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primary admission - if I put that as school has provision for music, and DS plays instrument - he woudl fulfill his musical development

(53 Posts)
Hotpotatofood Mon 22-Apr-13 17:33:24

Just thinking - I remember on the application form for primary school there was a box asking if there is any social/ medical needs for the child to be in the school. If I put that if as school has provision for music, and DS plays instrument - he would fulfill his musical development there? because local schools in our area do not provide music. ( I mean extra curricular activities). would this make any sense?

TheDoctrineOfSnatch Mon 22-Apr-13 17:39:05

You can write it but it wouldn't be a social need

Or is this an appeal form? Applications went in a few months ago for primary schools.

lljkk Mon 22-Apr-13 17:42:54

I imagine there is no legal requirement for a school to provide music tuition in specific instruments, so I doubt it will wash.

It is the sort of info you can sometimes use on appeal, though, if I understand the system correctly.

prh47bridge Mon 22-Apr-13 17:43:47

It would make sense but it won't get you any priority. They will deal with your application based on their admission criteria. If this is an appeal rather than an application it may help provided it is not an infant class size appeal.

As TheDoctrineOfSnatch says, unless this is an in year application, you are very late applying for a place for September (and far too early to apply for a place for September 2014).

PanelChair Mon 22-Apr-13 20:14:00

Are we talking about a fresh application for a school or an appeal? Either way, it is only likely to be helpful if it is not an infant class size appeal. Infant class size appeals are all about looking for mistakes in the decision to refuse a place. At other appeals, you have more scope for arguing about your child's needs.

Hotpotatofood Mon 22-Apr-13 21:04:58

it was old application - ds is 4 years old. just thinking if I could apply for a waiting list and say this in my letter to them

clam Mon 22-Apr-13 21:15:11

Don't think you need reasons to apply for a place on a waiting list, only for appeals.

meditrina Mon 22-Apr-13 21:20:38

You might get bumped up the waiting list if you can get a social need acknowledged.

But I think it has to be pretty major stuff and supported by relevant professionals (eg hospital social worker if sibling newly diagnosed with something major, so need to be near hospital, or Forces family (who are mentioned as special case in admissions code) with new posting order so child needs to stay with nursery friends because a move will take place later in year R and need to avoid excessive disruption of two new school starts.

Primafacie Mon 22-Apr-13 22:36:15

This reminds me of this thread

Sorry but I can't see why you can't fulfil his musical potential with private tuition. There are some families suffering much greater inconvenience with the school they are allocated. I don't think your son's music lessons should be given any weight really.

TheDoctrineOfSnatch Mon 22-Apr-13 22:38:30

No, this won't bump your DS up the waiting list.

TheDoctrineOfSnatch Mon 22-Apr-13 22:40:10

(you can go on a waiting list without writing a letter - I think you can go on as many as you like but some LAs try and restrict it to 3 - the list will be sorted by the admissions criteria eg distance)

Hotpotatofood Tue 23-Apr-13 18:25:44

thank you for various links which made mi think of my situation again: can I put the following as special social/ exceptional circumstances: my father takes my son to school because me and my DH are working full time ( my father has disability + cancer and documentary evidence for both is available). My father is the only one who can take him to school and he cannot walk long distances to the bus and from bus, so could this bump up us on a waiting list?

NickNacks Tue 23-Apr-13 18:31:23

No it has to be the medical needs of the child.

Childcare issues are not considered.

baffledmum Tue 23-Apr-13 19:14:46

I would recommend you look at your appeal from another angle each time you put forward what you think is grounds to make sure none of it is based on an emotional argument. For instance, for your initial thought about music ability, why would a panel favourably on someone who can play an instrument vs someone who can't? It doesn't stack up.

Equally, why would the offer a place to your son because you work and so does your DH? Why would they effectively discriminate against non-working parents - people who may, say, have been made redundant? It may sound harsh, but those sorts of grounds don't win appeals. Your appeal has to based on your child's educational needs.

Again, am truly sorry if that sounds harsh but you need strong facts and not emotion in this. I drafted my appeal, ditched everything that was emotional e.g. it's 2 buses to the next school and I have a toddler to think of, I will be at work when she starts school & can't get there on time, none of her friends are going to the school offered, I don't drive and it is a long walk, my mum'll be doing the pick up etc etc and won. I wish you all the very best with appealing - it can be very tough.

TheDoctrineOfSnatch Tue 23-Apr-13 19:20:30


I think you are proposing going on the waiting list of a school you didn't initially put down, is that right? If that's the case I don't see how you can appeal but PanelChair etc will know better.

NickNacks Tue 23-Apr-13 19:24:35

I thought it was your mother doing the school runs?

You seem to have started a lot of threads on this subject. I would understand if you'd be given a school not requested (been there) but you've got a school you chose.

NickNacks Tue 23-Apr-13 19:26:03

Also just wondering what instrument he plays aged 4 ?

clam Tue 23-Apr-13 19:27:39

If your dad has those sort of serious health issues, can you really, in all conscience, expect him to do such a school run?

clam Tue 23-Apr-13 19:29:29

Re: instrument, unless he's a budding Mozart, I can't see that one washing.

prh47bridge Tue 23-Apr-13 22:31:01

TheDoctrineOfSnatch - Technically to get on the waiting list for any school you must apply and be rejected. That gives you the right to appeal.

Hotpotatofood - Your position on the waiting list is determined entirely by the school's admission criteria. Nothing else will affect your position. Childcare and transport issues will not give your child priority. Medical/social needs only count if the school has that as an admission category and the needs usually have to be very serious to get into that category.

Hotpotatofood Tue 23-Apr-13 22:36:33

the school mentions pastoral/social/medical needs. I am sure my situation is unique but not sure how to describe it to bring out that ds will have fulfilled pastoral needs.

clam Tue 23-Apr-13 22:50:35

Social needs would mean something along the lines of, say, a police officer's children not being able to attend the same school as the offspring of an offender s/he'd arrested and given evidence against, for instance. Medical needs might be that a wheelchair user needed to be in a school with stairlifts.
Not sure about pastoral, but I sincerely doubt that a 4 year old tooting the recorder would hack it.

TheDoctrineOfSnatch Tue 23-Apr-13 22:50:49

Thanks prh smile

Does the school indicate what kinds of things it counts as pastoral needs? I would have thought it would be the kind of things meditrina mentions. Working hours, childcare difficulties and frail parents are sufficiently common to not be exceptions.

By the way, do you know if this school is actually full? If not, they will start to admit from the waiting list and you may get in anyway if you are high up on the standard criteria eg distance. Have you put your name on the list already? Do you know when your LA will give you an idea of position on the list?

Hotpotatofood Tue 23-Apr-13 22:58:10

the school says about social/medical/pastoral or OTHER needs of children. I wonder what I could put to persuade the admissions? this is catholic school. there is a waiting list already...

TheDoctrineOfSnatch Tue 23-Apr-13 23:03:18

Are you too far away from the school to have any chance on a distance basis (I assume you pass the faith criteria)?

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