Don't like my Daughter

[darlyd]

I don't know where to start, But as the title says I do not like my Daughter. :(

I love her, I worry about her, I would never want any harm to come to her, But I just do not like her.

When I found out I was pregnant I was over the moon, was only 17 and with her father who was a bad man, I ended up becoming a single parent. Birth was fine, was over so quickly, I breast fed for the first few weeks, then bottle fed her as I was exhausted and it was not enough for her. I moved into my own place when she was a few months old (did live with my parents).

Then as toddler age approached I became so depressed, anxious and paranoid, I also ended up becoming agoraphobic, I could not bond with her, I was always shouting at her, and so angry she would not sleep in her own bed, I had no life, father did not bother, I felt so alone.

Parents started to help when she was 4, having her over night once a week, I moved to a new home and my neighbour befriended me, helped me out of my shell, things started to get worse when she started school, I was OK taking her to school, it was picking her up, I was an anxious wreck, most of the time my Nan who lived next door to school would walk her up the lane where I would meet her. Her behaviour was terrible, I ignored her and played playstation games, could not wait for her to go to bed. My parents started having her 2 nights a week for me, and then 3 nights a week.

I then met my current husband, long distance at first, he really brought me out of my shell, DD was then 6, she was her own person, independent, never had many friends, thanks to a nasty family who lived opposite me, putting bouncy castle outside their house for kids and telling mine to p'off. I moved again, changed her school due to her being bullied and teachers not supporting me with her behaviour, I fell pregnant with DD2, still in long distant relationship, we would go visit there (300 miles away) during holidays.

Fast forward a year ago, I moved up here with DD2, DD1 wanted to stay with nanny and with her friends, Was the best thing to do at the time as she was her own person, We never got on, always arguing, she was still a nightmare, always causing trouble. Anyway I got married, then 9 months ago she came to live with us as my Dad had enough of her causing trouble.

But trouble is still going on here, she is one month off her 12th bday, she does not listen to us, no respect, causing trouble in school, always fighting, tells teachers to p'off, smashes things, (smashed our front door cus we would not let her out), Does not understand the meaning NO, constantly causing trouble in school, stirring, writing stupid notes and putting them in kids bags, and then their parents are knocking at my door, she will not go to bed when told, starts to make so much nose and banging about. She also goes through stages of being in a dark place, keeps saying we do not love her, I have never come across this way to her, I always tell her I love her, She has everything, 32inch flat screen, to the modern sony ericson (Which we have taken off her due to causing trouble via texting). She never goes without.

School are being so supportive, referred her to school Councillor, and now to CAFS and GP referred her to CAHMS, we seen CAHMS and are awaiting a further appointment.

I just feel I can not cope with her anymore, My depression has come back, I am angry and depressed, new GP wants me back on antidepressants, which I am scared off, but I do need them to help me cope. Have even tried social services for rest bite, but they won't help. She is horrible to her sister who is 4, DD2 comes out with awful words in playschool picked up from her big sister.

She has (had?) a friend who is not really a nice girl, she has her own problems (ADHD), (but I just want DD to be happy) She slept at hers Friday straight from school, then Saturday I rung her friends and she wanted to stay that night too, I said no, but she ended up staying there after screaming at my DH when he went to collect her, and slammed the door. She then said she be home today for 7, DH rung spoke to friends DAD and he went and got her and took her home, she came in and started saying we don't love her, and friends DAD said she can stay there when ever she has problems at home. Friend rang accusing her of stealing her justin beiber glasses, I believe friend, as DD said she went in her bedroom when she got home, and suddenly her glasses she had lost appeared. FFS ! So she will get some c rap from friend in school tomorrow.

Actually feel a prisoner in my own home. I can not get up in the morning with DD1 (she leaves for school at 7.30, starts at 8), as soon as she leaves I come down, when she comes home from school DH is just coming through the door. BUT I have had to pick her up lately as to many kids are wanting to slap her, her head of year advised me to pick her up. I dread it, but I do it, ask her every day how her day has been, I get told to shut up.

I don't know why I am posting this, I suppose I just need to vent, and ask for some help. ? Please don't judge me.

Thank you for reading.

[hellymelly]

My children are much smaller,so I haven't anything helpful to say,but I wanted to bump for you. It does sound as though she (through no fault of yours) has had a rough time of it as a small child,and that she needs a lot of love and attention but has no idea how to get it other than in nagative ways.Hopefully someone with more knowledge will be able to give you some help op.

