insulting religions

[IneedAgoldenNickname]

Hi, I've never posted on this topic before, I tend to hang out in aibu, but don't want to start a bun fight!

So, I am a liberal Christian. I firmly believe that everyone had to right to believe (or not) whatever they want, provided that belief doesn't hurt anyone else.

Earlier today I posted a lighthearted status on Facebook, which had led to me being called mindless, stupid, stuck up, thinking I'm better than everyone else. I've been told God is a c**t (sorry I hate that word so much I won't type it) and that the Bible is only God for loo roll!

I'm just really angry that people think its ok to insult me/my religion like that, when I haven't once preached or insulted others.

Obviously the easy solution would be to delete them off of Facebook, but they are people I get on with other wise.

Don't really know the point of my post, just hoping id feel better writing it down.

[Tuo]

I'm sorry you've been so hurt, GoldenNickname. Whatever you wrote (unless it was, in its turn, offensive - which it doesn't sound as if it was), you don't deserve to be on the receiving end of such insults... whether they are directed at you personally or at your beliefs.

There's probably no easy way to deal with this, though, other than to quietly delete the thread without comment, and then stay away from FB for a few days/weeks/as long as you can manage, until you feel 'safer' again.

Oh, and remember the Beatitudes: 'Blessed are you when people abuse you and persecute you and speak all kinds of calumny against you on my account'!

[deleted203]

Completely unnecessary and deeply unpleasant Bunny. I'm not a particular believer in any religion, but I have the manners and the courtesy not to be foul mouthed towards people who are. Like the OP I tend towards believing that people have the right to believe in whatever faith they choose. I think your last statement could be directed at yourself, personally. Insulting other people's religious beliefs simply labels you as narrow minded, prejudiced and bigoted as any religious fanatic, rather than convincing yourself you are some kind of intellectual.

[IneedAgoldenNickname]

Thanks tuo. I was thinking id delete the thread, I deleted some of the more insulting comments, although that led to more insults!

I didn't say anything remotely offensive, I even agreed with some of the comments about the Bible not being 100% true (its failure to mention dinosaurs was bought up more times than I care to remember)

[Tuo]

Just delete the thread, Golden.

And this one too, if you're upset by it.

Bloody hell, Bunny. That was totally uncalled-for.

[IneedAgoldenNickname]

I will do :)

I'm not upset as such, as in I'm not crying, more amazed that in this day and age its seen as ok to be so rude!

I'm not bothered about this thread being here, I'm ignoring bunny's rude post, he/she is proof of the prejudice I am talking about!

Thanks again :)

[BunnyLebowski]

Why is there this prevailing notion that people who believe deserve exemption from questioning or judgement purely because they believe? In one of a selection of imaginary friends decided solely by the arbitrary geography of where they were born.

Why oh why would being so feeble-minded that you require to base your life on the assumed existence of a monotheistic deity allow you freedom from defending such a choice??

In less enlightened times it was almost understandable.

But now??! In 2013? When we have irrefutable scientific fact to help answer our questions about the universe and our origin, I just can't bring myself to respect a grown adult who still chooses to believe (and worse, forces their atheist at birth children to believe) in laughably contradictory fiction and superstition. And malevolent, corrupt, self-serving institutions which do infinitely more harm than good.

Respect is a privilege, not a right.

[LoopsInHoops]

Sorry, haven't had time to read the whole thread but I do find most religions insulting in some way or another. Sexism and histories of power and control, as well as the wealth often involved is very insulting, especially to those who believe in the deities but suffer from the 'moral' codes.

[colditz]

Referring to someone's chosen deity as something offensive is like showing up at someone's funeral with a sign saying "god hates gays!"

It's about as clever, about as kind, and about as original.

I am an atheist. The goal of my conversations with religious people is to never ever give them any reason to think that their religion has made them better than me, and this means I must behave at least as well as they do, or they ARE better than me.

[BunnyLebowski]

Assuming you referring to me colditz I guess I'm in the clear as rather than "referring to someone's chosen deity" I'm referring to all chosen deities.

The very fact that each little obedient group of believers/non-thinkers consider themselves the lucky few who have been selected to be puppeteered led by "one true god" while condemning other religions as wrong is an ironic punchline to the joke that is religion.

[FelicityWasSanta]

Blimey Bunny, your posts are so rude.

The OP was looking for some hand holding because people had been rude to her.

You rock up and basically say you deserve it because you're thick and deluded.

Which is a weak argument when lots of well known clever, intellectual types have faith of one variant or another.

[Cuddledup]

Golden Sorry to hear that your FB "friends" have been so offensive. I'm of a similar persuasion as you - live and let live. Re: FB I'd change your "friends" status so they can't see everything you post. Also you could reply to them individually saying you found their opinions offensive, so that they can see they overstepped the boundaries. They probably thought they were being "funny". IF a kid was rude you would tell them they'd overstepped the mark !

Sorry that Bunny has had to come here and be rude, Thank goodness for diversity.
Have a good FB-free day.

[colditz]

Amusing, bunny, that you thought I was talking about you. I really wasn't. I was talking about the offensive and childish people on golden's Facebook.

