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Should school have contacted DS's sports coach about an incident that took place at school?

(246 Posts)
ptangyangkipperbang Tue 14-May-13 20:16:44

DS aged 8 got into a fight at school. It was over with in a few mins, the boys made up and they missed a playtime and had to write about the incident at lunchtime. I thought it had all been dealt with and supported the school by talking to DS about making the right choices, etc, etc.

A week later the boys went to judo and were called over by the coach who talked to them about their behaviour as one of them had mentioned a judo throw had been used when they were fighting.

It turns out that without asking permission from parents the school had contacted the judo coach to ask him to 'tell them off'. The school have a relationship with the coach because he'd run an after school club there in the past so he'd been put in a difficult position.

1. Can the school contact an outside body without a parents permission? (Excluding child protection)

2. Can the school 'sub-contract' discipline?

3. Have the school over reacted?

4. AIBU to be really cross?!

Any comments gratefully received as I'm a bit open mouthed about it all.

LeonardWentToTheOffice Sat 18-May-13 00:16:20

Ah sorry to assume what you meant there, WorrySighWorrySigh.
But wow!! I missed this bit - so OP states school spelt it out so clearly in their policies shock
They were wrong wrong bloody wrong.

Growlithe Sat 18-May-13 00:19:34

The OP uses the word 'suggests', you say 'spelt out so clearly'. hmm

WorrySighWorrySigh Sat 18-May-13 00:22:01

I have made no comments about the school breaking the law. As you can see the OP says that the school's behaviour policy suggests that 3rd parties should not be contacted.

The whole point of the opening post is not about the OP's son's behaviour (the boy was punished) but about the school's behaviour in sharing information with a third party.

LeonardWentToTheOffice Sat 18-May-13 00:27:49

Surely OP's use of the word 'suggests' means she has read this policy. Therefore as such ''spelt out so clearly.'

LadyLapsang Sat 18-May-13 00:29:54

OP, when you took your DS to the first judo lesson after the fight, did you volunteer the information to the coach at the beginning of the lesson that your child had used a judo move inappropriately in a fight in the school environment?

When your child signed up for judo did he and / or his parents & carers not have to abide by some rules regarding practicing judo? If so, would you (as the responsible informed adult) not be in breach of some rules by not notifing his coach of your son's breach of the rules?

What would happen if in the future your son and friend had judo fight mark 2 - and your child or the other child was injured, perhaps seriously. Had neither you nor the school informed the judo coach that the children had already been using these moves inappropriately, would you still expect the judo coach to defend himself or would you hold yourself responsible for your lack of information sharing?

Growlithe Sat 18-May-13 00:36:38

Well, as sense has left the thread, and it's bedtime, I'm off.

It is woolly as to what the school has done wrong. It is even woollier what would happen to the school.

It is clear what the boy did. It is clear someone needed to tell the judo coach where his tuition was failing wrt these boys.

All put together, and as the OP has obviously done, I'd get my head down and let it all blow over.

Growlithe Sat 18-May-13 00:38:31

Sorry Lady - obviously not directed at you.

CouthyMow Sat 18-May-13 00:39:39

Good God, if I had EVER used my Judo throws outside the Dojo, I would have been banned from the Dojo.

And yes, if the HT knows the coach, I would expect him to talk to him.

The first discipline in Judo is that Judo is for the Dojo, not the street or school.

I'm beyond shocked that you DON'T think it right of the HT to speak to a coach about a child using Martial arts on school premises, so that the coach could reiterate that Judo is only for the Dojo.

If your DS was one of the DC's getting a dressing down from the coach, then IMO you should thank your lucky stars that he wasn't barred from the Dojo. Permanently.

CouthyMow Sat 18-May-13 00:43:55

(I will qualify that by saying that I was National under 11's champion and have represented our country at a Junior level internationally in the past.)

I was a 2nd Dan by the time I stopped whilst pregnant with my DD, and if any DC's I had taught had used throws etc that I had taught them in an inappropriate environment, I would want to know. And probably would have found out.)

FasterStronger Sat 18-May-13 08:05:08

Very interesting posts cowthy.

Mrz, its a pity that someone working in cp has such little understanding of proportionate response, with the cuts meaning workloads are increasing, I marvel how you find time to deal with a real cp issue.

mrz Sat 18-May-13 08:23:32

Having staff and volunteers who know that it is unacceptable to pass on personal information about pupils without parents permission (all CP trained) means that I have plenty of time FS, but thank you for your unnecessary concern.

FasterStronger Sat 18-May-13 08:35:17

But surely your time is full dealing with things that make this look like very small fry? I mean you do actually deal with children experiencing neglect....?

mrz Sat 18-May-13 08:40:00

As I said I wouldn't have deal with anything like this because staff don't gossip to third parties leaving me free to do my job.

FasterStronger Sat 18-May-13 08:43:18

How does that stop children being neglected?

mrz Sat 18-May-13 09:06:47

How does phoning a Judo coach stop children being neglected?

My staff and volunteers are all trained to recognise signs of neglect (and other CP issues) they know the children, families and the wider community so are ideally placed to pick up concerns.

FasterStronger Sat 18-May-13 09:21:16

You are talking like you have been on a course but have no practical experience of anything significant. You have no sense of proportion.

mrz Sat 18-May-13 09:31:32

I'm afraid I am not going to post about my experience on a public forum to please you FS ...

Rainbowinthesky Sat 18-May-13 09:36:06

The ethics of the situation are irrelevant. Mrz is quite right about what can be told to a third party regardless of opinion on the rights and wrongs of it. Although in this case it seems the incident has been blown out of proportion.

mrz Sat 18-May-13 09:40:40

only on MN the OP seems to have dealt with the situation well in real life

Phoebe47 Sun 19-May-13 17:36:25

Schools have no right to contact a third party about any issues re a child without the permission of the parent/guardian except in the case of child protection issues. The headteacher here clearly overstepped the mark by not telling the parents first that he wanted to do this. I agree that having the judo coach talk to the boy was probably a good thing but the school needed to discuss this with the parents before going ahead with the phone call. Also, nowhere did the OP say that she was more concerned about this than she was about her son being involved in a fight as you have suggested Ragwort (she supported the school punishing him). Wombles - the judo teacher is not "one of their bank of supporting supply staff". He had run a club at the school in the past but no longer does so.

youarewinning Tue 21-May-13 20:15:52

Only on MN could the 1 person on a thread who knows what they're talking about and is correct in all they say be the one who gets the stick. hmm

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