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Year 1 Phonic Check

(111 Posts)
BaconAndAvocado Sun 28-Apr-13 19:28:43

To,all you KS1 experts out there, how and when is this test carried out and what bearing does it have on a child's education?

Ds2 is a good reader thoughI worry about him being asked to read "nonsense words". If he thinks they're not real he won't attempt to read them!

mrz Tue 30-Apr-13 20:02:23

simpson they are meant to receive extra support but won't be formally retested in Y3

mrz Tue 30-Apr-13 20:01:09

Yes we are learnandsay ... and that is the same test used by Ed Psychs and those conduction brain research into reading difficulties.

simpson Tue 30-Apr-13 19:56:00

Also one other thing...the kids who failed it in yr 1 (and there were lots in my DC school) have to retake it in yr2. What if they fail it then?

learnandsay Tue 30-Apr-13 19:53:12

Maybe so. But at the moment we seem to be discussing the children who misread the alien words as real words. If any child got 0 out of 40 on the test, decoding or not I'd be worried, never mind about decoding.

mrz Tue 30-Apr-13 19:46:08

The problem with that logic learnandsay data built up from many years experience involving many thousand of children indicates that those seemingly good readers who are unable to decode (any) words accurately are exactly the ones we should get our knickers in a twist over.

learnandsay Tue 30-Apr-13 19:37:10

Personally I think the test is a great idea. But I do think the abnormality of what the children are being asked to do should be a bit more recognised. And, given that it's a bit of a weird way to behave from start to finish, with some bits weirder than others, I don't think the experts should get their knickers in too much of a twist if some children make a hash of it. If children were always reading lists of isolated words some nonsensical with alien pictures beside them, then OK. But they're not.

mrz Tue 30-Apr-13 19:37:10

yes simpson the school has to submit the results and must inform parents of their own child's results

MrsMelons Tue 30-Apr-13 19:34:28

Exactly Mrz, my DS is a high level reader but was able to do the phonics test with ease as not only can he decode well (as well as recognising by sight) - he can follow the simple instructions of reading normal and alien words. He can understand in a sentence if a word didn't make sense but that is not what the phonics check is asking.

When reading to himself he is a skim reader like me but it doesn't hinder him from reading properly when required.

simpson Tue 30-Apr-13 19:34:18

Does the school have to submit the results?

daftdame Tue 30-Apr-13 19:32:15

mrz - Probably but I'm relying on people like you to point out exactly where I am wrong when I haven't realised them (the assumptions). Clearly - because interpreting subtext can easily go wrong! I'll do the same for you / others. It's how it works.

mrz Tue 30-Apr-13 19:29:54

the check does exactly what it is intended to do ... it tests the ability to accurately decode.

mrz Tue 30-Apr-13 19:28:20

You need to follow your own advice daftdame

daftdame Tue 30-Apr-13 19:26:07

Oh mrz ! Read up on your history of 'scientific' practices! ALWAYS remain open minded!

Assumptions are allowable but only if you admit them.

mrz Tue 30-Apr-13 19:21:52

no Pozzled the results aren't published

mrz Tue 30-Apr-13 19:20:46

and the fact that lots of teachers are shocked by their not as good as they thought readers being able to decode unknown words demonstrates it is very much needed.

Pozzled Tue 30-Apr-13 19:20:30

Quick question- are the phonics check results for individual schools published somewhere? I'm very curious about how DD1's school did, as I think they're pretty dire at phonics.

mrz Tue 30-Apr-13 19:18:27

Because it is a well established method of testing used by Educational Psychologists and Developmental Neuropsychologists daftdame

mrz Tue 30-Apr-13 19:11:54

Well not that exact sentence learnandsay but yes some do make random guesses without realising it doesn't make sense especially if neither word is in their normal vocabulary.

daftdame Tue 30-Apr-13 19:11:25

mrz - Who can say? You would have to know what was going on in the child's brain to know for sure.

It's safe to say it is better to use the test as just a tool rather than a definitive indicator of a child's ability. In practice I'm sure this is what is happening. Why insist the test is virtually infallible?

learnandsay Tue 30-Apr-13 19:08:44

Do children read

Then the stroke flew down from its nest.

mrz Tue 30-Apr-13 19:03:59

So the child who reads strom and storm in the check isn't the same child who reads spilt as split or stroke and stork(e) etc hmm

simpson Tue 30-Apr-13 19:00:12

Mrz - I agree re the pictures.

I help in a reception class that use the phonics tests (and ones they have made up themselves in the same format to assess the kids - amongst other things) and a couple of the kids look at the picture and just say "alien" every time....

Although don't get me started on my thoughts on this way of assessing hmm

daftdame Tue 30-Apr-13 19:00:11

My inability to proof read proves just the point I was making!grin

daftdame Tue 30-Apr-13 18:55:38

mrz - There are some interesting studies done regarding eyesight and visual perception referred to in New Scientist ( I can't think of the exact issues but I could probably dig them out). Basically how our brain makes sense and fills in the gaps concerning the information supplied by the optic's how misdirection works.

With reference to reordered words it is not such a stretch of the imagination to imagine a child substituting a word they would expect to see for a word that it already there. Especially as reading skills are embedded and reading becomes more instinctive.

Thus the test should be seen as merely a tool in the teachers repertoire rather than infallible.

mrz Tue 30-Apr-13 18:50:04

and so is the phonics screening check ... a one lasting FOUR whole minutes

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