[thegreenheartofmanyroundabouts]

Like inneedofagoldennickname I have been shocked by the rudeness of the anti theists. There is a bit of wisdom that says 'by their fruits will you know them' and I've found this important when I meet people of faith and no faith. I have been blessed in meeting muslims, hindus, atheists, pagans, wiccans and those searching or indifferent to faith who are kind, generous and loving. We may not agree on faith but we can meet and share and value each other's viewpoints. I've also met Christians and people of other and no faith who are the opposite - judgemental, rude and unkind.

Fruits is a useful measure.

[IneedAgoldenNickname]

Good afternoon all, and thank you for your messages. I deleted the Facebook thread, and no one has mentioned it yet.

The people that have come on here and been rude are just proof of the prejudices I have seen elsewhere.

I have meet people of many religions, and of none. Some, regardless of belief, are lovely non judgemental people. Others are sadly the opposite.

Ibelieve (and indeed hope) that I fall into the first category. If I had posted something like 'God is great and if you don't believe him you will burn in hell' then nasty comments would be fair enough. As I didn't post anything like that (I don't even believe that) the comments were unfair and uncalled for.

I don't have a problem with my belief being questioned either, provided both people stay polite and civil. For example, one of the comments said if there was a God he is a c**t because he allowed 20 children to be shot a week before Christmas. Now had this merely questioned why this happened, if be fine with it. But calling God insulting words, followed by telling me I'm thick, deluded etc was unnecessary.

I just think people should live and let live, although there's no harm in a good religious debate

[LoopsInHoops]

What I don't understand about the 'God is a cunt' thing, is that presumably the people who say that believe there is a cunt?

[LoopsInHoops]

Oh God, a God, not a cunt! Sorry!

[HecatePropolos]

I don't see why it's necessary to upset people.

By being rude, sneering or insulting someone for their beliefs - you hurt them. And why is it necessary to do that? To think that someone deserves to be mocked because they believe something that you think is rubbish is horrible. What about basic common decency to fellow human beings?

fair enough, don't share their belief. Think it's a pile of crap. Whatever. but when someone sneers at someone else's faith, they're saying this person, as a human being, is not worth any sort of consideration or respect from me.

I just think that we are all worth some consideration and respect and there's no reason to choose words that may hurt someone, just because you don't share their beliefs.

And yes, it works both ways. Those who preach hatred in the name of god are equally vile.

I don't see why we can't all respect one another and our right to believe whatever we want.

If, for example, I want to believe that the world was sneezed out by a giant goat so what? Who am I hurting by the simple fact I believe that? If I want to believe in god - who am I hurting? If I want to believe that we're here by chance and when we die - poooof - who am I hurting?

OTOH. If I laugh, sneer and mock those who believe differently - I'm hurting quite a few!

[IneedAgoldenNickname]

I don't know loops I guess because he said 'if there is a God' he's not admitting here is one iyswim.

But in the large yea, how can you insult something you don't believe in

[KayHarker]

as someone who has gone from religious to not I understand the desire to mock. You see something patently unfair and ridiculous, and you want to speak out about it. But in my journey from theist to not, no one who ever mocked me helped me at all, they just make people defensive and cut out the very intellect they are trying to champion. But hey, I guess it feels superior so that's ok.

[sieglinde]

Golden, so sorry you've found the same stuff here. Take out The Science Delusion and give them the LOT.

That fine work confirms two things for me. 1. Many atheists are cram full of SHIT and know NOWT about science and b. they can dish it out but they absolutely can't take it.

And stand up for yourself. Currently, they can rely on us to duck our heads and say humbly that we want to be loving in response. Makes bullying an absolute sinecure for them, and like other bullies they also pretend that it's for our OWN GOOD; they just want to free us from being in any way different from them.

[hiddenhome]

I used to be an atheist. I never felt the need to condemn people for believing. It never tormented or frustrated me that others believed in God. Those who do condemn theists must have real issues because if they truly didn't believe, they wouldn't be so insulting and downright nasty

If you truly don't believe, then just ignore theists, just as I ignore people who wax lyrical about football or darts or anything else I'm not interested in. Condemning people just means you're rattled and it's usually a case of 'the lady does protesteth too much'

[niminypiminy]

Currently it's fashionable to be aggressively anti-religion, and the Internet is an ideal way to be as rude and aggressive as you like. Probably very few of the people who feel licensed to behave so vilely through the medium of a computer screen would be anything less than fairly polite in person. (Having said that I've had more than my fair share of arguments with steamed-up atheists - and they are always, always the ones who bring God up.)

When you've finished with The Science Delusion you could have a look at Atheist Delusions by David Bentley Hart, which takes apart all the currently circulating myths about the history of Christianity with laser-like precision and shows they are complete rubbish. You might also want to look at Francis Spufford's Unapologetic which does a brilliant job of showing why faith is more a more grown up response to life than atheism is.

As Sieglinde says, not arguing back fuels bullying behaviour.

[sieglinde]

YY to Unapologetic, and yyyy to Atheist Delusions, too. Further question for convinced atheists - if we really need your help, and you are really so keen to bring us out of the darkness, why are none of you bothering to refute these refutations of your own tin gods? Go on - you know you want to.

[IneedAgoldenNickname]

Thanks, I've heard of the science delusion, but not read it. I will look those books out, my vicar probably has copies I can borrow!

One of the people who was rude is my twat of an ex, I expect nothing less from him tbh, which is a shame as both our ds' believe. Incidentally, when we were together he agreed with my live and let live attitude, its only since we split that he's started being so offensive!