Mothers - Are we creating monsters in our sons for the next generation

[Norash]

I have often had this debate with people, and a recent thread has prompted me to start this one.

Well let's put it this way:

Boys are not under so much preasure to help out around the house, yet we complain about husbands not doing enough.

Boys are taught to pee while standing ( there is no reason why they cannot just do it sitting), yet we complain about men always leaving the toilet seat up.
The list is endless, please feel free to add.

Are we responsible for the behaviour that we eventually "hate"?

[hercules]

Not everyone lives like this.

[mummytosteven]

being a bit lazy round the house and leaving the loo seat up may be annoying but hardly monstrous behaviour!

[QueenEagle]

My sons are expected to do their fair share around the house; I have alist of chores stuck to the wall with 2 each per day.

ds1 is 11 and can cook a simple meal without supervision. ds2 can make a pot of tea. ds's 3 and 4 are too young just yet. Both my older boys clean their own rooms, change their bed linen, make their own packed lunches for school and phone their grandma up to see if she is ok!!!!

So, there's every chance they will be capable and domesticated when they grow up.

[MrsGordonRamsay]

My four year old DS, sorts laundry by colour and nearly always gets it right, he will then load the washing machine and put the detergent in and if it is on the right cycle,I just show him which button to press.

He also gets a cloth and wipes up spillages...

I think we are doing OK for 4

[hercules]

I've posted similar threads to this before as I get fed up of the generalisations about men being lazy and women trying to mould them, crying tactics, making lists and tricking some men into doing what they should be doing anyway.

[mummytosteven]

but seriously I intend to get DS to pull his weight around the house - being able to cook and fend for yourself is a valuable life skill

[Norash]

I know that and I was not saying that everyone does, just maybe being too general I guess.

[QueenEagle]

hercules - why is it though that so many men do expect things to be done for them and adopt a lazy approach to domestic skills?? Is it because they think they can get away with it? Is it because they saw their fathers getting away with it?? Or that the mothers were martyrs and consequently the boys expect their g/f's and wives to be the same?

[hercules]

I expect it's all of those and their partners accepting it.

[QueenEagle]

Incidentally, my 12 year old brother has everything done for him. He comes to my house and is gobsmacked that I say he can help himself to a snack or a drink, as he expects his mother to do it for him.

My boys think he is a wuss at not being very capable of making his own sandwiches.

[hercules]

Lots of women excuse their behaviour because they're "men".

[tarantula]

well my dp is a SAHD and I come home to a meal on the table most evenings, he does all the nappy washing, keeps the house tidy and clean and has decided to wash the windows today 'as they are disgusting' (ummmm yes dear of course they are was jsut thinking that the other day says me....blagging furiously ). I honestly cannot complain about dp not doing enough around the house AT ALL. and if I do ever have a son then he'll do just as much around the house as dd will do when she gets older.

[Caligula]

I honestly believe that one of the reasons for the high divorce rate is the gap between expectation and reality when it comes to domestic chores. And the gap in perception as well. Whenever any research is done on this, men consistently over-estimate how much they do around the house, by an enormous margin. And women consistently start out expecting men to do more and then gradually take on more and more tasks themselves.

I try and make damn sure that DS does stuff, but Jesus it's an uphill battle. I had an hysterical attack this morning because once again, he hadn't put his school shorts away and hadn't taken responsibility for getting his hat. At 6 years old, i don't think I'm asking him to do to much. And I'm just going to get heavier about it - told him that every time he "forgets" to put uniform away or get his own hat, he'll have a piece of pasta taken out. I've also developed the technique of insisting that tidying up etc., is done before TV watching. Ho hum, you can but try...

[hercules]

is that your dh or your ds?

[luc1979]

i think men in general not all know that we will give in before them and do it like getting up to ds in middle of night.. a bit like all children there are more exciting things to do.
my mum never expected us to help round the house. she did a lot as a child and believe we should be left tro play. i am untidy and my sister is v tidy. nature v's nurture?

[binkie]

Norash, I suspect you're only going to hear from one side here - don't somehow think there'll a post saying "oh, my little princes, how I love to wait on them. PS what shall I do about my husband he is a layabout"

But to answer your question directly, yes I do think mothers (and fathers too ...) have a big responsibility for teaching their sons and their daughters that nothing practical/domestic/boring/choresome happens "by magic". Luckily most kids when they're little really want to get involved and help - so we have to have the patience to let them help at that age, & then when they're older they take it for granted that they should contribute.

(In case you think this is pie in sky, my mum brought my two brothers up this way and they've turned out really well.)

[Caligula]

Herc - I sometimes wonder! This morning I thought "oh boy, do you remind me of someone!" (especially after he'd been asked to empty a carrier bag full of rubbish into the main rubbish bin and he'd screwed it up. My response was "well it looks like we're going to have to practice that then, doesn't it - because if you think that doing it badly will mean I won't ask you to do it again, you're wrong!" )

[Norash]

I know that both parents have the responsibility to ensure that their kids grow up to be responsible and people who are able to cater for themselves.

I just think that mothers generally have the greater share of parenting.

[binkie]

Indeed, Norash - sorry, wasn't trying to "correct" you by referring to "fathers too". Just hoping to share the mummy-guilt a bit.

I do think, for what it's worth, that even where both parents do a pretty good job of sharing the parenting it's the mother who tends to deal with the dull learning-to-be-a-good-citizen stuff (and homework). Love to hear from anyone for whom that's different.

[Norash]

Cool binkie, I do agree with that.

[hercules]

It's very different to that in my house, Binkie.

[Norash]

Hercules you keep saying how different it is in your house . Why don't you tell us how different it is?

[binkie]

Hercules, delighted to hear it. Do you think it's down to how your dh was brought up? Or his own sense of fairness?

(I get a sense you're a bit fed up with this being old ground. Link rather than answer if you'd prefer?)

[hercules]

Havent much time but here goes.
We simply share it all. Dh looks after kids whilst I go to work and does as much housework as he can during this time. When we're both working or both off we do whatever needs doing. THere's no nagging or anyone trying to get out of it.
Dh has always done his share if not more of raising kids and does so without cajoling or asking.
It's never been an issue.

[hercules]

No, nothing to do with how he was brought up. In his culture men rarely do childcare or housework and hid dad has never made himself a cup of tea.