How do you punish/deal with blatant defiance?

[unicorn]

My 6 year old dd sometimes just stares me hard in the face and says 'NO!'.. I'm not going to do x,y,or z - it makes me feel and really rather useless.

How do YOU deal with such an attitude?

[Pagan]

A darn good thrashing

Sorry that's not much help is it? How about consquences? That is if he doesn't do it then you will take something from him, not go to the park, not get to watch TV?? Something like that?

[QueenEagle]

Do you smack or not smack?

After several warnings, if outright defiance and serious attitude in my face continues....I have smacked and banished to the bedroom.

I also use the giving a choice, either do as I ask or take the consequences (ban tv for the evening or going out to play, whatever).

[unicorn]

Tried all that.. she says 'don't care' etc.. and really doesn't seem bothered.

The stubborn streak -(which probably runs in the family!) seems to give her the thrill.

I spose I should ignore etc, but when it really is an action you want stopped, it is very difficult.

[unicorn]

I don't smack, don't think it wouldn't achieve much in our case- other than teaching her to do the same.

[unicorn]

A friend just said 'it's a girl thing'...ie girls are more brazen than boys generally.(is it so?)

I have noticed some of dd's pals (girls) becoming more hard faced recently, I guess she is copying them.

anymore ideas?

[lucy5]

If its really bad I put things in the dustbin (I always fish them out) I put smarties in one by one the other day into a sneakily concealed bag. It took four smarties before I won. DD is 4 though, so probably a bit more gullible.

[Aero]

If she really doesn't care about withdrawal of TV etc, would she be more bothered about withdrawal of something more important like a forthcoming party, or maybe a planned swimming trip. That said, you then really must be prepared to carry it out. Worked for my friends dd who missed her best friend's birthday party. They felt awful doing it as they really didn't want her to miss out, but it showed they meant business and she's not forgotten it and things are much better now.

[TwinSetAndPearls]

WE have beenb struggling with dd (4 in september) for a while tried all the positive parenting, time out, ( don't have a tv to take away so couldn't try that!)sticker charts etc, we are even seeing a child behaviour expert to help. Last week we emptied her playroom into the loft and told her every day she was good she could earn back a toy. It has worked - allelulia!!

[QZebra]

there is something she cares about enough, unicorn, that a threat really would work.
Give us a concrete example when she turns completely defiant.

[unicorn]

What set this off earlier, was her messing around with the big sofa cushions (ie part of sofa)showing a total disregard, messing them up and jumping all over them (I know - it doesn't sound like a hanging offence.. but there is history on this one!)

I told her to stop it,(and put sofa back together) to which she replied 'NO,I Won't!' with a look of complete defiance.

I told her she could go to her room, to which again, she replied 'No, I won't - you can't make me!'....

She was staring me out the whole time, and I could have swung for her... instead
I walked off with ds, and muttered what a shame that she would miss her school trip tomorrow, and that I would have to tell her teacher about her behaviour....

That,got a response.
Seems she is more fearful (?) of her teacher than me.

[QZebra]

hey girl, if the threat works, go with it!!!

I took my parents for granted, maybe all children do.

DH would be very prone to literally haul DS1 off to his room for defiance like that, but I know it escalates something rotten, so my line would have been more like "No, I guess I can't (or don't want to). But I can think up some really horrible punishment instead..."

[QZebra]

... and to be honest, there would be an extra punishment added on just for speaking to me like that. DH would go ballistic if the kids ever said things like that, even in a joking way.

[MarsLady]

You have to decide what matters to her. Eg. dolls, trips, money. Whatever it is that she has that she loves. Tell her that if she doesn't change the behave then it goes. If she doesn't then Remove it! Say what you mean and mean what you say.

DD1 does this to me less and less frequently. She has missed Brownies, swimming, playdates, etc. Whenever she does something nice or what I have asked I always tell her thank you.

Don't know if that helps, but if telling her that you'll tell the teacher works, go with it. Works wonders with DD2. Need to capitalise on it whilst I can.

[unicorn]

cheers all,
qzebra have you got all boys?

I just wonder if it is a girl-mum thing,as my ds (3yrs) shows no sign of this type of challenging behaviour that dd has.

I wouldn't have dreamed of talking to my mum like that... but then again,she would have walloped me.. hmmm wonder if that was the deterrent? or maybe I just wasn't as defiant as my daughter.

[soapbox]

I'd be down on that kind of behaviour like a ton of bricks!

The thing is you need to do something really heavy handed as a punishment, but IME, only once.

Last summer when DD was 6 we banned her from using her bike for a whole week (or at least it was a to her!

Now I give one warning about bad behaviour and as she knows I am serious she doesn't muck around.

Part of making it effective though, is that you have to find the right thing to deprive them of and that will vary a lot from child to child!

[milge]

sorry to disillusion you unicorn, boys are just as bad. I had to haul ds (3 soon) out of playgroup by his feet as it was the only way to stop him kicking.. he is a nightmare, but soooo cute afterwards i feel awful.

[unicorn]

That's it soapbox, she doesn't seem too bothered about toys, telly etc.. she can even feign disinterest if I say no gymclub/swimming... so it is very difficult to hit the right place IYSWIM.

It's like she has this 'I've got one over on you' attitude, which I have also seen in some of her classmates.

Scary.

[soapbox]

Unicorn- there must be something that she loves doing???

Does she have any siblings - pain of missing out is worse if you see someone else getting a treat e.g. Visiting grandparents/cinema/toy shopping????

When you threaten that she will lose gym/swimming etc do you follow through? Is she seemingly unbothered because you don't follow through, rather than not bothered at the punishment?

[soapbox]

Parties and sleepovers are the most effective in our house at the moment.

[Tortington]

i can make mine go to their room at 15 and 12. why is it you can't carry a 6 yo to her room and make her stay there?

i think you should uni, even if its only for 10 minutes.

[soapbox]

But why do they go to their room Custardo - is it because they know that if they don't a far worse punishment awaits them???

[Tortington]

nope - they go to their room becuase i tell them to - that is the punishment.

[Tortington]

gosh soapy do you think i beat mi kids?

[soapbox]

But what would you do if they turned round and said 'no'????

[soapbox]

LOL - no

Just that like me you would escalate to something they really wouldn't like such as missing out on a party or sleepover or whatever the equivalent thing is at 15!