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Can't believe English Democrats broadcast!

(50 Posts)
ihatehousework2 Mon 12-May-14 19:09:13

I have just seen this on BBC 1. I think all parties have a right to broadcast but I would ask they put forward a reasonable amount of election policies in their broadcast before they air it! I felt it was just a bit condescending to 'Joe public' because it was a bit basic. Anyone else agree?

claig Mon 12-May-14 22:01:06

Agree with you. Watched it on BBC iplayer, it was very basic.

thegambler Mon 12-May-14 22:20:03

Was it not a a parody ? Loved the Land of St George reference at the end given that they wouldn't have let him in.

ihatehousework2 Mon 12-May-14 22:48:49

Oh yeah, legend says he was part Turkish? Good point!

claig Mon 12-May-14 22:56:51

He wasn't Turkish. The Turks were not in what is now called Turkey at that time. They arrived later on.

ihatehousework2 Tue 13-May-14 07:57:51

claig oh heck..... Best get onto to Jack Straw! Lol.

"St George the Turkish Arab
Today is St George's Day, but many other countries and cities also have this early Christian as a patron saint.

Jack Straw, Monday 23 April 2007 12.15 BST
He was born in Turkey; his mother was Palestinian. He's so multicultural we have to share him with Lithuania, Portugal, Germany, Greece, Georgia, Moscow, Istanbul, Beirut - and Palestine itself. If he ever came to England, it wasn't for long. Welcome to the world of Saint George, patron saint of England, whom we celebrate today, April 23 - the same day, by astonishing coincidence, that we celebrate the birth of the giant of English literature, William Shakespeare."

ballsballsballs Tue 13-May-14 08:15:27

I cracked up when the song mentioned Adrian's wall.

claig Tue 13-May-14 09:02:08

ihatehousework2, the Guardian title of Jack Straw's article gives the wrong impression. It seems to imply that Saint George was Turkish, and he was not.

Look at wikipedia

"Saint George (Greek: Γεώργιος (Georgios), Classical Syriac: ܓܝܘܪܓܝܣ (Giwargis), Latin: Georgius; c. 275/281 – 23 April 303 AD), born in Lydda, Roman Palestine, was a soldier in the Roman army and was later venerated as a Christian martyr. His father was Gerontius, a Greek Christian from Cappadocia, and an official in the Roman army. His mother, Polychronia was a Christian from Roman Palestine.[3] Saint George became an officer in the Roman army in the Guard of Diocletian. In hagiography, Saint George is one of the most venerated saints in the Catholic (Western and Eastern Rites), Anglican, Eastern Orthodox, and the Oriental Orthodox churches. He is immortalized in the tale of Saint George and the Dragon and is one of the Fourteen Holy Helpers. His memorial is celebrated on 23 April (May 06), and he is regarded as one of the most prominent military saints."

And from wikipedia aboutTurkey and when the Turks migrated to the Turkey, much later than when St George lived.

"The Seljuk Turks began migrating into the area in the 11th century, starting the process of Turkification, which was greatly accelerated by the Seljuk victory over the Byzantines at the Battle of Manzikert in 1071.[16] The Seljuk Sultanate of Rûm ruled Anatolia until the Mongol invasion in 1243, upon which it disintegrated into several small Turkish beyliks.

Starting from the late 13th century, the Ottoman beylik united Anatolia and created an empire encompassing much of Southeastern Europe, Western Asia and North Africa, becoming a major power in Eurasia and Africa during the early modern period. After the Ottoman Empire collapsed following its defeat in World War I, parts of it were occupied by the victorious Allies. The Turkish War of Independence, initiated by Mustafa Kemal Atatürk and his colleagues, resulted in the establishment of the modern Republic of Turkey in 1923, with Atatürk as its first president."

claig Tue 13-May-14 09:12:35

There are political reasons why we are spun and are nearly always given a false impression about Saint George and why most of the public are not made aware of the truth, but later on in the Wikipedia article, the truth is spelt out in clearer detail

"It is likely that Saint George was born to a Greek Christian noble family in Lydda in Palestine, during the late third century between about 275 AD and 285 AD. He died in the Greek city of Nicomedia in Asia Minor. His father, Gerontios, was a Greek from Cappadocia, an officer in the Roman army; and his mother, Polychronia, was a Greek native of Lydda. They were both Christians from noble families of the Anici, so their child was raised with Christian beliefs. They decided to call him Georgios (Greek), meaning "worker of the land" (i.e., farmer). At the age of fourteen, George lost his father; a few years later, George's mother, Polychronia, died.[12][13][14][15] Eastern accounts give the names of his parents as Anastasius and Theobaste."

