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Join our Primary Education forum to discuss starting school and helping your child get the most out of it.

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Join our Primary Education forum to discuss starting school and helping your child get the most out of it.

Primary education

Reception maths question

27 replies

Llareggub · 15/12/2011 17:10

My DS is 5 and pretty into numbers. He nags me constantly to do sums for him and we do a little bit of adding, subtracting and division every evening using the doodle app on my iPad. I stress that this is completely led by him; I'd rather read a book. He can tell the time so long as it is quarter past, half past or o'clock and has known shapes for what seems like forever. I know none of this is out of the ordinary, but I present it as background. He can do some of these sums in his head, such as dividing 8 sweets between 2 children, for example.

Anyway. I've just opened his report from his first term and his maths target is to practice counting objects, and it is suggested that I get to count 1p and 2p pieces at home to help with this. As an experiment I gave him the connect 4 counters and he counted them up to 40 before he ran out of counters.

His reading and writing targets seem fair enough. I'm really bothered about the maths targets because I feel like they haven't got to know him at all. I told his teacher at the parents evening how into sums he is, and she said that she would look at that with him this term.

How should how tackle this? Should I? He is a very active boy and we were told that he spends a lot of time outdoors at school, building things and often comes home covered in mud. . I am pleased about this.

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Eggrules · 15/12/2011 17:16

Can he count using the values on the coins? My DS (5), can do the same as yours with numbers but really struggles with coins and giving change type sums.

Llareggub · 15/12/2011 17:21

He can count in 2s, and asked me to count in 5s for him yesterday. I'm not sure if he knows the value of the coins by sight. I hadn't thought of that being the point of the target, perhaps I've assumed it was about counting objects because his teacher has suggested that I assist with the target by playing simple counting games using coins.

I will get him to have a go next time he fancies doing some more number games.

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WowOoo · 15/12/2011 17:30

I think that's pretty impressive for a 5 year old. I'm surprised that no-one has noticed it actually.

Ds1 is in yr 1 and I knopw they've been doing a lot of counting and adding with money. He was clueless and thought that lots of 2ps were worth more than £1. (not suggesting your ds is clueless in this area but I do know concept of money and value can be tricky)

So, it may just be that they haven't done the kind of work that your ds clearly excels at yet. And that they are targets rather than what he has achieved so far.
Could you do lots of playing shop?
If I were you I'd have a chat at start of next term. Just to be sure that you know what they think he can do.

Moomoomie · 15/12/2011 17:44

Does he know his number bonds to 10, 20. 50.
I know at our school they concentrate on the number bonds to start with.

Eggrules · 15/12/2011 17:49

I think that counting and adding with money is a target for children older than reception. I was advised by my DS's teacher to introduce the concept rather than expecting him to be able to handle money. Counting games with coins or playing shop will help with this. My DS can't count in 2s or 5s but can count in 10s.

One target for my son was to remove a certain number of items from a pile of objects and stop. He did this no problem and I am not quite sure what this was testing. Sometimes DC demonstrate different things in school than they do with ease at home. The playground beckons .

At the start of the school year they tested 2D shape knowledge. Thanks to Disney Playhouse, my DS knows 3D shapes- this wasn't tested at the time.

He sounds like he is doing well.

Llareggub · 15/12/2011 18:02

Well, a few minutes with a pile of coins has est
established that he can do this with ease and can count 3,5,7,9 and so on. He is now playing shop with anything he can find.

I must confess to not knowing what number bonds are. I went to school in the 80s and learned nothing useful. Phonics scare me and I can't do long multiplication. I need a dummies guide to primary maths.

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sittinginthesun · 15/12/2011 18:06

I found it hard to work out how DS1 was getting on with maths in Reception too. Reading is easy, because they bring books home, but the only comment I had from the teacher all year was, "DS1 likes the end of the week best, because that is when we do more number work." I had no idea whether he was actually learning any maths at school.

I would say, carry on as you are, and it will sort itself out in Year 1 when it becomes more structured. DS1 is Year 3 now, and really into his maths - he was put in the top group straight away in Year 1.

I'm sure the teachers on here will clarify, but it does seem that a lot more goes on in Reception than first appears.

WowOoo · 15/12/2011 18:08

Number bonds are just 9 and 1, 8 and 2, 7 and 3. number bonds to 10 that is.

