Natural consequences - does it work?

[stirringbeast]

Hi, I have 3 dcs ages 5, 8 and 10 and I work 4 days a week. I have to be very organised about shopping, cooking, housework etc, and I encourage the dcs (and DH!) to help as much as possible, partly out of necessity and partly just because I think it's good for them. I want them to be as independent as possible and not think someone is always there to pick up after them.

We have always had them take turns to clean up after dinner, pick up their own toys, put their dirty clothes in the wash, clean ones away etc. The 5 year old I don't expect as much from and I help her to tidy up and give her more reminders. But the older 2 I think should be doing a bit more. We have a cleaner once a week and the evening before I remind them she's coming. They know that if their room is a mess I will tell the cleaner to put everything lying around in a black bag and they won't get it back for 2 days. And she does that, but they don't seem to care and it happens week after week.

I thought they might learn from natural consequences, e.g. if they don't hang up their towel after a bath then it will be wet when they need it the next day. And they don't and it's wet and they complain and the same happens the next day.

Am I expecting too much? My dcs think I am obviously! Can they learn to do these things or do I have to just keep repeating myself like a stuck record? Or even worse, just pick everything up myself?

[LynetteScavo]

Well, my 11 year old still hasn't' figured if he doesn't put his dirty clothes in the washing basket, they won't get washed.

Neither has Dh COME TO THAT....[HMM]

[whatwasthatagain]

Can't give you any helpful advice but just wanted to commiserate. My DDs friends come for tea, AND TAKE THEIR PLATES TO THE SINK! How do they get trained to do that then? DD (10) asked if she could start to get pocket money (I know, we are soooo mean) and said she would do jobs to earn it. I told her I didn't want her to do jobs, just to clear up after herself - like put dishes in the dishwasher, pick her clothes up, hang up wet towels, not leave socks EVERYWHERE but it has not made a jot of difference, and she hasn't had the pocket money. HELP

[stirringbeast]

I think my 10 year old would just pick up something dirty off the floor if there weren't any clean clothes. She seems to want to be a scruffy as possible at the moment.

[stirringbeast]

whatwasthat again, that sounds familiar. My dcs enjoy doing a "job", e.g. washing dishes at the sink and leaving the kitchen in a flood of water and bubbles. But scraping a plate into the bin and putting it in the dishwasher....that's obviously not exciting enough and needs me behind them nagging....sigh....

[englishpatient]

Can I reply as a daughter not a parent? (I am struggling with this one as a parent, like you!)

My mum had a REALLY annoying thing when I was young: if she went upstairs and found I'd left my bedroom light on, she would call me and make me come up and switch it off. I really hated it and it seemed to go on for years, so she probably thought it didn't work. But it did in the end - I am totally obsessed with switching off unnecessary lights!

[stirringbeast]

Oh no I've done that! I've also made them go back and open/close a door again if they've slammed it!

So how many years until they learn then....?!

[englishpatient]

About 10?

[cory]

It only works with the kind of person who cares if their clothes are clean, their room is tidy and their towel nice and dry. I am one of those people who don't really notice these things, so my mother had to go down the nagging path. I do now keep myself clean and tidy, but it is more about knowing that I am supposed to. I have lived in tents and got up every morning in the pouring rain to get into work clothes stiff with mud, that sort of thing doesn't bother me, so I had to be taught that I had to keep certain standards for the sake of other people.

[specialmagiclady]

Could you use questioning to get them to think about what they're (not) doing? WHat's wrong with this room? What happens if you don't do this?

Why not extend the time the binbag goes away for? Like to a fortnight, or forever (should only need to be once...)

And even if it's important homework/valuable property, don't fish it out of the bin.

God, you'd have to be hard.

My kids are 3 and 5 and I do just feel like that's it, I'm going to be a bitch for the next 10/12 years.

[stirringbeast]

That's it special I feel like a complete dragon if I constantly go on at them. That's why I preferred they take the consequences of their actions. I don't tend to remind dd(10) about stuff she needs for school, I just tell her to think what she needs for the day. She's pretty good at that and if she genuinely forgets something I'll take it in if it's not a big hassle for me. But the domestic stuff is another matter - they are obviously not bothered, as Cory said.

Right, about to announce it's tidy up time! There are barbies on every stair....