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University Students in Danger of New RAVE CAVE DRUG DEATH CLUB

(58 Posts)
julieleigh66 Sun 06-Oct-13 05:56:27

I'm a mother. I love my son. I want what's best for him. But I have to find the balance between leaving him to live his own life: have fun, take risks, make mistakes; and knowing when it's time to step in, stand up and speak out in fighting for his safety. Now is that time.

The Warehouse Project (WHP) is planning to take over Mayfield Depot in Manchester and turn it into the biggest rave cave in the world by Autumn 2014. My son has just started university in MCR and I'm worried sick over the serious risk this poses to his safety. Furthermore I feel obliged, indeed compelled, to do more than fight for my own son, but help mothers and fathers alike fight for their own children by informing them about things they may be unaware of and what they can do about it.

Disturbingly WHP haven't been overt about their plans, instead opting to veil their intentions behind an application by The Addy Consultancy. It is now known to be fact that it is intact WHP behind the application. That resolved let's detail the concerning problems this poses.

You may have heard about the recent tragedy and hospitalisations that have occurred at WHP this year and all at the evil hands of a lethal new drug epidemic. The problem I have is that this underground rave club is infamous throughout the nation's student population as the go to place for clandestine clubbing. This very club culture was born out of an underground scene specifically curated to allow for partying outside of society's rules and regulations - I'd even go as far as to say that WHP's entire brand is founded on the sub-culture of drug-taking and hard partying.

I'd be a fool to think this kind of problem could be eradicated entirely from every student's life, but I gravely fear that the vast expansion of WHP into Mayfield encourages this dangerous behaviour out of the realms of risky experimentation into the territory of mainstream partying - this petrifies me.

To be fair to the organisers, they invest an enormous amount of effort, time and money into making their event as safe as they can and have responded to the recent tragedy with resounding resolve, pulling out every stop to try their best to stop people falling foul to these devastating drugs. But this level of retaliation draws my attention to that age old idiom, there's no smoke without fire.

WHP are only having to fight so hard, harder than any other club, because it's their very rave, more than anywhere else, that attracts exactly the kind of dangers that need fighting. WHP is currently teetering on the very sharpest of knife edges and that's in a venue with a 5000 capacity, located outside of the city's tempting centre. Imagine the risks involved for our children if WHP were allowed to double their size at Mayfield Depot, providing the largest rave cave in the world right in the city centre and smack bang next to a major train station.

If that wasn't bad enough, there's a wave of new age drugs hurtling straight toward our children. One in which criminal chemists spend their days sneaking one step ahead of the law - tweaking a newly illegal drug to allow it to slip under the fence without a damn care in the world for the associated dangers. There are so many different drugs now, some masquerading as "legal highs", that it's more likely than ever before for young people to get into serious trouble.

Although not new, a nightmarish example of the black market's determination to skulk past the law on their road to immoral money comes in the fatal form of PMA. Due to a crack down on the chemicals required to make MDMA (Ecstasy), devilish dealers have turned to more available substances and the result is the aforementioned and significantly more dangerous drug, PMA.

In the last 10 months this horrific chemical has been connected to 7 deaths in the North West, with a further 4 connected to some derivation of Ecstasy and the latest at WHP to "bad" Ecstasy. This problem needs managing and fast. My firm and insatiable opinion is that WHP's Mayfield will simply bare a breeding ground for this unpredictable, savage and unforgiving gang of drugs.

I'm not suggesting we simply shut down WHP and other clubs like it and be done with the matter. I want my son to make memories with his new friends, but I want them to be good memories and most of all I want him to be here to long enough for them to be memories.

The solution to me is simple, the growth of WHP needs to be curbed with a measure of responsibility, ethics and morality. I'd like to say that they'll do that themselves by u-turning on their decision to move into Mayfield, especially given the laudable stand point they've vehemently adopted in the media recently. However I fear the seductive lure of capitalism may be too tempting for them to resist. That's where we come in, the parents of the students who'll be most at risk if this is allowed to happen. We really can make a difference.

By making a formal objection to Manchester City Councillor's Licensing Committee our voices will be heard, a difference will be made and we can sleep at night knowing we fought for our children when it mattered most.

Please feel free to discuss any and all matters in this thread, I'll be more than happy to answer questions, quell concerns and get into a good old bit of debating.

