Naps any advice...

[DressingGown87]

DD is 17 weeks. I’m hoping it’s 4 month regression, so understand TIME is probably the answer.

But I’m drained, and want to know if anyone has any suggestions to help improve / establish naps?

To get DD to sleep she is usually rocked or in the pram. But this can take anywhere between 5-90minutes. 9/10 she will cave and go to sleep. But when I place her down, or stop pushing she wakes up. Or on the occasion I get her down without waking she will wake after 30minutes.

I usually rock her in a dark room, with white noise.

I know she is probably use to the motion now to get to sleep, and I don’t mind this, even though it’s breaking my arms / back. That self settling will come with time. But its the not being put down or transitioning into the next sleep cycle (assume if she could self settle she would be able to complete this transition). I can’t use a carrier on advice from the physio, as I have pins and plates in my collar bones, and I can’t hold her for long periods of time. (Hence why I’m trying to put her down).

When she wakes she is still clearly tired, and spends a lot of time rubbing her eyes, frustrated, and crying.

I just want to help us both. So any advice would be appreciated.

[BunnyRuddington]

Sorry I can't be of much help but I've heard good things about this book.

[Tianatiers]

I used to feed my DD to sleep and then let her sleep on my lap. Cot naps didn't hagen until she was one! Lap naps were the only way other than taking her out for a walk in the pram or a drive in the car, but as soon as the motion stopped she would wake up. The only way I'd get a break was to let her sleep on my lap. I watched a lot of box sets and read a lot of books and didn't get much else done in that first year.

[CrazyKitkatLady]

4 months is so tough! Time probably is the answer I’m afraid.

I found with mine if it was taking longer than 20 mins or so to get her to sleep I’d give up, take her to play/bath something else and then try again later.

Could you cuddle / pat her to sleep on your bed? Then you don’t have to transfer her and risk waking (obviously only ok if you don’t mind being trapped with her to supervise)

[DressingGown87]

@BunnyRuddington thank you.

@Tianatiers thank you. I sometimes can feed to sleep, but she has reflux so tend to have to keep her upright after feeds. I try do one nap per day on me. Unfortunately I’m back at work (WFH) so ideally need the naps to work or do the housework.

@CrazyKitkatLady I thought time might be the answer, just hope it passes soon. I’m back working (have been since 6weeks) so use the naps to work or do housework. She does start with a childminder next week too, just for one day to start with. Huge anxiety over whether she is going to settle when she fights sleep / short naps. Thank you for the tip will try 20minutes at a time and then distract and try again.

[CrazyKitkatLady]

You sound like a really lovely mum doing a great job, it’s hard to balance everything! Well done you for working at the same time!

[DressingGown87]

@CrazyKitkatLady thank you. I’ve gone back sooner than what I would have liked, but I’m a single/lone parent so needed to financially. Hopefully I can find a solution to the naps, or the phase passes before I burn out.

[Ohalrightthen]

Can you put her in a sling and wear her sleeping while you work?

[DressingGown87]

@Ohalrightthen I have metal pins and plates in my collar bone, which have always give me grief (especially in cold weather) so was advised off the physio to not use anything that can cause continuous strain. She’s 15lb1 now so getting quite heavy for me.

[Ohalrightthen]

Ahhhh that completely thwarts my main newborn parenting strategy. Could you get one of those bouncy chairs with a motor that does the jiggling for you?

[Amammai]

My friend had one of these: Automatic Baby Rocker www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B004DORTGM/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_api_fabc_42BWWRN4KZSY0Q67CFF1?tag=mumsnet&ascsubtag=mnforum-21 Means you could get on with jobs whilst baby is being rocked in the pram. My own DDS went through a similar phase of short naps at that age and I found it exhausting! Let him nap on you if you can and try for cot naps again in another couple of months - by 8 months ish he napped really well in his cot (he was always a demon at night though!!)

[Aria999]

DS needed constant motion to sleep at this age. We did the sling to begin with and then the pram. There were some times when I heard him waking up , went in and rocked him frantically back to sleep again.

He did eventually learn to sleep in a crib, I have no idea how!

[DressingGown87]

@Ohalrightthen Haha yea it would have helped massively, especially on country walks. I have a swing seat, but I don’t think the motion is the same. I will keep trying.

@Amammai thank you will take a look. Most of the problem is getting her to stay asleep once the rocking stops. On me I can’t get any housework or work done, or keep rocking for the whole duration of the sleep. So something that does it for me may help. But I also need to find something that works for the childminder.

@Aria999 thank you, hope she does it one day too, without much of a battle. If I can catch her just before she wakes, but not fully awake or asleep (so a very small window) I can get her back to sleep sometime. Just she is unable to transition into the next cycle (which I assume is age).

[3WildOnes]

Does she have a dummy? If you put her down in the cot drowsy and hold your hand on her tummy does she just cry?

[DressingGown87]

@3WildOnes yes she has a dummy (helps her reflux) and she’s quite good at taking it out and putting it back. She also has a bunny and she holds its ears when being rocked. I’ve tried putting her down ans lying there next to her quiet not touching / patting / stoking her hand / tried just leaving to see what happens. She will just start talking and then eventually scream and cry.

My only saving grace (touch wood) is that she goes down really well at night, without being rocked. She is given a feed, kept upright for 15-20mins and put down, and she goes to sleep. I’ve tried this in the day, but it doesn’t work.

