Does anyone do Unconditional Parenting with a 2 year old??

[nappyaddict]

There seems to be a lot of explaining things for it to work and I just don't think a 2 year old has the understanding for it to work. Would love to be proved wrong though

[notnowbernard]

I don't know what it is

[pooter]

ooh, i want to know this too! At the moment my version of unconditional parenting appears to be 'letting him have his way' according to my mum! He is only 20mo but i try to talk to him reasonably and ask him what he wants and why hes doing something (dont get much in way of replies as he only has 4 words - mama, dada, orange juice and hairclip (!!!)) I try to think 'why not let him?' a lot, and try not to stop him doing anything that isnt too dangerous, or antisocial. Hes just started snatching toys off his friends, which ive started to intervene in, but without shouting or using the 'n' word (naughty) and explaining why it upsets his friends.

Id like to know what else i can do - i really want to try the unconditional paretning approach and have read loads of books on it, but yes, like you, ive come to the conclusion that maybe you have to wait for a bit to do the talky stuff - so i feel like im not putting enough effort into it - if you know what i mean!

God, what a load of waffle.

[Notanexcitingname]

I'm trying.....I'm actually amazed at how much he does understand, and the effect that giving warning has. Eg If I say "bedtime" out of the blue, there tends to be a strop. But if i count down 10 mins, 5 mins, 2 mins, let's tidy up, then I always have compliance.

I find i have to demonstrate what I mean in actions, to abck up the words, but by and large I'm amazed at how well it works.

That's not to say there aren't strops (mine and his ) or that it's always perfect, but I can see where it's going. To be fair, I work f/t so I have less time to test it than a SAHM, but it's often more pressured, which is the hardest thing.

I think the most important thing at this age is to remember the distraction technique, and learn to chill about the small stuff.

On a similar discussion a while back, juule said she used it from birth, and she has hundreds of several children, so it must have been good for their family

[milkysallgone]

Yes I have a 2yr olds ds - not much advice though, I would say I am more aspirational at the moment .

Have started a thread about UP here

[nappyaddict]

Am a bit about doing it from birth. How does that work!

[Notanexcitingname]

I think (and I am only guessing, I don't know juule) that the principal is that you don't think of your child's behaviour as naughty, or spiteful, or out to get you, but instead that which is innate, but going to be socialised to our social norms.

There's a line of Alfie Kon's which is something like "always attribute the best possible motivation to your child's behaviour", basically meaning, that you don't ever see them as manipulative or naughty.

I think that is something which can be done from birth. How often to we hear "they're only crying for attention" or "she's got to learn xxx", which suggests that people do, in fact attribute manipulative purpses to even quite small babies

does that make sense?

[nappyaddict]

I just thought it was common sense that babies aren't crying for attention or to be manipulative - they are just being babies

That's why i wasn't understanding doing it from birth cos I was thinking well babies don't need disciplining they aren't being naughty

[ruddynoraaaaaaggggggghhhhh]

hi nappyaddict. yes i do UP with my 2yr old. i was doing it anyway, then got the book from seeing it talked about on here, so now i do it more so.

i've yet to figure out if dd is how she is because of UP or if it's that the UP works well on her because of how she is. does that make sense?

without wanting to sound competitive mum at all, dd does have a far greater vocabulary than her peers, she is easy to understand by any adult, and takes well to reasoning.

i think it's easy for an outsider to see it as a soft touch way of parenting when they only see it in action for short periods of time. my PILs are the same. they see dd for maybe a couple of hours a week with me there too. they see it rather as soft touch..though they'd never say so out loud.

but then people we've been to stay with for longer periods of time are totally bowled over by it. can't believe how dd does stuff without tantruming, how well she responds to us, how we don't 'punish' for things yet it works.

but, like i said, dd may well have been like this without UP, who knows. plus i think a big thing for me is that i'm never really in a rush to get anywhere or do anything. so if dd isn't ready to get dressed, or get in the car or whatever..ie there is an exciting leaf to look at or whatever, then it doesn't matter. if however i had 3 kids to get off to school for 9am, then i dunno if i'd be so easy going!