Please make objections by: 14th OCTOBER 2013

When detailing your objection please consider:
1) Is it going to be a safe environment for staff, customers and the public?
2) Does it add to rather than detract from its environment?
3) Have the organisations behind the application established a dialogue with the local population?

If you feel like find out more, please visit my Facebook page:

garlicvampire Sun 06-Oct-13 15:32:48

I don't see how stopping a club opening will resolve the drug problem hmm

WHP seem to take their responsibilities seriously.

MrsCakesPremonition Sun 06-Oct-13 15:36:39

We can't protect our children from every danger, mostly all we can do is educate them about the risks and hope they learn to look after themselves.

WhereIsBethanyBear Sun 06-Oct-13 15:39:23

You write really well, but I don't object to the club. sounds fun

SaskiaRembrandtVampireHunter Sun 06-Oct-13 15:50:54

You do put your case very well, but this this club isn't really going to make any difference to the problem of drugs. If someone wants to take them, they will. As MrsCakes says, all we can do is educate our children about the risks. And really, by organising a campaign against this club all you will do is make it more appealing when/if it eventually does open.

mumeeee Sun 06-Oct-13 17:29:40

I agree with other posters. We can't protect our children from everything they have to grow up and make their own way in the big wide world. We as parents should just educate them on the danger of drugs and other stuff and then step back. DH and I have done that with all 3 of our DDs and are confident they Know all the dangers and havent taken drugs. DD3 has just started uni and she doesnt even drink very much, She told me herself she always watches her drinks and that you should never accept drugs or anything that you're not sure what it is from anybody. I do still worry about it though,

Madratlady Sun 06-Oct-13 17:44:20

Going to a club and choosing to take drugs are completely separate issues. People take drugs without going to clubs and go to clubs without taking drugs.

UptheChimney Sun 06-Oct-13 19:24:27

If you've raised your children sensibly, then they will be able to make sensible decisions. They will make mistakes: we all do -- it's how we learn. What mistakes did you make at age 18?

And just when do you think you might let go of your son?

julieleigh66 Sun 06-Oct-13 19:25:51

Thanks everyone for your comments, sincerely appreciated.

I'm not sure it's as simple as "If someone wants to take them, they will." Whilst there are indeed those who are dead set on taking drugs and will do so come hell or high water, there are others who sit securely on the fence. They're often the ones who are tipped one way or the other based on circumstantial pressures that can and should be managed by those who are responsible to do so. Whether you're pro decriminalisation or for a greater legal crack down, this very principal is at play - change the circumstance, the environment, the rules and risks will be reduced by targeting forces other than the will or curiosity to take drugs. I'm not proposing that WHP be wiped off the face of the planet, more that they're excessive expansion be stemmed until there is better understanding and management of the situation.

In regard of education I couldn't agree more. At the end of the day this is the time when we're letting go of our DSs and DDs as they make the transition from child to adult - education is the golden key in empowering them to be autonomous, fully fledged young people. That said, I've had many a worrying argument with my DS, whose a bright lad, about the relative "safety" of certain drugs. We've no doubt seen many an article in the media which reveals substances like MDMA to be much less harmful than was initially thought - whether that be in the form of bold statements like MDMA is "no more dangerous than horse riding" or whether that be a growing number of studies into the therapeutic value of MDMA (most recently exposed in the Channel 4 programme, Drugs Live: The Ecstasy Trial).

Broadly speaking I don't doubt the scientific fortitude of such studies, however I am concerned how this information can be misused or misinterpreted in the context of a massively proliferated rave drug culture. We can empower our DSs and DDs with a whole arsenal of education, but we as fully blown adults know all too well how confusing and tricksy the real world can be, especially in situations of special intensity and emotional extremity. With such a harmful and varied concoction of drugs out there, all mingling incognito with those substances that might be less harmful, the power of education can become a double edged sword. It seems to me all too easy for a bright young thing to be seduced into giving something a try by the phenomenal and unbridled atmosphere of the worlds biggest rave cave and assured by their own "education" that they've got the "good stuff" and that they'll "be safe".

This is a scenario that simply wouldn't exist if WHP's excessive expansion was under control. Educate our children, yes, but only on matters we know about. The adults and authorities who manage WHP are faltering at the hands of their lack of knowledge regarding the rapidly changing underground club scene. Officials in New York had to cancel the last day of the Electronic Zoo Festival due to Ecstasy related deaths and their admittance that they didn't have enough control of the situation to carry on. How can we educate our children if the experts don't even know what's round the next corner, never mind what will happen if WHP doubles in size.

