Please help!

[MrsInTuition]

Can I have some advice please?

I have been thinking about becoming a Primary School teacher recently. I'm currently in the process of getting more information from my local college.

I won't go into all the reasons why as there is more to it (and I don't want the thread to be too long) but as a lone parent, one of the desirable factors is my children will be at school whilst I'm at work and school holidays mean that I would be off when my children would be off (I know there will still be work to be done but anyway...that isn't my only reason to get into teaching!)

If I started my training this year, my children will be 5 and 7 by the time I have complete my courses, so both would be in full time education themselves.

I maybe jumping the gun here but I'm just trying to plan ahead and wonder how I would arrange getting my children to school on time, as well as being on time myself for my own teaching role?

Are there clubs at schools that allow children to be dropped off earlier/picked up later that opening and closing times? Or is it the case that I would have to find childcare, willing to do the drop offs etc? Would I be allowed to work at the same school as my DC if there were vacancies? My DC1 has only just started Nursery and I take them myself at present, so I don't know much about organising anything else...

I appreciate there is a lot of work to be done as a teacher but if for example, if school finished at 3pm, what are the chances of being able to finish at 3pm to go and get my children from an after school club maybe?!

I am quite happy to make up the hours on an evening at home when the children are asleep or is this unrealistic? Aware there will obviously be parents evenings and etc to factor in but I'm worried about the costs of childcare that would fall upon me?

Are there any teachers here with children similar ages to what mine would be, that can advise how you fit everything in? I don't doubt that I would manage, I just really like to think ahead and cover all angles! Sorry this ended up being a long thread!

[spanieleyes]

Many schools have breakfast and after school clubs, either on the premises or ones who deliver and collect from the local school.
It is not unknown for children to attend the same school as their parent is teaching in ( my youngest son did when I began teaching) Indeed some schools give priority to staff children!
As to finishing at 3, probably not. Most schools expect staff to be there past finishing time, you will be running clubs, attending meetings, meeting with parents or other professionals so leaving as the children do is certainly frowned upon. You might be able to do so if you have a PPA afternoon but not on a regular basis.

Teaching is NOT a family friendly occupation!

[soapboxqueen]

First of all, you have to consider that at least some of your holidays won't be at the same times as your children. Years ago this would only have happened if you worked in a different LEA or worked in an Catholic school. Now more schools are opting for different holidays dates to surrounding schools.

You can apply to work in any school you want but that doesn't mean they will short list you. Some schools would be happy to have a parent on staff, many wouldn't.



Some schools do wrap around care so you could drop off at 8 and pick up at 6 but you would would struggle to drop off in the mornings unless your school were very close by. It's highly unlikely you'd be able to leave regularly at 3 o'clock, think more one off hospital appointment. Assuming you're school even finished then. Many don't finish until 3:30pm. Some schools also have a staff finish time so no leaving school until 4:30-5pm. You'll have at least one meeting a week, we used to have two per week until at least 5 o'clock if not later. Then you have to factor in training days which will be different. That's before the workload which may range from just about manageable to krypton factor impossible.

I had my parents for child care, many people use childminders.

[Hermanfromguesswho]

No way to being able to leave at 3!
I'm a teaching assistant and I get away by about 4 most days.
The earliest the teachers get away is abiut 5. Usually gone 6 though. And they plan/do other work at home also.
I'm a single parent and I absolutely could not be a teacher.

[cantkeepawayforever]

I started training when mine were the ages yours are, so were a year or so older by the time I finished.

Yes, you can work in the school your DCs are in, if there are vacancies. usually arrangements are made (especially in 2+ form entry schools) for you to avoid teaching your own children, though I have known it happen in small schools.

For the rest, it depends where your place of employment (or placement during training before that) is relative to your children's school, and the opening times of e.g. breakfast clubs at school.

My first job was 30 mins travel time away. Latest possible acceptable arrival time to set up for the day = 8 am, start time of breakfast club = 8 am. Therefore i used a childminder before school, where they arrived at 7.30 am and had their breakfast, then were dropped off at school. I would say this is quite common - unless you are someone who stays late to set up the classroom ready for the following morning, IME most primary teachers are in the building by 8 am.

Leaving at 3pm also depends on school culture and distance, but i would say is very unlikely. You will have a staff meeting one evening after school per week. It is common to meet parents after school. If you work in e.g. a 2-form entry school, then discussion with your parallel teacher will tend to happen after school. In terms of where you do planning and marking, schools and individuals vary - I do it almost entirely at home, others work almost entirely at school and stay much later - but there are things (displays, meetings, organising the classroom, printing out resources for the following day etc ect) that can only be done at school, and obviously can't happen during the teaching day.

Many teachers I know plan to leave early - say no more than 30 -45 minutes after the end of school - at least once per week. None have childcare arrangements that require them to leave as the children eave every day.

