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CM gave ds pulled elbow, in a quandry

41 replies

sambo303 · 21/05/2010 22:01

My CM has never given me any call for concern at all so far but there was an incident this week that has made me concerned/shocked. I'd like to hear of any others who have had their child sustain an injury like this whilst in childcare, what did you do.
What happened was, the cm called dp to ask him to collect ds - when he turned up ds was screaming in agony. The cm mumbled something about ds hitting her daughter (same age) but then burst into tears. Dp left with ds and his arm was fixed at the hospital and is ok. the nurse says it's a common injury. We've done more research and it seems you need to yank the child's arm quite hard to get this injury.
So now we're thinking, did the cm lose her temper and injure ds in anger? and if so, what do we do now?

The thing is, ds was strapped into the buggy next to the cm's daughter at the time -so she was not moving him away from a situation - we have yet to have a clear explanation of the incident, which we will hopefully have this weekend. In the meantime, it would be good to have some advice on how we should approach the whole situation.

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fidelma · 21/05/2010 22:13

No way would I leave my child in that cm care ever again.

you should of had a full explanation today.

My blood is boiling.

Protect yor child at ALL COST

Sorry does that seem very extreme ?
I am very protcetive.

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OnlyWantsOne · 21/05/2010 22:15

How old is your child,

Has the CM not given any explanation, has she kpt a record of the incident,

How does your CM normally deal with things like this

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dizzydixies · 21/05/2010 22:20

whilst I cannot comment on your CM both DH and I gave DD2 a pulled elbow by accident and it was heartbreaking - it can be more common in some children than others and our DD2 seemed to be 'prone' to it. We didn't yank her hard/there was no intentional injury and it wasn't done in anger - not that this stopped us breaking our heart over it

I agree you need a better explination though

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dinkystinky · 21/05/2010 22:20

It is really common. I know as our nanny (who we think is great) gave DS1 a pulled elbow when he was 2 - he was playing 1, 2, 3 Whee in the park with her and a friend (when he got swung around - played it loads before with her and us) when suddenly he yanked his arm out and started screaming in pain. DH and I both got home from work as she returned home and took him to A&E where it was fixed really quickly. The drs at A&E told us it was very common and they see it lots with small kids being swung around. I know our nanny and trust her - and could see from how upset she was at the time how much it shocked her - so I had no qualms whatsoever about leaving DS1 in her care again. And she now looks after DS1 and DS2. I'm surprised that the CM didnt explain what happened in full - I think you should ask her for an explanation and take it from there. Ultimately it boils down to if you - and your DS - feel you can trust her to care for your DS again.

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sambo303 · 21/05/2010 22:20

ds is 20 months.

cm has called to ask us to sign a record form this weekend as we are away on holiday on Monday (left a message on my phone). Apart from that she has only texted, saying saying i was not to pay her for that day. she also apologied in the text but I would like to know what happened, I guess she can explain when she brings the form round.

my ds is her 2nd job as a cm, previous charge was a 4 year old i think so I dont know how she normally deals with things like this

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DanJARMouse · 21/05/2010 22:24

I wouldnt be sending my child back IF it was in relation to your son possibly hitting her child.

Small children squabble, and 20mnths is still VERY young to understand the no hitting etc.

From the sounds of the OP I get the impression the CM has lost her rag with your DS and pulled his arm hard causing the injury.

I would be trying to find another CM..... however, if it was a genuine "I dont know what happened" which under the circumstances of her saying dont pay for today, im not sure i believe, then I may have to give another chance. HTH

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potoroo · 21/05/2010 22:25

sambo, some children are more prone to this than others. DS did this 3 times in the space of about six months when he was about the same age as your ds.

The first time he did it in his sleep by rolling awkwardly (the nurse at A&E said this is common). The second time he did it by pulling on a stairgate, and the third time something similar (and by then DH had been shown how to put the elbow back in place so we didn't need to go to A&E).

So it might not have been done with much force - the CM may not be exactly aware how it happened.

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maryz · 21/05/2010 22:27

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

cornsilkcottagecheese · 21/05/2010 22:28

It could have been an accident. I'd wait till she explains herself before I made any decisions.

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countrybump · 21/05/2010 22:29

This sounds odd, in that your CM didn't give you an immediate explanation of what had happened (and why you didn't ask for one?), and why should you not pay her - is that because you were called to go and collect your DS early?