Eggrules · 15/12/2011 18:12

I've never heard of number bonds either.

My DS can recognise the value of the coin but can't give change from a simple sum - unless in pennies .

Llareggub · 15/12/2011 18:14

Thank you for explaining, that makes sense now about number bonds. Are a children expected to learn these like we did times tables?

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WowOoo · 15/12/2011 18:15

If you google you can find out what's covered in yr 1 maths.
Number bonds are useful because when you know that 5+5 is 10, you know 50 + 50 is 100 and so on.
Ds yr 1 is getting there.

You really don't have to worry about long division....... YET. Argh!!!!

sittinginthesun · 15/12/2011 18:23

Honestly, it's changed so much since we were at school. Our school have regular sessions for parents to show them the basics - I frequently look at DS's homework and don't have a clue!

I found it best to stretch DS1 by playing games (he is teaching his younger brother chess as I type).

WowOoo · 15/12/2011 18:24

Yes, they learn them at our school before times tables.

Phonics aren't scary. Once you see what it is, it will make sense to you. Loads of links that the lovely mrz has done in the past.

Llareggub · 15/12/2011 19:08

It isn't so much the phonics but the phenomes and the dipthingmajigs. I find it difficult to believe that I was actually allowed the graduate sometimes.

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Llareggub · 15/12/2011 19:08

Sitting, I have taught him chess and he loves it.

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KATTT · 15/12/2011 21:17

Place value is a really good thing to teach at home. So a '1' in the tens column doesn't mean 1 it means ten. Get straws and make bundles of tens with them, then demonstrate that one bundle can mean ten.

With this leap they can scale tall buildings - and do two digit sums!

Llareggub · 15/12/2011 22:14

I will have a go at that, but I think that is something he has grasped. It is weird (to me, anyway) but he is just really into numbers, wanting to know what the last number in the world is and what comes before 0.

He has has lots of fun stealing 1p and 2p pieces from us all night, and has amassed a number of small objects that he has "bought" from us. I might have a word with his teacher tomorrow just to check my understanding of this target, just in case she thinks he can't count objects.

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jamdonut · 15/12/2011 22:26

Its a funny thing... I've noticed children who struggle with ordinary sums/maths often seem to be good with counting money and knowing the different coins. It is often the more "streetwise" kids that know the values of the coins, and the "more able" children who struggle with money. Some children just never seem to handle money at all and have no idea about it. So I would say counting coins is a very good idea...tip out your purse and see what they can do ! You can use coins for number bonds,repeated addition,doubling,halving,"groups of",place value...all sorts.

Joyn · 15/12/2011 22:38

Number bonds are deemed very important! It's not just 8+2=10, but also 10-2=8 etc. It's the same way they learn multiplication/division facts later (yr3/4). I would say they have realised your ds is good at maths, as his target is quite high for this stage of foundation.

Eggrules · 15/12/2011 22:45

I think speaking to the Teacher is a great idea.

Llareggub · 15/12/2011 23:34

Thank you all for your help and suggestions. He is more than happy in reception and I certainly don't want to overdo it with him.

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sashh · 16/12/2011 04:26

Llareggub

If he wants to know what is before 0 then get him a thermometer and to monitor the weather - it's the ideal time of year for minus numbers. You could do temperature charts with him. Linking numbers to real life things is important and temperature is a great introduction to science. Depending on how far you want to go you could have him looking at leaves on trees, bulbs comming up in the spring etc. Not saying push him, just do as much or as little as he is happy with

Sorry I teach teenagers, they sometimes have problems linking nubers to anything 'real'

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Llareggub · 16/12/2011 07:40

Ooooh, he'd love that! Thak you sssh.

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RiversideMum · 16/12/2011 07:44

He can probably do this, but counting a given number out of a set is more challenging than counting all of a set. So with your C4 counters, you could ask him to give you 15 or 24 or whatever. The developmental sequence for + and - is to count the total (eg 2 there 4 there, altogether 1 2 3 4 5 6) and then to move onto counting on (eg 6 + 2 - I have 6 and put it in my head and only need to add 2 - 6 7 8). Then like others have said, the big gap you notice in Y1 is children who have never handled money, weights and measures and time. So they are good ones to work at at home.

Eggrules · 16/12/2011 10:17

Thanks RiversideMum

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