[juuule]

I agree with something in AKs book that UP is 'working with'(problem solving) the child rather than 'doing to'(Control via rewards/punishments).

Having said that, some people think that showing approval or disapproval falls into the second category. I think that it could do but it depends on what the intentions of the parent are for doing them.

I do explain and talk to my children but don't go on and on if I can see they don't quite 'get' what I'm saying. I do impose my will on my children if I have reached a stage where their safety might be at risk, or we have time restraints or they are causing other people problems. But before I would do that I would explain the whys and wherefores of why we are doing or not doing something.

I've found that even very young children can understand a lot of what you try to explain to them. Sometimes they just don't want to know because they want their own way and then have a whopping tantrum.

For me UP is listening to the child and considering whether I am being reasonable or not and whether something really needs to be done or whether it's just something that I would like to be done that's not really a big deal when I stop to think about it.

Maybe I pick and choose the bits of UP that I agree with I do know that it was such a relief to find AKs book which affirmed a lot of the things I was already doing and that I wasn't creating monsters by letting my children 'get away with things'.

[nappyaddict]

Ok so what would you do with a 2.4 year old boy who keeps hitting/pinching/pushing?

At the moment I move him away and say NO! We don't hit, it's not nice. Be gentle.

This however doesn't seem to be working despite having done it since he was about 18 months old.

Also today we were on the bus and ds wouldn't sit down on the sit. I said DS sit down because it is dangerous.

Am I thinking an unconditional parent would say why did you hit/pinch/push that little girl? and why don't you want to sit down? Or am I getting the wrong end of the stick.

[Fillyjonk]

I am still confused about AP vs UP

but IF UP is Alfie Kohn...then in response to nappyaddict-

I'd say that really, your son is a little young to reason with. I've only fairly recently been able to start using it with my daughter, who is 3 and a bit, but who has also been exposed to it for a much longer time as she has an older brother.

What would I actually do in the scenario you give? Change the environment. I don't think 2 year olds are that social anyway. Neither of my older ones were at 2, and they are both pretty sociable now. But if he seems to need playdates I'd consider getting together with older kids. Then in a few months, try again.

I think very little kids learn almost nothing from direct instruction and commands. They learn from experience. So try to give him a GOOD experience of social interaction, by making it easy for him to behave in a way to get social approval.

[nappyaddict]

FJ - he is doing this in places like shops so i can't really change the environment. we dont often have playdates although he does go to toddlers and playgroup.

[Habbibu]

nappyaddict - one thing that might work is to show him "good" physical contact - so if he goes to hit, take his hand, use it to stroke your face and say "gently", with big smiles. apologies if this is what you already do!

[juuule]

I would keep him close to me and away from the other children. If he objected, then I would remind him that it's not nice to hit,etc. I would remind him before we went out to behave nicely or we would have to go home.

As for sitting on the bus - would he sit on your knee?

Sometimes you have to grit your teeth and just carry on doing what you are doing in the belief that at some point your child will mature enough to take in what you are saying and understand it and remember it without too many reminders.

[Fillyjonk]

so am I right, you are taking him to shops and he is hitting strangers there? Or standing up on the bus?

That is pretty tricky, I agree.

I do think that, unless you really can think of a way to make the situation work for him, you might actually need to restrain him. I would not want to have to do that, so sympathy.

I do feel that it is ok to impose quite strict limits where safety is concerned. I think the key is to try to maintain respect while you do it.

It sounds like a very trying phase!

[Fillyjonk]

also, tbh you say that "I just don't think a 2 year old has the understanding for it to work."

he is your child and you know him! If you think he cannot manage the explaining yet (and it is pretty much as you describe it) you are probably right

the main thing is that in a year or two he probably WILL manage it.

