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Does the ks1 level 3 have a level cap?

(37 Posts)
IsotopeMe Mon 08-Jul-13 21:20:26

As in, does it only test up to a certain level? And if so, anyone know what it is?


IsotopeMe Mon 08-Jul-13 21:20:55

Sorry, was talking about level three sats paper! blush

toomuchicecream Mon 08-Jul-13 21:31:29

KS1 is teacher assessed so what the child gets on the paper is irrelevant - if the teacher knows they've had a surprisingly good or bad day when they do it then they will disregard the results of the paper. The paper can be done at any point in the school year - I know one school where they did it in February so the children will all have made significant progress between then and the end of the year. Also, as the papers are all available on line, the teachers have no way of knowing which children have done the paper at home already, which would make the result meaningless.

Teachers all use a variety of continuous assessment methods to enable them to know what the children can do and what the next steps in their learning are and so help them plan future teaching. This is what is used to assign a child a level.

Having said all that the level 3 paper has 2 possible results - below level 3 or level 3. If a teacher thinks a child is at level 4 they will use APP or their other on-going assessment tools to check this. In my Authority, any year 2 teacher who thinks a child is level 4 has to notify the County who will come in and moderate it. If the child really is level 4, then they will be awarded this level although this is very unusual as they are unlikely to have covered the full curriculum for level 4 even if they are working at that level in some aspects of their work. For statutory reporting purposes, the only possible results for year 2 children are 3, 2a, 2b, 2c, 1 and W (I think....), but that doesn't mean the child can't be assigned a higher level which will be used internally for tracking purposes.

mrz Mon 08-Jul-13 21:40:21

There isn't a cap in the past we've used KS2 papers to support level 4 assessment in Y2.

Feenie Mon 08-Jul-13 21:51:24

For statutory reporting purposes, the only possible results for year 2 children are 3, 2a, 2b, 2c, 1 and W (I think....), but that doesn't mean the child can't be assigned a higher level which will be used internally for tracking purposes.

Nah - the ARA refers to level 4.

numbum Mon 08-Jul-13 22:07:33

My DS was given a L4 for his y2 SATs in maths. I think if they give them a 3 then they equate that to a 3b (but am probably wrong and will be told otherwise very soon!)

IsotopeMe Mon 08-Jul-13 22:10:54

Interesting. Thank you.

Feenie Mon 08-Jul-13 22:13:29

Depends on the LEA, numbum.

toomuchicecream Tue 09-Jul-13 16:44:59

Thanks Feenie - not a problem I've ever had (!) which is why I wasn't completely sure...

MrsMelons Wed 10-Jul-13 08:18:23

My DS got 100% in his L3 SATs but they didn't bother to test further. They also told me he had a 3b (1 sub level progress in 18 months!) as the KS1 curriculum doesn't go any further so they couldn't challenge him further hmm Not impressed to say the least!!!

Feenie Wed 10-Jul-13 10:42:36

Is that this year, MrsMelons?

MrsMelons Wed 10-Jul-13 11:43:42

Yes, why?

MrsMelons Wed 10-Jul-13 12:00:22

I know it doesn't really matter as he will do whatever he is able to at KS2 but just feel it is a shame for him as he hasn't had the opportunities other children have had even though the school have said he is capable of more etc. I would understand more if they have said he wasn't capable of progressing further but they have said its the limitations of KS1 rather than the limitations of his ability.

Lemonytrees Wed 10-Jul-13 12:21:28

This is interesting - MrsMelons, my DS also got 100% on the level 3 sats, but hasn't been tested further. I was also given the indication that he couldn't get more than a 3b - but not yet had a report to confirm. I agree - it's a shame he's not been given the same opportunities that others have

MrsMelons Wed 10-Jul-13 12:27:55

Well we now know it's not true that they cannot give any higher! His previous teacher had said he would get a 3a/4c but she left and amazingly then we were told the highest was 3b as they won't have covered the curriculum so he spent 18 months covering the same thing.

Feenie Wed 10-Jul-13 12:44:50

That's outrageous. I would be asking questions about their responsibility to ensure that he is allowed to progress. If you like I can point you in the direction of the legal document which shows level 3 should not be a ceiling.

MrsMelons Wed 10-Jul-13 13:12:50

Thanks Feenie, I feel pretty bad about it as I left it and left it hoping things would get better as they had a lot of disruption to the management and staff etc and then I seemed to leave it a bit late. Until this year they have been brilliant but admitted to me they hadn't had a child at that level before and didn't have the reading level required but would buy some ( but didn't)

He leaves in 2 weeks as it is a stand alone infant school, we are really pleased as he has been awarded an academic scholarship at a local independent school for juniors who have promised this will not happen there.

IsotopeMe Wed 10-Jul-13 19:59:41

Mrs melons, I can sense your frustration through your posts and I can sympathise as we are currently experiencing something similar, hence the op.

feenie, if a child is significantly above the rest of the class in one area, yet their report/score shows that they have not made the expected progress in that area (despite them being gifted in that area), where would you go from there? The teacher in question was given a target to get the bulk of the class to a certain level, which they have. Great results overall, the best in years. And yet you have a student who it seems has been left to coast, has not made expected two sub levels progress, the head is making excuses, the child was not identified at pupil progress meetings as not going to meet target...basically it has been a waste of a year. We are really angry but have no idea where to go from here??

MrsMelons Wed 10-Jul-13 20:37:00

Yes I have been frustrated, in particular with literacy, the school situation sounds so similar, their SATs results have been the best ever this year.

Is it a primary school so your DC will be there next year too?

EeTraceyluv Wed 10-Jul-13 20:47:12

well dd was given the 3 level 3cs so there must be sublevels

EeTraceyluv Wed 10-Jul-13 20:49:29

I will start again grin My dd got all level 3a's in year 2 SATS. What does that mean?

mrz Wed 10-Jul-13 20:52:00

Sub levels don't technically exist in the National Curriculum and at KS1 schools report level 1, 2c, 2b, 2a or 3 (no sub levels for level 1 or level 3)

EeTraceyluv Wed 10-Jul-13 20:53:58

I had better ask why they gave her the sub levels then

Feenie Wed 10-Jul-13 20:54:45

Some schools may choose to report what sort of level 3 it is, but as mrz they only legally have to do that with level 2.

It's difficult to comment without knowing why the school are saying your dc hasn't made the expected progress, OP.

Feenie Wed 10-Jul-13 20:55:59

Because the school will probably have recorded a sub level internally, and decided they might as well report that too. But they don't have to.

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