[viewsrequired]

didn't want to read and run, although I'm not sure what I can add as it sounds like you definitely need help, support and love. You need to speak to your GP again- and sounds like ADs might be a good idea in the short term at least, so that you can focus on how to make things better. Talk to GP about what other services might be available. Also, can you start, little by little, just spending some time with your dd, doing things together - shopping, cooking? You might find you like each other and that she opens up when distracted by something.. and it sounds as if she knows you do not like her to some extent and is acting on that. If you show her that you, not only love her, but enjoy spending time with her as a friend, her behaviour and general attitude might gradually improve?
Apologiges if any of this sounds wrong, or flippant - it is not intended to be - my dcs are a lot younger than yours, so as I said, I am not really talking from experience..
Certainly would never judge you on this- everyone makes mistakes / falls into bad relationships / does things they regret / have bad things happen to them. It's how we deal with all that life throws at us that distinguishes us - and we would all of course wish to deal with things in the best way that we can - it sounds like that is what you are doing.
sending hugs at least

[hester]

I'm afraid I'm too tired to post at length, but didn't want you to feel unheard. What an awful situation for all of you, especially your daughter who sounds to be honest as though she has had a really shitty time of it.

It's great that you are getting CAMHS involved. However, you talk just about getting help for her. Don't you think this is a whole family problem? Aren't you as much part of it as she is? You talk as though she was an independent person from an early age, but the truth is that she was quite seriously neglected, wasn't she?

I'm not saying this to judge you or have a go at you, but I think you do have to accept that your dd is not the sole cause of this situation if you want to improve it. You will also need to engage with her more fully, rather than avoiding her.

Lastly, the school situation sounds terrible. What are the school doing to stop all the kids wanting to slap her, rather than just asking you to pick her up?

[hester]

Sorry, I'm back. Just to say that I think your dd's problems are very deep-rooted by now, and everyone in the family will have to dig deep in order to improve the situation. Are you prepared to? Is your dh? Or do you just want her to either change or go away?

It will take a lot of work and effort, so you must make sure you are in a good state for it. That means looking at your own emotional wellbeing and support structures as well.

Best of luck.

[darlyd]

Thank you for replies.

I admit it, I neglected her, I must have, I never bonded with her, I feel so ashamed.

When I am not working WE spend time together, We go shopping, cafe, have chinese, watch a films, BUT DH is a selfish man, and won't allow her up to late, he goes bed so early, It's ridiculous, week day OK up at 4am for work, But weekends come one. Oooops I am bitching about DH now. (different thread). Anyway, we could have a right good day, and then suddenly she will snap, I could say no she is not going out (7pm for example), or Please go take a shower, and then she will snap, start going mad. I don't understand. I try so hard, I really do. I even cut my hours at work, where I only work from 3.30pm-8pm mon and tue, and the rest of the week I start at 5pm-8pm, and alternative weekends to spend more time with her.

School end up putting her out side office to work, as she is to disruptive for the class. They told me, next step would be to send her to a unit.

I would love to home school her, BUT she has not patience, and won't sit and do the work, she will get nasty because she can not do it, and end up ripping it up. And then we will argue etc. :(

I have blood's first next week to find out if there is anything physical, then GP week after that to discuss options. He has told me to keep taking KALMS (I take them on and off) and to take some time off work sick, but I can not afford to do that. I am not into counselling for myself, As my mind is over powering and I know how to deal with my mental health, have had so much counselling in the past. A friend (s), is all I need, But I do not have. I feel alone. My marriage I think is over, I am not sure, If it's because I am so low, OR if it is really over. I want to move back to Wales, But have no where to go. (Parents have tiny bungalow). Want to stay here in England but have no money. And only DH and an interfering MIL. :(

[darlyd]

I threw my wedding ring at DH last night. I don't know where it is, he has it but not giving it to me back. He told me all day he loves me, But he is irritating me.

God I sound so unhappy its surreal.

Better go bed, long day tomorrow, house is a tip as usual when I been working all weekend (I have OCD too). :(

[hester]

darlyd, sorry you are having such a rough time of it: it sounds awful. I've got to go to bed now - up again at 5 - but will check back tomorrow.

Sleep well; everything is easier to work through if you've had your kip.

[hester]

Morning darly. Your thread has really preyed on my mind. You've obviously got some very serious problems there and I hope things start to improve for your family soon.

Just one thing I wanted to add: I'm really struck by you talking about your dd as 'her own person' from a young age, in a way that suggests you're not fully realising the connection between your disassociation from her and her subsequent problems. You do clearly feel very guilty, and yet you still talk about the situation as if the problem is of her making and the solution is to fix her.

It is so very important for you to understand that this is a problem of and for the entire family. I'm concerned that you're saying you're not up for counselling yourself, that you've had it in the past and you know how to deal with your mental health. You have been rejecting your daughter your entire life and you are still rejecting her, and you need to now decide whether you want to try to start repairing that, or just get her behaviour modified to the extent that you can survive until she leaves home.