I would say that good pre-school childcare (or another parent who does drop-offs), and after school care allowing you to stay in school if you need to until at least 4.30 pm, is probably a practical minimum. Remember that you will need this in place at specified times during your training as well when you are on placement (placement students have less flexibility about e.g leaving early - IME they often stay until their class teacher leaves).

[cantkeepawayforever]

(I would also emphasise that being able to leave at 4.30 is an absolute minimum, and will depend on existing school norms and culture. 5 pm would be much more normal, and would probably also allow for meetings etc)

[MrsInTuition]

Thank you for the quick replies, it's really helpful! As I said, I wasn't sure how it worked - I don't want it to come across like I thought teachers must down tools at 3pm, as I know that's not the case! I hope I haven't caused any offence.

So I would definitely need to look for wrap around childcare then basically.

This is a very nosey question but on the off chance anyone can/will answer...I'm not sure what a starting teachers salary would be and if being a lone parent, I would get help with the childcare costs, maybe through tax credits or something?

I think I have a lot of thinking to do!

[maisiewalker]

cantkeepawayforevr has a good point re training.

I have had students in my class and there's loads to talk about at the beginning and end of the day. I had a student a couple of years ago who came in 'late' I.e. 8.15 and went at 4.30. It didn't go down well with me or her tutor.

[maisiewalker]

Look here
www.nasuwt.org.uk/asset/CF08AAD8-AE67-42B1-9FAF58BD09C293A2.BAFD6A29-1AAF-4C03-A59D6CC75091B199/

No help with child care costs

[ScarletSienna]

Where I live, there is no wrap around care in local schools that have hours long enough for them to be useful. I no longer work in the state system or full time and on the days I work, my husband works from home to enable us to do drop off etc. I know other families manage but we couldn't unless we employed a nanny or similar to fill the gaps.

Standard (non London or fringe etc) starting salary is roughly £22,500.

[maisiewalker]

This includes London /fringe allowance if relevant. You would start on M1 unless you offer a shortage subject or relevant experience.

www.nasuwt.org.uk/uploads/assets/uploaded/851929b6-f87e-4a87-b72a9e90184bfab0.pdf

[Wheresthattomoibabber]

You will never ever get to see any of your kids shows/sports days/achievement assemblies/nativity plays. Ever.

You will need child care for when their school has training days and yours doesn't.

Some of your questions make me think that you may not have been in a primary school since you were a pupil so if this is the case I would strongly advise spending a few weeks working in one to give you some idea of how it has changed. It's changed massively even in the last two years.

[MrsInTuition]

Thank you wheresthat...I appreciate your advice and your honesty.

I know it would take an awful lot of dedication and determination, which is why I've headed here to try and speak to you all about what it might entail, before I go any further.

I know I might come across a bit naive about it all but I'm just trying to establish what it might be like, so this is really useful.

I was thinking of asking if I could volunteer at local schools first. I haven't yet as my youngest has only just started nursery and I also have a 1 year old at home, so I'd need to see if I could do this, whilst someone could care for DC2.

[cantkeepawayforever]

I would say volunteering first would be a very good plan. It need only be for a couple of hours once a week to hear readers, but will give you a better 'feel' for how things work (it set me on course for teacher training).

[PurpleDaisies]

You'll have absolutely no chance of getting on to a course without work experience. Volunteering is a good idea.

[EweAreHere]

Teaching in a primary school is not family friendly.

Your children would be best off if you could get them into the school you're teaching in, which would help with your morings.

Primary school teachers don't rock up at quarter to 9 and start teaching. They're their 60-90 minutes early for meetings, getting ready for their day.

Primary school teachers don't leave at 3/3:30 when the school day ends. They have meetings, training, parent meetings, marking, etc.

I work in a primary school as a TA. I get to rock up and leave, teachers don't. You need to make sure you have wrap around care or clubs etc that they can go to, etc.

And if your children are sick, it becomes really, really tricky.

[MrsInTuition]

Ok, just with the replies so far and the circumstances I have explained, maybe it might be best for me to look into becoming a TA initially?

Then progress onto my teacher training later down the line, when either my circumstances change or my children are older and more self-sufficient?

I will start with the volunteering though first. Thank you all, this has been eye opening!

[PurpleDaisies]

There are big advantages to being a TA. You can walk in at 8 and leave at 4pm (or there are often part time positions available). It's much less stressful with much less responsibility, no planning or marking to take home.

Unfortunately the pay is dreadful, lots of positions are being cut and it can be hard to find permanent posts since often roles are tied to funding for particular children. It's also frustrating watching other people teach lessons in a way that's not as good as what you can do.

There are advantages and disadvantages to both teaching and ta roles.

[Wheresthattomoibabber]

And again you will never see a nativity with your child in it! You will however see your own school's nativity 76 times...

I'm a TA and I love it by the way! I would never teach though. In my area TA posts are hugely competitive and have minimum requirement of NVQ3 plus relevant experience.