Really struggling

[flingo]

We tried potty training DD when she was 2.4 and we kept going with it even though she was struggling. I really regret that now.

She started withholding poo and got very badly constipated and we put her on movicol and back in nappies which seemed to resolve things somewhat. We waited until she was going quite regularly and, whilst still on Movicol, there didn't seem to be any issues with withholding.

When she was 3.2 we very gently reintroduced the potty and she was quite keen. We took her lead completely and were relaxed about whether she wore nappies or not and she has very quickly taken to using the big toilet for wees.
But she has started to withhold poos again and whatever I do she witholds uncomfortably all day and then goes in her nappy after her bath.

I just don't know what to do. Withholding seems to make her uncomfortable and she whimpers a bit when she's trying not to go. But the movicol makes her less able to hold and so she's having a lot of little accidents all day.

I'm really stressed. I don't care if she's in nappies or not at this stage I just want her to be comfortable and to have normal bodily functions. I can't convince her to poo in the loo but I don't want to force her back into nappies if she wants to be out of them. Has anyone got any advice?

[NuffSaidSam]

Can you just give her a nappy when she needs a poo?

So she wears pants, but asks for a nappy when she needs to go and you can put one on just for her to poo in. If you get pull ups, you can leave them by the potty/loo so she can put one on herself if she needs a poo.

[NuffSaidSam]

Or, as a midway option, put a nappy in the potty so she's on the potty, but there is a nappy there too.

[flingo]

She refuses a nappy though - I'd be more than happy for her to go in nappy but she doesn't want to wear one. I might try and make it less optional ie wear a nappy or use the loo but neither not an option. The other problem is that as she's constantly engaged in trying to hold the poo in - she's never trying to poo.

[flingo]

Also refuses potty but happy on toilet with special seat and steps

[NuffSaidSam]

How good is her speech/understanding?

If your explain that she doesn't need to wear the nappy, just poo in it and then take it off will she understand?

What does she say when you explain that she has too poo? Can she tell you what her issue is with pooing?

[KingSheathBelle]

Could she spend some time with children who are slightly older, then she might want to be like them, is she in nursery/ pre school?

Or bribery, I bribed DD with a special toy?

[Pantheon]

My friend's ds had a similar problem and they found an app called poo goes home to pooland helpful. Might be worth a try.

[JPlusTwo]

No new advice but just wanted to reassure you you’re not the only one. My son has been on Movicol since 18 months and is 5 and still goes through a horrible cycle of withholding, lots of accidents, the odd ‘normal poo’ every 5 days or so and then back to square one. He used a nappy for pooing until just before his 4th birthday (like your daughter, he’d wait for the night time nappy and go in that once a day), now happy to use potty/toilet but only after we let him take the lead on that and stopped obsessing over it (easier said than done with the constant accidents!)
It’s exhausting and frustrating and I have cried over it (many times!) but the only thing I can say is just to keep up with the Movicol and let her go at her pace (and use pads/liners in pants - god knows how many pairs I chucked away before doing this )
We’ve just had a referral through for the bladder and bowel clinic, not expecting miracles but feels good to be in reach of some help as GP’s haven’t been able to help a huge amount over the years

[flingo]

Jplus thank you for your kind words. It's so stressful and tough going. The other awkward thing is that she doesn't want to wear pants and says they are 'scary' so the little poo accidents are getting everywhere.

One thing I was wondering is about dosage of movicol. I've been so worried about constipation that I've been doing 2 sachets one day and then 1 the next. She's pretty slight and light. I wonder if giving her just 1 a day would settle things down.

[JPlusTwo]

@flingo I would say 1 is plenty, a consistent daily dose will likely help her body form regular habits. My son was on half a sachet a day for the last year as he got into a good routine but going away from home at Christmas set him back and we increased it back up to one sachet. I do notice a few more accidents but I think it helps him to have the ‘clear out’ poo once every few days!
You are doing great, just hang on in there and try to let her take the lead where possible. When you can, take her to the shops (even the supermarket if it’s all lockdown allows) and let her pick her own pants in whatever colour she’d like, it may help her to feel more comfortable and in control x

[flingo]

If you don't mind my asking how did you eventually get a referral? My GP says there's no point and nothing they can do so so I'm not sure if I can pursue it. I've put her back in nappies whilst I try and calm everything down - I don't think she can toilet train when withholding / over dosing on movicol. She did about 7 poos yesterday which is obviously far too much.

[UnaOfStormhold]

Try the ERIC website and,if it's working, the helpline.

[JPlusTwo]

Good idea to go back into nappies for now, it’s easier to transition to pants once you have a good ‘poo routine’ with the movicol and perhaps aim for set toilet times, they recommend asking them to try on the potty after breakfast/dinner etc!

I just kept going to the GP, we’ve probably been 7/8 times in the last few years. The referral was requested in May last year but it was only after speaking to another really helpful doctor on the phone a few weeks ago that I then got a letter through from the bladder and bowel people, perhaps they won’t do anything until they’re over a certain age but no one said anything inbetween GP visits of that nature. I just think the doctor who I saw on that particular day last May didn’t action it properly and it wasn’t picked up. I don’t know they will be able to do anything if there’s nothing ‘wrong’ with him but I find it hard to believe there’s no more support out there, after GP’s prescribe movicol it feels like there’s nothing else they can do!