Y1- I hate school

[Robindrama]

Why do you hate school? It's boring.
Now in Year 1, ds.
Achieved reception expectations, feedback: bright and able. Started school as a confident boy, enthusiastic. No social problems.
First signs of being bored end of reception.
Oct parents evening no issues raised by the teachers.
March parents evening, written report:

• attitude issues: does not want to follow instructions- he says he knows it
  
• has not gasped that school is about following instructons/ completing tasks
  
• a risk of not achieving y1 expectations
  
• attitude to learning poor so outcome does not reflect potential.
  

End of year prediction:

• reading : exceeds y1 ( he is a boy with lots of interests and reads a lot at home)
  
• spelling: will not meet expectations
  
• maths: will achieve, great mental maths but does not follow instructions
  
• phonics- unlikely to pass.
  

How worried would you be?
He constantly asks us lots of different questions, his general knowledge is amazing ( teachers confirmed that) but school? Big no.

[mrsBeverleygoldberg]

Ds1 was the same. There's a lot more play in reception. He liked the play. Also the novelty of school had worn off. He got over it. Just keep plugging away at learning to follow instructions. Lots of rewards for following instructions. Explain that he does what the teacher tells him, and give small rewards for doing it. I normally get a sweet for dcs. Focus on the most important subject. Talk to his teacher. It's important you work together.

[user789653241]

I think I would be really concerned.

Exceeding reading expectation but not likely to pass the phonics rings alarm bells.

Attitude towards learning need to be tackled now, otherwise it will be even more bigger issue in the future.

[fairybaby]

Anything else you see that worries you or the teachers? How is his writing? Can he focus? I ask because sometimes bright kids can be turned off school when some sort of learning difference shows it's ugly head.

[Increasinglymiddleaged]

How can he exceed for reading without passing the phonics? And by 'spelling' do you mean 'writing'? It would be a very spiky profile to exceed for reading and be below writing expectations. I'm not convinced that can be put down to 'poor attitude' in year 1. I would be asking to see the SENCO.

In terms of behaviour request a daily report card so that you know exactly what was going on day to day. It also gives the opportunity to talk through problems/ praise and reward when he has a good day.

[Bitlost]

We have similar children! I could have written your post (except for the phonics but)

DD had a good reception year and a rather disastrous year 1. The teacher was at the end of her tether with her. DD would do nothing, her notebooks were full of blank pages. And then ....in the third term, she aced everything... Suddenly, just like that. Her attitude to learning was still not great but she started understanding things better.

Year 2 was also shaky in the first two terms and then she aced her SATS... A bit of tutoring did help (mostly to get her to understand that she had to do the test from beginning to end and not stop in the middle! )

Year 3 has been plain sailing thanks to an inspiring teacher.

All this to say to try not to worry too much. Keep an eye on it. Personally I was unconvinced by our teachers, one of them in particular, so we took matters in our own hands.

Don't let one teacher demoralise you. Do they have a plan? Have they offered advice? Personally, we were just told she wasn't getting it. And I refused to accept that.

[Traalaa]

I wouldn't make too big a deal of it. Kids often go through phases of saying school's boring. It could be his teacher this year, but it might mean that he's not happy about something.

Is he competitive? Could it be that he's finding some kids are catching on quicker to the academic things than he is? My son used to tell me reading was boring, but we realised that was because lots of the other kids could read and he couldn't. He was saying it was boring because he felt inadequate, so was dismissing it. Has your son got a good set of friends? If friendships aren't easy, that can put them off school too. It's easier to say school's boring than admit you're the odd one out/ need help, etc. Is he not paying attention sometimes because he feels out of his depth? So if he doesn't listen he can't do whatever, so he can't fail, etc, etc? There could be all sorts of reasons why, but if you can get to the root of it, that'll help you solve it.

[Robindrama]