Isitmebut Tue 13-May-14 10:08:37

Claig .... a right wing party with no policies huh, I can't think what is worse, other than promising something that you cannot deliver. Nudge, nudge, wink, wink.

Re England's patron St. George...I fear where you are going with this .... if he gets the most votes in the EU elections ..... will you then state that 'the people' want by popular demand, to change our patron saint to .............St. Nigel (of Farage)?lol

claig Tue 13-May-14 10:16:27

'will you then state that 'the people' want by popular demand, to change our patron saint to .............St. Nigel (of Farage)?'

No, the people just want a world statesman like Nigel to be our Prime Minister. There is only one George who comes close to Saint George, and that is Prince George.

ballsballsballs Tue 13-May-14 10:43:04

World statesman?

None of this shower, frankly, have the stature to be 'world statesman', and that includes Farage.

claig Tue 13-May-14 10:53:41

ballsballsballs, have you forgotten when Farage said "the EU has blood on its hands" over Ukraine? The shower would never have been allowed to say such a thing. Farage is different class, he is no ass, he refuses to participate in the farce.

Isitmebut Tue 13-May-14 10:55:17

Claig ... Hmmmm "world statesmen".....I clearly got the level of 'hero-worship' spot on, but saint was a either pedestal too far (even for you), or you are s-l-o-w-l-y coming to realize that when your hero is still banging on about Ukip bringing the UK out of the EU - when they 100% can not - he is not only lumped in with every other politician you despise, with a 100% non delivery score-on-the-door, he is actually worse.

ballsballsballs Tue 13-May-14 11:15:52

Claig, even a stopped clock is right twice a day. And it's easy to make pronouncements when there are no policies other than 'get out of the EU'.

Farage, while nobly refusing to take part in the 'farce' of the EU, is more than happy to take its dollar. If his party get more EU seats we'll have less influence than we have now, as his MEPs don't take part in debates.

claig Tue 13-May-14 11:21:51

'even a stopped clock is right twice a day'

Then why is Cleggy never right?

'If his party get more EU seats we'll have less influence than we have now, as his MEPs don't take part in debates.'

No, we will have begun the journey of getting out and regaining our sovereignty. The shower will scream and holler but the people think Farage is top dollar, and deserves every penny he gets!

claig Tue 13-May-14 11:28:56

Some recent headlines from the Daily Mail. The shower won't mention these things. They can't. Some of them are almost jobsworths. Farage is no jobsworth, and that is why every penny he is paid, he is worth.

'EU to bug every car in UK with tracker chips – and Ministers admit they are powerless to stop the Big Brother technology'

'The medical experts who refuse to use low-energy lightbulbs in their homes: Professors have stocked up on old-style bulbs to protect against skin cancer and blindness'


"Dermatologist Professor Hawk acknowledges the efforts to improve the bulbs by providing clouded glass domes.

'But we are not sure how improved they are,' he says.

He has been trying to lobby the EU to lift its ban on incandescent bulbs.

'I have talked to the committee on light safety in Brussels about these concerns, but no one there seems to be interested in this,' he says.

'The EU was trying to be green by introducing CFLs, but they did not think of the health consequences. They are very reluctant to reverse its policies.'

claig Tue 13-May-14 11:35:45

'Ministers admit they are powerless to stop the Big Brother technology'

And that, sadly, is not the onlything they are powerless to stop.

That is why people are turning to Farage and UKIP and away from the shower.

There is a choice between the "party of in", "the party of spin", the shower and the party that wants the people to win.

Cometh the hour, where is the shower?

Isitmebut Tue 13-May-14 11:36:04

Claig … re your Farage quote “the EU has blood on it’s hands”; I will agree with you that Farage is outspoken, which clearly resonates with the masses, but how does having a big Ukip gob help British interests within the EU if the majority of our regional MEP’s are both moulded from Farage and tarred with the same brush?