I hope this doesn't feel like kicking you when you're down - you're clearly down, and I feel really sorry for you. But sorrier for your daughter, and really hoping you can find the strength from somewhere to start rebuilding your relationship.

[ellisbell]

children with behaviour problems often do feel unloved and need to be shown that they are loved, their behaviour isn't. It is clearly at the stage where you need family therapy. Take what help your gp offers. Admit to your daughter that you haven't treated her as well as you should, tell her people aren't perfect, you want to do better.

[cory]

I think hester has made a very good suggestion here and that family counselling might work for you. It does seem clear that there are problems caused by difficulties in her early years and problems caused by how you react to each other now. You will both need help to change how you deal with rubbing against one another.

Some of it may just be ordinary pre-teen contrariness- arguing about bedtimes is not unusual even in the happiest families and with the most well adjusted pre-teens- but it does sound like there are huge problems in how you react to each other's moods.

I don't think there is much point in your blaming yourself for your dd's early life- you clearly were ill and unable to help yourself. But what you seem to be doing is to lay the responsibility on her instead- "she was her own person", you left her with her nanny because of the person she was. This take on things is never going to work: a 6yo is not responsible for the kind of person she is. And there is good evidence that rejcting a child in the early years can lead to serious emotional problems later.

What you need to do now is to say to yourself: yes, we have got problems, and I wish they weren't there, but since they are I will do the responsible thing and get help for all of us.

[Parietal]

I was struck by your comment that your DD has everything, eg a 32 inch TV. Kids don't need TVs, they need cuddles. Even moody 12 yr olds need love and cuddles. And when she is being impossible, she probably needs that love even more. It is not easy or natural to do, but recognising that things are wrong and getting help is the first step. as Hester says, you will need to deal with this as a family. It can get better but will take work.

[GetOrf]

Ithink you definitely need some family therapy.

From a very young age your daughter was rejected and neglected. You were responsible for that, and now you have to take responsibility for the fact that she is now a holy terror aged 12. The two things are inextrricably linked.

I am not wanting to kick someone when they are down, but you do seem to post with a certain sense of detachment towards your daughter, and as if the behaviour is somehow her fault. It isn't. She is behaving like she is because that is the only way to get attention from you. You never wanted her and have made that apparent - it doesn't matter that you have 'said' you loved her (but not backed it up with actions) and given her loads of stuff, none of that matters. You haven't given your daughter the most important thing, which is unconditional love and attention. No matter what you say or do she will pick up on yout general disdain for her - hence the behaviour.

Your daughter probably knows she is at the bottom of the list of importance for you - presumably you put your husband and second child before her, and have done for many years.

I am glad that CAMHS is involved, however not much will happen unless you actually take some responsibility. You are saying hiow bad you feel mentally and how hard everything is. I know how you feel - I have been in a fog of severe depression for years - but you are an adult and can understand how you are feeling, and know what you need to do to fix it. Your daughter is 12. She is probably feeling 10 times worse, has felt worthless and rejected by her mother for most of her life. SHE is the important one here.

However, if you dislike her so viscerally, i am also tempted to say it is not worth the effort, as you possibly will not change. And the poor kid will have to spend her teens coming to the realisation that she is disliked. Would it be worth considering your dd going back to live with your mum?

I do feel very sorry for you, and I am sorry if this is harsh, but you have got to start putting your daughter first for once. You are at quite serious risk of her having severe mental issues when she gets older. You suffer from mental illness yourself - surely you do not want to wish that on your daughter?

[nenevomito]

I think your daughter has spent the first 12 years of her life feeling unwanted, which by your own admission, she was. Probably the only way she got attention from you was when you were reacting to her behaviour and that pattern is carrying on.

These are deep seated problems and I really do think that family therapy could help, but you need to be prepared to really work at this and your relationship and examine closely the way you see your daughter. As someone else has said, you've written about how independent she was - at an age when actually, she wasn't, but you wanted her to be.

You may be able to turn this around, but I should imagine that its going to be hard. I doubt you can 'undo' what is done, but you can certainly work on making it better. External and professional intervention can only help.

[cory]

I think it might be worth for you think a little about what this "love" is that children need to grow up into healthy individuals.

As GetOrf says, it has nothing to do with material possessions- many children grow up in poor households and know without doubt that they are loved. Other children grow up in households where parents prioritise spending quite strictly and don't buy them lots of things and those children still know they are loved.

Time spent together is important, but on its own it is not love.

Taking trouble for somebody is a good thing in love, but on its own it is not love.

Saying "I love you" is also important, but on its own it does not equal love. Not even if it is heartfelt at the time.

Love is knowing that whatever happens, whatever you do, you are mine and I will never reject you. I may get very angry, I may punish you, I may say things I later regret, but nothing can come between the fact that you are mine and I will put your wellbeing before any other consideration.