Thank you all for your replies. Contradictory opinions- love mumsnet.
Ds does not have any social issues. He is a happy and popular boy. He get invited to his friends. I also organize play dates or weekends with his friends.
No issues with concentration: we play lots of board or card games. He plays some chess. Can spend hours playing Lego, building blocks or Minecraft (iPad very limited).
Great phisical development: could ride a bike without stabilizers before 4, he can swim, 5 level of asa, plays football in a club.
As mentioned before board interests: science, history, ( recent questions how can spiders walk upside down, cheenese warriors).
Clever with maths, he has older siblings, when he hears 5x 5=25 he will interrupt asking if 50x50=2500.
Great detailed memory.
Writing: long stories, great imagination. Teachers praised him for being the only child in the classroom who knew some idioms (despite the fact that ds is bilingual).
He upsets teachers ( there is a job share in his class) by not using words from words bank.
When I asked ds why he does not do what he is supposed to do he gave me an example: they had to write even numbers in maths, starting from 2. Some kids went over 300. My ds stopped at 20 and said there was no point for writing more as it is the same pattern.
Teachers do not seem to have any plan to challenge my son.
I spoke with deputy who said that it looks that my sin v early realized how his life look like for the next 20 years and is against it by taking minimum effort.
I contacted teachers with ideas how to help him eg: on the carpet he sits in the last row, at the corner. I believe he is neglected and forgotten there. Bring him closer.
Worth mentioning: in his class there are 20 boys and 10 girls. Some of the boys require lots off attention, they are sent to ht on daily basis. Looks my bored son just dreams of not being there.
I feel so sorry for him, in my opinion he is a high flyer, I brought a happy and enthusiastic boy to raception. School pulls him down.

[user789653241]

But why does he unlikely to pass phonics checks? Is it because he can't be bothered, or he doesn't get phonics? If he can read without phonics, why can't he spell?

[MilkRunningOutAgain]

I agree with the others. Not likely to pass phonics but exceeding in reading is odd. You need to find out why I think, as Irvine says it may be because he isn't engaging, but it could indicate a problem. My DD, while no where near as bright as your DS sounds, just didn't get why school was important until yr 3 and underachieved across the board. She's yr 6 now and has really turned it round, and works hard and gets awards for behaviour, so things can improve. But she didn't' have a spiky profile, she just needed to mature a bit and realise education is useful, & once you put effort in you get results.

[Robindrama]

School reading levels are 1-26. End of y1 expected level is 17/18. DS is in level 20. Excellent reading and advanced comprehension. I have not got any clue how he may not pass y1 phonics test. Any ideas/ suggestions welcomed. I will have a meeting with teachers shortly.

[mrz]

From your other thread

"End of year prediction:
^*- reading : exceeds y1 ( he is a boy with lots of interests and reads a lot at home)

• spelling: will not meet expectations
• maths: will achieve, great mental maths but does not follow instructions
• phonics- unlikely to pass*^."

Spelling and phonics sound alarm bells to me (as a teacher and a SENDCo)

[fairybaby]

My son was an early reader, and almost straight away he was reading without having to sound out. I remember feeling very proud of how advanced he was.

Well, it now clear that he has not mastered phonics because of that he has atrocious spelling. It's very frustrating for him to have to work so hard to spell simple words. He thinks he needs to remember the letters in each word rather than using his knowledge of the sounds in it. It much harder for him.

I am not saying that you son has a problem, but I would make sure he has a good grasp of phonics. My son is very bright AND has a learning difference. It more common one think and often goes unnoticed because they are bright and can compensate. My DS now has to work extra hard, and I wish I knew how then the importance of phonics.

[Robindrama]

Our son spent Saturday investigating " what's at the bottom of space". Looked through any books we have available at home. At the end of the day he concluded that there must be a door that allowes you to travel in time.
Sunday- most of the day building electrical circuits.
Meantime he was swimming, on his bike, had a play date.
He woke me up this morning with a question whether it is Monday today. When I confirmed. He stated that school is a waste of his time ( until now school was boring).
How to support such a child? Home ed is not an option.
Shall we consider a private school? His current state school is an outstanding one.

[bojorojo]

You may find a private school demands more concentration and doing what he is asked to do. Some private schools have lots of bright children, others do not. My friends DS was very good at maths, (went to Warwick maths degree) but in Y1 and Y2 no-one noticed at his little private school. He is a quiet soul so did not make a fuss, but don't expect miracles and the teachers will not have any greater qualifications to deal with his intelligence and slight belligerence.

I think I would speak to the teachers privately about how he can settle. They should be able to extend the work he finds too easy but it slightly sounds to me that he wants to do what he wants to do. A sort of free-form learning where he makes the decisions and does not want to be guided by others.I think that's fine at home, but cannot really be indulged at school where one to one conversations and a custom-built curriculum are not possible. There is no reason though, why his maths cannot be extended and greater effort put into his spelling and phonics at home.

I went on a course in our LA fairly recently where the lecturer noted that my LA has a problem in some schools where reading results are very high but a handful of children fail the phonics test. Work was being undertaken to see how this can be remedied. There was a worry that the deeper thinking children didn't see why a made-up word would even be on the page, it was illogical, so tended to think it was a mistake, in the heat of the test, and said a sensible word instead. I am not sure about the spelling tests but the implication was that these children are very bright and did not have SEN.