As I have explained in the link below, without a Conservative majority in 2015, the UK WILL STAY IN THE EU for many years to come, so we no longer need gobby yobs representing us on £78k a year, £3,500 a month ‘allowances’ paid into Farages pocket whether he claims it or not, plus other office expenses – we need MEP’s from the mainstream parties who WORK for our interests.

If people want to ‘protest’ against Labour and the Conservatives for one reason or another, do what you used to do, vote for a Lib Dem MEP, who at least WANT to be in Brussels and have a record of working for our interests.

BTW Claig, you forgot to mention the rest of Farage’s comments on the Ukraine (and Syria), where he shows admiration for Russia’s Putin.

UK ‘statesman’ sucking up to Russia is not new, the UK had Blair and his ‘sofa cabinet’ with Mandelson promoting their interests and the olag…oleg…olygar….those multi-billion Russians.

P.S. re that Daily Mail article, was your point Farage DID something about it, or was he still posturing out there in England trying to get MEP votes on a false premise, with his main object, Ukip seats in Westminster?????

Isitmebut Tue 13-May-14 11:48:04

Claig ....aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaargh...there you go AGAIN, accussing all other political parties of "spin", but as there is NO WAY on Farage's green earth that UKip can bring the UK out of the EU............ what do you call Ukip campaigning on a 100% lie, IF NOT A SPUN LIE????

claig Tue 13-May-14 11:48:38

'I will agree with you that Farage is outspoken'

Farage is no puppet. He tells Van Rompuy what he thinks. He tells the people what he thinks. He is not afraid of the bureaucrats and bigwigs and the great and the good. He is not like the some of the shower.

Farage wants to take us out of the EU so that we can help ourselves and make our own laws instead of being "powerless to stop Big Brother technology" and all the other things the Brusels bureaucrats and elites want to impose on us and have rubberstamped by some of the shower.

'vote for a Lib Dem MEP, who at least WANT to be in Brussels and have a record of working for our interests.'

I knew you liked making jokes, but that one beats the great Jonathan Swift for sarcastic wit.

'UK ‘statesman’ sucking up to Russia is not new'

It is not new, but it is not something that Farage would do. Sucking up is not part of his DNA. He is different to some of the shower. He believes in "straight talking" as is sometimes stated on UKIP posters.

claig Tue 13-May-14 11:53:30

"but as there is NO WAY on Farage's green earth that UKip can bring the UK out of the EU"

You have fallen for what the spinners and some of the shower say and spray. They say there is no hope, that nothing can be done, that we have "passed the tipping point", that we are all doomed.

But the public don't believe it. They will turn out to vote because they still have hope and they believe that where there is a Farage, there is a way.

We're not done, we've only begun and we will confound the shower if the results show that we have won.

claig Tue 13-May-14 12:01:21

"Labour is failing to make up any ground on Ukip ahead of next week’s European elections. A new poll from Sky News and YouGov today says that Labour’s support has dropped to 25 per cent, while Ukip remain comfortably in first place with 31 per cent of the vote "

The people aren't stupid. The shower thought they were. The people can't all be wrong.

Isitmebut Tue 13-May-14 12:06:23

So "Farage wants to take us out of the EU" excuses his lying to the British public about what a vote for Ukip can achieve to that end?

How is promising something you KNOW you cannot deliver, "straight Farage talking?"

The 'art of politics' uses political methods to get things done; it might take time, but opening your mouth in a provocative way to get votes, achieves nothing tangible, but can get in the way of progress behind the scenes by good will of all parties, if the change at least makes common sense.

In conclusion; a vote for Ukip on the 22nd and in 2015 will NOT change policies within the EU, it will NOT bring the UK out of the EU but can STOP the UK from getting a referendum in 2017 - so much for the United Kingdom Independence Party and Farage's motives for his party 'to do what it sez on the can'.

ironmaiden999 Tue 13-May-14 12:10:57

Claig. I thought St. George was a Palestinian? Am I wrong?

I loved the song by the English Democrats, I agree the broadcast was basic, and to the point grin

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