Reception class size 33

[SillyBlueHat]

DD is starting school this September and I have found out that the class size is 33. I thought the maximum is 30! I'm slightly upset as we may have applied to a different school had we known, although I suppose the school didn't know as 2 successfully appealed.
Will the school have to have more staff to cover 33?

[mrz]

Unlikely

[Allthebestnamesareused]

No - on appeal those allowed in would have had to show why they should put the others in the class to the detriment of having the additional students in their class and did so successfully.

You can, of course, still apply to schools that have vacancies should you so wish.

[TheHeartOfTeFiti]

33 four year olds with one teacher bloody ridiculous. I'm in Scotland & here at that age they'd still be in nursery with a 1:8 ratio I'd run a mile!

[user789653241]

I don't get it. On MN, people always try to get into their preferred school if they didn't get into one. There are so many ICS appeal thread on primary. If they win appeal, that's what happens. 30+ children. So why do people freak out when they learn that their dc's class has more than 30.

[SillyBlueHat]

33 is a big class though? Surely I am not wrong in thinking it's an excessive number for 1 teacher and 1 TA?

[mrz]

33 children with two adults is quite a low ratio in reception. The legal requirement is 1-30.

[KeiraKnightleyActsWithHerTeeth]

Are there places at other local schools that you like? What was the class size for year r at all your local schools this year?

[SillyBlueHat]

We can walk to this school so I don't want to move her. There are spaces within a 15 min drive but I feel that she is better off at her local school with her friends.

[shouldwestayorshouldwego]

Children leave schools all the time. By the end of yr R between 2-3 children from each of my 3dc's oversubscribed school had left. For them they were replaced to bring it back up to 30. If it is already over 30 no one will be replaced from the waiting list until it goes down to 29. It might stay at 33, but probably won't.

[nonicknameseemsavailable]

one of mine started reception in a class of 32, by October half term it was 31 and another one disappeared at some point in the first term and a half too. It never seemed to make any difference to be honest.

[MissJSays]

That ratio makes me cringe. Our (private day nursery) ratio for 3 and 4 year olds is 1:8, so many of our children are staying with us this year rather than going to school for this reason!
I know you're talking about reception class size but still! Poor teachers and poor children! The ratios are also what put me off doing a PGCE this year after my early years degree.

[mrz]

"Our (private day nursery) ratio for 3 and 4 year olds is 1:8" it's because the DfE think that QTS means you're issued with extra hands and eyes.

[mommy101]

I'm a school governor and judging by my knowledge, for a class that size (we have one in our school also) there would be TA's as well as teachers. For example, for ours we have one teacher and 3 TA's. Hope that helps. I kind of thing a class that size has pro's as well as con's to be honest...

[MissJSays]

Mrz makes me so mad! Eight 3 year olds I on your own can be hard work depending on the children you have. I'm not at all bad at my job and have a few years experience under my belt, but 30 children! I'll be the first to admit I would struggle, I think most people would.
Imagine the possible SEN children in that class who need additional support yet don't have diagnoses or EHC plans yet (as they are still so young) they wouldn't be getting any funding so it all falls to that one class teacher!
It honestly stresses me out so much and is whats putting me off a PGCE.

[mrz]

I've taught 36 in reception without a TA and it isn't easy. Free flow to the outdoors us impossible for example. It's difficult but not impossible and with a good TA it's very workable.

[MyfatheristheKing]

That's crazy. Here in Scotland both my schoolkids had large P1 classes but also had two full time teachers with 33 kids

[Strawberrybubblebath]

SillyBlueHat if your child hadn't got into the school you really wanted would you have appealed? Or would you have thought, 'No that wouldn't be fair on the other 30 children if my child got in on appeal"?
It's tricky. I can see both sides. Parents just want what's best for their children.
Maybe your child will end up being best friends with one of the appeal children.
Nothing can be done so try and be positive. Yoir child will have lots of friends to choose from - it's better than being in a really small school.

[Paperclipmover]

The appeal children are most likely to be there because they should be there. A mistake was made that denied them their rightful place. Their place was taken by someone else, maybe the OPs child plus two others, children A, B and C. Instead of removing children A, B and C and replacing with the correct children, all the children are able to keep their places. Or maybe the 30th place was quads!

I think I'd be interested to know why, and wonder hopefully if a lesson had been learnt by the admissions authorities. I'd hope the teacher was ok with it. However I've seen a similar situation and it didn't seem to matter to the children- went up to 33, down 32, 31, 30 and back up again. It didn't seem to make much difference to the children.
I'm sure it will be fine OP and I wouldn't personally think about moving schools because of it.

[PickAChew]

Our primary is facing this class size with year 1, rather than reception (which can tweak rations through sharing wit nursery in the foundation unit).

They've worked around it by having an experienced teacher plus an NQT and them working together across 2 teaching spaces.

So I'd double check that those 33 kids aren't just with 1 teacher with no help or support.

[mrz]

I'm not sure how that's working around it. In a Foundation unit there should be two teachers plus however many TAs required to meet ratios. You can't legally tweak ratios - I've got high numbers in this class but low in another so I'll add them together to make it look lower!
The reception children are still the responsibility of the reception teacher regardless of whether they are in a unit or a separate class.

[SillyBlueHat]

I'm not really concerned with how the extra kids got in, they obviously had a good reason.
It's more the staffing levels I'm worried about as there must be a ratio rule somewhere.

[prh47bridge]

It's more the staffing levels I'm worried about as there must be a ratio rule somewhere

As Mrz says, the legal requirement is 1 member of staff to 30 pupils. As there is a TA your child's class will have two. Even without the TA they would be fine legally as 3 of the children will be "excepted" which means they don't count towards the ratio.

[ShowOfHands]

DS is in reception with a class of 32 (one extra on appeal, one according to FAP). One teacher, one TA and a few parent helpers. It isn't ideal but actually, the dc aren't disadvantaged. The staff are though. They are burning out. I have no doubt they'll do just enough to get through and then have their own holidays be negatively affected by the stress of having to do it all again come September (not mentioning the extra work during the holidays). I feel very sorry for them and massively grateful.

[mrz]

"It's more the staffing levels I'm worried about as there must be a ratio rule somewhere." You're correct and as I said earlier the ratio rule is one adult (qualified teacher) to 30 reception children no TA required.

[mrz]

EYFS reception ratio