[user789653241]

I find it very worrying that 5 year old state that the school is a waste of time.

Do you want him to grow up to be a rounded adult who have happy life, or very socially awkward adult who thinks everything that doesn't interest him is a waste of time?

[sirfredfredgeorge]

So DD, is 5, has been known to say school is a waste of time, as she can read, knows all the maths they're doing, can write, the PE is easy etc. Our response to this is reminding her of the art and music they do etc. the assemblies (which she enjoys, they talk about events of the day, or general philosophical questions etc.)

Then we talk about why she's still just repeating simple maths and handwriting/spelling, proving that she's not yet fast enough to answer a mental maths question for example, and it's the practice that takes her there. Showing her that she still makes spelling/punctuation mistakes in her work.

She gets it, she also knows to chat with the teachers if she wants something else - or to research it herself at home - which is the internet not books these days of course.

[mrz]

"There was a worry that the deeper thinking children didn't see why a made-up word would even be on the page, it was illogical, "
It's a great excuse isn't it.

[user789653241]

I agree with mrz. Most of deeper thinking children would listen to teacher's instruction and realise those words are made up and not real.
Good readers who reads a lot should have encountered those made up/silly words already anyway

[Increasinglymiddleaged]

If he's that good at reading practise with the BFG. Made up words a million

[Ginmummy1]

If he really is bright and the work is easy, tell him that the only route to harder work is to complete the easy work quickly and accurately. He then has a legitimate reason to ask the teacher for more/harder work.

He needs to understand that ignoring instructions and avoiding the work that is set in school is simply not an option. Maybe he is super clever in all directions with wide interests etc, but if he can’t channel his enthusiasm appropriately at school he is going to make life difficult for himself, his classmates and his teachers.

As for phonics, he’s either genuinely struggling or his poor attitude is letting him down.

Once I was certain that his poor attitude wasn’t his way of hiding the fact that he was actually struggling, I’d be coming down on him like a ton of bricks about his attitude.

[Fairenuff]

he gave me an example: they had to write even numbers in maths, starting from 2. Some kids went over 300. My ds stopped at 20 and said there was no point for writing more as it is the same pattern

If he refuses to write it there will be no evidence of this knowledge.

He is too young to make these decisions himself as he doesn't understand why it's important to listen to adults and follow their instructions.

I would treat him the same way as I would if he refused to follow my instructions at home. There would be a sanction.

[MilkRunningOutAgain]

Bojo said OP's DS might have a slightly 'belligerent' attitude, that is a perfect description of my DD at that age! It may describe OP's DS too. But coming down like a ton of bricks could easily be counterproductive, both my DC's dig in their heels & refuse to change in these circumstances. But over the medium / long term I've found they come round if you continue to give clear messages without nagging. Not that I always get it right..

[user789653241]

I think you should encourage him to make easy work interesting himself, as well as ask teacher to provide him more challenging work.

My ds loved easy open ended tasks.
For example, make 10. He used all his knowledge to make as many combinations as possible, including using +, -, x, /, decimals, fractions, powers, square roots, etc.

If he was made to write even numbers, I would assume he would follow instructions, but stop somewhere, and comment something like, " even numbers are numbers divisible by 2/multiples of 2." or something, not just stop at 20 because he knows.

[bojorojo]

I don't think anyone was making excuses for the lower than expected phonics test results for some children but were having a conversation as to how it might happen. The reason it was mentioned was because the LA was working with the schools where this was an issue so no-one was complacent. Not that it took long for the criticism of another opinion to come rolling in! As one of the highest achieving LAs at Sats with very many bright children in lots of our schools it was a genuine problem. So many people on MN dislike criticism of teachers! Don't they m r z?! It is surely better to look at the problem rather than just blame the teachers!

I think schools can help reluctant children and some do use the word 'boring' to describe something they don't want to do. Explaining their deeper feelings is more difficult.

[ForTheSakeOfFuck]

Hnh. So I have absolutely no specialist knowledge about SEN and am not a primary teacher. As such take everything I say with shovels of salt. I dimly remember feeling how your son seems to feel at primary. It all seemed so pointless. The thing about only going to twenty, for instance - I actually think his insight there is more advanced (read my disclaimer again) and I would value that over blindly just writing out numbers. I'm not saying a bit of compliance isn't extremely good but if he could say "I've realised X pattern" (which is surely the point?!) and then be allowed to move on, wouldn't that be better? I spent most of primary in trouble for not listening, reading under the desk, and being entirely bored/disengaged with tasks. I found the level of them so excruciatingly easy that I spent my days miserably bored to tears.

Anyway, all the caveats again, but just another perspective.