky ones and has had same teacher since yr 2.she is doing well and already heading towards 'exceeding'. Dd has complained she gets a bit bored when the teacher has to stop and explain in more detail to the yr 3's. I've asked the teacher is she can have more stretching work but was told they aren't allowed to teach them yr 5 work but will try and ensure she has other tasks to complete . I can't believe this and think it's more to do with the teacher having such a wide range of abilities to teach from underperforming yr3 to over performing yr 4. What are your thoughts are schools not allowed to teach above their year group? Ofsted report said the school wasn't stretching more able pupils either

[user789653241]

My ds's school say the same thing, that they are not allowed to teach above their year group. It's not true. If you ask few teachers on here, it's very clear.

I decided not to fight, after many meetings with teachers, since it was only one subject, and I can easily give him extentions at home, and he was otherwise really happy at school.

I think first step is to have a proper meeting with teacher. And I wouldn't worry about being "that parent".

[MyOtherProfile]

She doesn't need year 5 work. She needs her current work but at a greater depth. The teacher should understand this.

[user789653241]

It depends, really. For some children, yr4 greater depth work can be piece of cake in yr2.

[Kokeshi123]

You need to stretch her at home and view schoolwork as a time for consolidating, reviewing and revising previously-learned content. Going over things again is often helpful.

[RedSkyLastNight]

There's no particularly value in teaching her Year 5 work.
She does need challenging work - but that can be done by extending the Year 4 work. I'd wait and see what the"other tasks" turn out to be; if they don't help then keep pushing.

[Namenic]

Agree with kokeshi.
Do stuff at home. No need to race through the curriculum, but getting to a certain stage (e.g: multiplication) opens up a lot more of the interesting things.

Maths Plus Word Problems 3: Pupil Book www.amazon.co.uk/dp/0435208640/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_api_FGt7Bb72GNAG3?tag=mumsnet&ascsubtag=mnforum-21

I’ve used the above range. There may be others if you look online.

[MyOtherProfile]

Irvine that's a bit of a misunderstanding of greater depth!

[user789653241]

Really? I have info like theses, which was given to me here on MN by a teacher when my ds was in yr2.
www.ncetm.org.uk/resources/46689

He had no problem doing greater depth work for yr6 in yr2/yr3.

[user789653241]

@MyOtherProfile, I do want to know why it's a misunderstanding. How would you go deeper? If the child already understands what's the expectation of greater depth in their year group?

[MyOtherProfile]

It involves sideways learning amongst other things. There is so much you can do around and beyond what the majority of the class are doing for a bright child without getting into the curriculum of a higher year group. You can include such things as problem solving, research, projects etc.

[QuickWash]

If it's a small school, can you speak to the head? My oldest is Yr 4 in a 3/4 class and is given extension work regularly. Her teacher told me that they discuss children who need extending regularly with the head to ensure suitable stretching is going on.

[FredFlinstoneMadeOfBones]

The problem with teaching above their year group is it doesn't help long term. Lots of bright pupils would get through the primary syllabus by Y4 then what? There is no advantage of accelerating in most cases but they should be able to offer more difficult work within the same syllabus. This should be standard practise but often doesn't happen.

[BubblesBuddy]

Has she completed everything in the Y4 syllabus? I doubt it. She cannot be truly exceeding at the moment. However the teacher must differentiate and give her extension work on the topics being taught.

I also believe this comes down to quality of teaching and leadership of the school. There should be a culture of meeting the needs of all children and they are not doing this.

Irvine’s DS is gifted at maths. Most children are not destined for Cambridge maths degrees at 7.

[daffodilbrain]

Thanks everyone. I will look to work with the teacher at the moment and rely on dd to try and explain where she feels bored. I don't feel able to speak to the head there's a host of other things happened from removal of chair of governors daughter to a public school at very short notice, to being a teacher down all year (head sitting in) to even the loss of a pupil followed by an ofsted! You can understand the pressure she's under. I'm happy with dd's teacher so will keep an eye on things

[user1483972886]

We had a similar issue with DS1. Two years in a class. The first year he enjoyed but yr2 he frequently said he was bored and conversations with the teacher on his level and differentiation were very opaque. He didn't do brilliantly in his KS1 sats. I asked about him being more stratched but was given schwizel over not being able to teach them things from yr3. For such a small school I found it very inflexible. The range of abilities in the class was v wide.
He moved to year3 and a new class with a much more dynamic teacher but by then we had lost trust in the school and moved him to a private school.

[BubblesBuddy]

For the vast majority of children, there is no need to teach a year above. Some teachers are not confident about teaching maths extension work and extra breadth though and this can limit the differentiation in the class.

I can see the school has its problems. I rather suspected this. The Head probably isn’t checking up on the progress made by the children or seeing the teachers in action as much as she should. Many schools keep a close eye on progress the children make so do ask what progress your DS is making and the evidence for this judgement. This is a reasonable conversation at any school.

The Y3 curriculum isn’t the same as the y4 curriculum! The y4 children should be doing their work. It could be that there are insufficient bright children in y4 to work with her and this can be a problem in small schools. The only children I have ever known move up a class or two both went to Cambridge to do Maths. Lesser mortals should be catered for by good teachers.

Ask to see the y4 curriculum. It’s good practice for a school to share what they are teaching with parents. Do they have a Maths evening? This would also be useful for parents. You should be able to have a conversation with the teacher no matter what is happening in school.