The growth of WHP is motivated by money and is not in proportion to knowledge acquired or with respect to the safety of our children. We wouldn't accept a move in government to decriminalise drugs if we didn't feel people's safety was inextricably linked to the change, no matter how much we felt we could educate our children. Why then stand by whilst the forces of megalomania create an environment that posses exceptional and veiled dangers for our children.

I believe there must be a balance between educating our children so they can build a future for themselves and us curating the world we leave for them so they have the best chance of becoming the people they want to be.

UptheChimney Sun 06-Oct-13 19:51:02

As an historian, I find what you're writing here as if "this has not happened like this before" to be very familiar to me, from ... oh, the eighteenth century? It's a moral panic, and no different from the moral panic when gin first hit the scene three hundred years ago (yes, it was a new drug set to ENSLAVE our youth back in 1700 & something).

You are mistaking the symptom for the cause.

Flicktheswitch Sun 06-Oct-13 19:55:28

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

garlicvampire Sun 06-Oct-13 20:05:44

You do seem to be demonising one particular business instead of being responsibly informed about the drugs you fear.

MDMA isn't all that dangerous, and harm-reduction measures regarding Ecstasy are quite sophisticated compared to those for other drugs. Please read this:

In the UK, there are nearly 200 deaths a year from alcohol poisoning. There are between 10 and 20 from MDMA.

SunshineSuperNova Sun 06-Oct-13 20:13:10

OP a lot of people go to raves and other events and don't do drugs. The vast, vast majority of people have a great time and come to no harm whatsoever.

UptheChimney Sun 06-Oct-13 20:14:42

The OP and subsequent posts read like a spammer to me.

UptheChimney Sun 06-Oct-13 20:15:29

PS I'd love to know how to "curate" my world. It would make my life sooooooo much easier.

SunshineSuperNova Sun 06-Oct-13 20:39:54

Me too. I've reported.

Panzee Sun 06-Oct-13 20:47:20

RAVE CAVE DRUG DEATH CLUB sounds like a blast. Oh to be 18 again.

ubik Sun 06-Oct-13 20:49:54

God I would love a Rave Cave Drug Death Club

UptheChimney Sun 06-Oct-13 20:51:51

I want to go to one RIGHT NOW!! instead of finishing this flipping journal article

ubik Sun 06-Oct-13 20:53:08

<hunts for glow sticks>

UptheChimney Sun 06-Oct-13 20:54:33

< pours vodka into a water bottle >

ubik Sun 06-Oct-13 20:59:26

Rave Cave Drug Death Club

It's like a Brass Eye documentary

Don't do it kids, its brilliant wrong

Ehhn Sun 06-Oct-13 21:11:13

Spent many years taking certain clubbing drugs mentioned above that became popular in 80s/90s. So did/do my friends. We are all professionals with good degrees. Never ill from it, never got in any trouble because we studied the science behind it. They were originally used in talking therapies as it puts you in touch with your emotions positively. Of course, some people don't know the science behind how to use it and end up over hydrated, under hydrated or mix the wrong things together, or experiment with new drugs. Interestingly, through playing rugby I've seen a lot of binge drinking (I dislike the taste of alcohol myself). Otherwise happy normal people have been hospitalised, arrested, wet/shat themselves, got into trouble forgetting where they were/with whom they had gone home late at night. All drugs, including alcohol, are bad and dangerous in excess. In moderation and taken sensibly, they are fun but unhealthy. None of this has anything to do with a rave club. One of my best friends loved raving but has never, in her life, touched a drug as it really doesn't appeal to her. Young people have always experimented and some always will - at home, at uni, in the park, in a club. The location is irrelevant - the exciting and novel sensations and the thrill of the illicit is relevant.

UptheChimney Sun 06-Oct-13 21:24:32

Well quite, ehhn.

Although I was such a geeky swot throughout the 1980s that I never got to go to a rave or take drugs.

And actually, the harm done by alcohol throughout our society is far far greater than one club management.

I was wondering if the OP has a personal grudge against the owners of the DEATH RAVE WHATEVER CLUB.


SunshineSuperNova Sun 06-Oct-13 21:30:08

'devilish dealers' is all a bit 'Reefer Madness'. Arf.

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