To be perfectly honest, if this was my DS, there is no way I would be leaving him in her care again. This doesn't sound like it was done while they were playing etc, and if your DS was strapped into a pushchair he could hardly have been attacking her DD in such a way that he needed to be physically restrained by pulling his arm?

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ProfessorLaytonIsMyLoveSlave · 21/05/2010 23:05

Pulled elbow is incredibly easy to do in some children and you do not need to yank the arm hard. My sister was prone to it and it would happen in the silliest ways -- the first time was my parents 1-2-3-whee! thing where you swing the child between you, and it also happened from just walking along holding her hand and her just pulling away (so the adult not pulling at all, just the amount of force she could exert on her own. Altogether I think it happened four or five times. The doctors said that around (I think, may be misremembering the exact figure but it was something like this) 1/4 to 1/3 of toddlers are prone to pulled elbow and you just have to wait for them to grow out of it (and not play 1-2-3-whee!).

I don't know what happened to your DS, obviously, but it doesn't automatically have to have been anything hard or involving a loss of temper.

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Joolyjoolyjoo · 21/05/2010 23:11

My dad pulled dd's elbow while swinging her and dd2. He was devastated, really upset. I know a mum who has managed to pull the elbow of all 3 of her children (much to her embarassment!) with little force, so I think it can be done quite easily, but agree that you need to talk to your cm about what actually happened- calmly if possible! Inly then can you make a decision about whether or not you are happy to continue to have her care for your child. Hope your ds is feeling better

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maryz · 21/05/2010 23:17

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

mooki · 21/05/2010 23:22

Our DD had pulled elbow twice in a year - at age about 10 months she was standing on DH's knees, he was supporting her hands and she sat down. The second time, there was a kerfuffle getting her arms into the straps into the car seat about 18 months.

So it really doesn't take a violent or forceful act to cause it but having said that, I would have expected a much clearer account of what happened from your CM. Let's hope she gets one now you know what's happened.

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Missus84 · 21/05/2010 23:29

My dad did this to me when I was a toddler by swinging me round too.

It would really depend on the CM's explanation of what happened.

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thelunar66 · 21/05/2010 23:36

DD was in A&E with a dislocated elbow 4 times in as many months... its awful easy to do as i know to my cost. I think it's unlikley your CM has hurt your child deliberately.

Not sure what else to say really.. just wanted to let you know it is a common thing.

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DanJARMouse · 22/05/2010 16:49

any update today?

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misdee · 22/05/2010 16:52

dd1 at age 4 suffered a pulled elbow. her best friend, also 4yrs old, caused it.

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fidelma · 22/05/2010 22:52

I find it very stramge that there has been no explanation from your cm.

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MadamDeathstare · 22/05/2010 23:08

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

LynetteScavo · 22/05/2010 23:15

Pulled elbows are common...I had loads as a small child...to the point that my family just didn't bother to do anything, and waited for it to go back... only after my fussing lots did they bother with a trip to A&E.

I pulled DS1's elbow once when he went to hit another child in the park (such a nice toddler he was!), and I pulled him away (I was already holding his hand), and his older cousins manage go pull his elbow when they were playing one day.

I'm not sure how it could happen when your DS was strapped into the buggy though. You really need to have a proper chat about this.

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hellymelly · 22/05/2010 23:20

My DH gave our dd a pulled elbow just by swinging her,the nurse then said it is really common in that age group (she was about 18m)and often happens by pulling children across the road.I don't think it takes much force and in some children it happens a lot as their joints are so mobile.Of course you need to have it out with your CM but she may have just pulled him away with not much force at all.

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merrymonsters · 25/05/2010 17:11

DH did this to DS1 when he was about 18 months old. He was just swinging him in a game.

The hospital doctor said that children under 5 have loose joints and that it's really common.

It's a bit odd that the child minder hasn't explained what happened though.

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FabIsGoingToGetFit · 25/05/2010 17:13

My dd had her arm pulled out of its socket and it took days and several hospital visits to be fixed.

I would not be sending my child back there. Whatever your child may have done a CM has no right to physically chastise someone elses child.

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QSnondomicile · 25/05/2010 17:15

I would share my concerns with ofsted, to be honest. Is she registered?

A nursery worker hit my son on the head with a brio wooden train tunnel, to teach him that "you dont hit because it hurts"
I made a complaint to ofsted, and all the staff got additional training set up for them.

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