[3WildOnes]

@DressingGown87 Mine was the opposite! Went down easily for naps but I fed to sleep for longer at night. They are funny!
Our wake windows for the day at that age were only an hour. I’m not sure if you have tried experimenting with different wake windows.

[TooMinty]

Do you have a bedtime routine at night that signals time for sleep? Maybe you could do a cut down version at nap time? I didn't try this until 6 months/2 naps per day though. But basically bedtime routine was bath, milk, story so nap time was nappy change, milk, story.

[NameChange30]

Try the Huckleberry app, it tells you when it's time for the next nap, and is surprisingly accurate.

I agree with the suggestion of a mini version of the bedtime routine.

If baby is falling asleep in the cot at bedtime without any fuss, she knows how to do it. So the issue at nap time is probably that it's not the right timing (over/under tired) and/or it's just a bit harder for them to fall asleep for naps, as the sleep pressure isn't as strong, so when it's difficult she wants your help and cries. Maybe think about how much crying you're willing to tolerate and whether you could let her fuss a bit, try something gentle like PUPD maybe.

My DD is 5 months old, she also has reflux so I keep upright after feeds. She started fighting naps around 3.5 months and I was doing the same, holding or pushing her to sleep, but it was unsustainable, so I recently got her falling asleep in her cot.

Do you have a reflux wedge in the cot btw? We have a wedgehog which helps I think. Also lots of time on the playmat so baby can practise wriggling around and can get into a comfortable position. (Playmat time is tricky with reflux babies, I tend to do it straight after a nap and before feeds, as I obviously keep her upright after feeds.)

[NameChange30]

Apparently a 4 month old should have 4 naps a day with the following wake windows:
(Morning wake)
1h15
(Nap 1)
1h30
(Nap 2)
1h30
(Nap 3)
1h45
(Nap 4)
1h45
(Bedtime)

[DressingGown87]

@3WildOnes oh they are funny. She used to hate baths, but soon realised it has to be exactly set to 36degrees and a certain depth. A degree either way and she cries. I’ve been trying to use awake windows, but the how long it gets her to sleep, and then the short spells she sleep throws them all at the window. Hope your little one is better at night now.

@TooMinty we do playtime, then bath, pjs, then into our room, lights out, feed and the placed down. She is already pretty drowsy when she is down. I’ve tried in the daytime but she seems to just fight it. Will persevere. Just worried a childminder with other children won’t be able to follow suit. I’m just anxious and confused over it all I suppose.

@NameChange30 thank you. I have had Huckleberry for a few weeks, and follow the sweet spot. Sometimes it works, others it takes ages still (even with rocking) but she is clearly tired. Then she will have 30mins (approx) and wake up. As she can’t transition to the next cycle. Thank you, I think that’s the frustration, she knows how to go to sleep, just not in the day, and overtiredness is just causing problems. Like you said it’s hard to fit in playtime, when they need to feed, be upright, and then grumpy because there tired / fighting naps. Just makes motherhood sometimes very tough. I will try PUPD, see if that helps. Glad you managed to get your DD to fall asleep in her cot, was that using PUPD method? Hope I get there too. I have her next to me on the highest recline, but will look into the wedge as she hates lying on her mat, or tummy time thank you.

[TooMinty]

Often childminders and nurseries have secret nap time tricks that work for them so don't worry about that and focus on whatever works for you.

[NameChange30]

I started with PUPD but she got more upset when I did that so I just left her in the cot and stayed next to her, I would touch her tummy and say "time to go to sleep" every few minutes. She cried on and off for a while and eventually fell asleep. Took just a few naps before she was falling asleep quickly without any fuss.

It is hard to let them cry without picking them up but they do have to learn to fall asleep by themselves.

Mumsnet is generally very anti sleep training though so i expect most people will tell you to just carry on doing what you're doing.

[DressingGown87]

@NameChange30 just seen your other post. I’m trying.
Wake up 7.30-8.00 on average. Then I try following the wake windows to get the naps. The naps are usually very short. So the awake windows come round quickly, and the battle starts again. The awake time is usually spent with her rubbing her eyes and yawning. I’ve also tried to go in just before she wakes (25mins) and nudging / patting so she resets her sleep. Or resettling her when she wakes, but she usually starts babbling at me, blowing raspberries and then will winge and cry. She is on Omeprazole, I give it her before her bath, don’t know if this makes a difference.

Thank you so much everyone for you help and advise. I’m taking it al ok board and going to keep trying.

[DressingGown87]

@TooMinty thank you. I’m hoping she has some form of getting her to sleep. She did mention that it will be easier to stick to home routine as much as possible, as she is young and only going one day, so hard to establish a pattern for both.

@NameChange30 glad it worked, will give it a go. Hopefully we find a happy medium. I thought that too, and was prepared for the babies sleep on you for x amount of months. But as a single mum who’s trying to run a business I don’t really have that choice. My pregnancy was very unexpected, but welcomed, just happened to be also on the mist of a pandemic. Not exactly how I would imagined having my first child.

[NameChange30]

It does sound tough and you do what you have to do.

FWIW DD is my second. DC1 was a terrible sleeper and we endured it for nearly a year before we couldn't take it any more and sleep trained. Hence doing it sooner with DC2 as I think it's a bit easier when they're younger tbh. Sleep is so important for their development and wellbeing. And our sanity is important too!

[LifeIsBusy]

Get the free huckleberry app. It suggests sleep times based on wake hours and adjusts for your child. We found if we stayed within the sweet spot we could get small human to sleep really quickly.