[nappyaddict]

We have reins when we are out shopping but occasionally i will forget and lose them to look at something and that's when he will do it. Most recent episodes occured whilst looking at shoes in clarks and the cafe in sainsbury's whilst i was carrying a tray of food.

Usually he will sit on my lap but today I had my friend's baby with me who was sat on my lap.

Juuule - keeping him close to me doesn't work at playgroup though. I do follow him around at toddlers but i still don't always catch him before he does it.

Is what I am saying the right sort of things? These are the things that came naturally to me before I had heard of unconditional parenting last week so I'm not sure if they fit in with it or whether I need to change that.

[stayinbed]

i have a 2 yr old dd2 who i do sort of unconditional parenting with.

an example at bedtime - i say 'emma do you want to go to bed'? she says no
i try a bunch of others ' do you want to listen to music in your bed' 'do you want to drink milk in your bed' 'do you want to hug Bear and go to bed' 'are you tired'

when she is ready, or when she finds one she likes, she says 'yes'

gets in her bed and goes to sleep

sometimes she just gets in her bed and says 'music' or 'bear' or 'lie down' or 'sleeping', as a result of having done this for a while now

it is the same sort of scenario for everything else (bathtime, what snack do you want for nursery, dinner, do you want to play outside, inside etc etc)

[nappyaddict]

Juuule - also threatening to go home if he misbehaves at the shops isn't really workable. If I need to get stuff from the shops coming home when he plays up doesn't help me. Also I don't think he'd actually care if we came home from the shops, or even toddler group for that matter.

The thing I don't get about UP is the whole choice thing. If they make the wrong choice when do you draw the line at saying actually no you're not doing that you're doing this.

[stayinbed]

nappyaddict - first try to think why he is doing it.
could he be trying to express somethign he doesnt know how to express? are you more tired at the times he does it? is this his first time having lengthy encounters with socializing? etc etc
once you can narrow down a few reasons post and you will get some more accurate advice on here

[gagarin]

don't ask "why" of a 2 year old (or a 22 year old at that!). It is an impossible question to answer.

But IMO you can help by using emotional words like " you are CROSS aren't you?" and "it's frustrating isn't it?" at the appropriate moments.

We spend so long teaching big/little; yellow/red and the like but dcs don't always here emotions described.

The aim is that one day in a shop they shout "I'm cross and bored mummy!" rather than lie down and scream .

[juuule]

I ended up always keeping reins with us if we went out and didn't have pushchair with us.
I would also watch and intervene at toddlers (like you) but if it got too much and was becoming unpleasant then we would go home. If it was happening every time then I stopped going for a couple of months.

I think the thing is to think ahead and try to see the possible problems and be as prepared as you can be. (reins, lots of time, try to get a bus that's not in the rush hour if poss, that sort of thing)

Playgroup - if you are not with him then it's up to whoever is supervising at the playgroup with you making the right noises when you pick him up.

Sounds like your doing all the right things to me. If you are listening to your child and considering him and his feelings and taking his view of things into account then that's pretty much UP to me.

[gagarin]

nappyaddict - only give real choices. It will just backfire if you don't. Like walk or in the trolley? Cheese or ham?

You have to shop so asking "shall we go shopping this morning or this afternoon?" is not generally a wise choice to offer!

[twentynine]

Hmm I didn't know there was a name for it. I sort of do this with DD - explaining why things are the way they are and what happens when she does something silly. Yes she has strops and I try and empathise and understand her frustration. 99.9% of her frustration at the minute is because she knows what she wants to do and say but we don't understand her diction. She's getting there though. She's only had one strop today versus five a day last week.

Various grandparents give me crap about it though esp as I'm still breastfeeding - apparently I 'baby' her too much (i.e. comfort her when she's upset and attempt to understand her)

[juuule]

NA - I'd say the line is when you do have to do something.