The reason your dd distrusts love is that she has been rejected by all the adults who could have given it to her: you ignored when she was tiny, sent her away when she was still little, then her grandparents rejected her, and now you are rejecting her again by putting the blame on her.

You have a chance to change that message: to say to her, yes I know we are in the shit, we need help and I am going to organise it, because I cannot bear to give up on our relationship once more. It will take a horrendous amount of time- but that is also love.

[SenoritaViva]

This is a such a sad post and there are so many issues within your post it is difficult to pick through everything. I think you need to separate all the problems out.

Firstly there are your own problems. You sound like you had a rough deal in the beginning and did not cope with it very well. You seem very honest and open about this though, which is a good start. However, it is 12 years of guilt and / or problems so I really recommend that you have some counselling of your own. I also think your GP is right, you have a tough journey ahead of you and ADs will probably help in the short term.

Secondly there is your daughter. Her problems (neglect, feeling unloved, much change in her life etc.) have been going on for 12 years, they are deep rooted and will need far more than a little effort for things to change. You say you love her, but she probably knows you don't like her. A child does not understand how you can love but not like someone and so she cannot understand this (as an adult and a parent of course others do). So, in not liking her, she believes you don't love her.

Some of your actions, like not getting out of bed until she has left tells her you don't love her, that you are trying to avoid her. What do you like about your daughter? Start thinking about this. When she is not crashing and banging, what are her lovely traits that she is trying very hard to hide and mask? Think carefully about these and make sure she knows that you have seen this and that you think this is a really brilliant part about her. What is she good at? Value these, then when she is playing up you can balance that behaviour with what you don't value. If you always focus on what you don't like then your daughter will feel worthless.

Your daughter does need counselling and help, on her own, she has a lot to work through. You will then need it together to work things through and help one another out.

Lastly I suspect you have some issues with your DH that you need to sort out, only once they are sorted will family therapy work out IMO.

It is a long to do list, if I were you for now I would focus on your daughter and your relationship. This is what is having the greatest impact on your life and I suspect if things are not as horrible with her you and your husband will be less frustrated with each other.

Good luck OP, it will be a long hard fight, but worth it for your daughter. Don't feel bad that you didn't bond, it is in the past and has happened, what you can change is your future together.

[hester]

That's brilliant advice from cory, darlyd. Can I just check one other thing? You say you don't come out of your bedroom until she has left in the morning, and you work evenings. How much time do you actually spend with your daughter? Do you think she doesn't know that you are hiding from her? Did you give her the flatscreen TV in the hope that she wouldn't leave her room?

I'm not being picky for the sake of it; just wonder if you realise that the messages your actions are sending to your daughter will be much louder than the words coming out of your mouth...

[SenoritaViva]

By the way I also recommend changing the way your see your daughter. At the moment you seem to think that 'my daughter is a horrible, difficult person'. I think you should change this to 'my daughter is acting like a horrible person because she is pushing everyone away so that she does not have to experience rejection again. It is not her that I don't like, it is her behaviour which is simply her coping strategy'.

[darlyd]

Wow thank you everyone.

Can I just say the mornings I do not get up with DD1, she does come into my room to steal my hair serum, and I say to her, Don't forget your water, have a nice day, love you. And I often write little notes and put them in her pencil case, be nice, be happy, you are loved. I tell her all the time I love her.

She does not spend much time in her room, as it's so tiny, her bed is on top of her wardrobes, DH has promised for so long he will look into extending the house over the garage for a new bedroom for us, then DD could have ours, but nothing is set in motion, he drags his feet to much.

I was not brought up to good, I was also ignored, shouted at, and "bought". And my elder brother was favourite, I left home at 16. My mother and I had a much better relationship when I left home. It's obviously rubbed off on me with my DD, she also suffered with depression, and it all came out when I was struggling and moved back home when DD was 5 I was in such a bad place, I came off all my meds at the time, she told me she suffered, and also threw me down the stairs when I was a toddler. :(, she never had no support, my Dad worked away a lot.

I never had no help with DD until she was 4, as my mum did not do babies.

My marriage, well I don't know wtf is going on, I don't know how I feel, I love hi to bits, But I think I am pushing him away, I am never happy, always miserable, angry and upset. I hate work, but need the money because DH does not give me enough to survive on, I buy the food, pay elec, DD school money, guides, youth club, and pocket money (sometimes).

You need to understand too, It's DD that is making me feel this way, she does not do nothing, has no respect, and is horrible in school, I have NEVER let on to her I don't love her, she is very clever mentally, know's exactly what she is doing, not so in school, can't tell the time, can't do her times tables, always disruptive, always after a boyfriend.

I dread every day I really do. I just don't know where to start.

We are going on a family holiday next weekend, my parents, brother and his wife will be there too, I am looking forward to it, but also dreading it as she gets away with murder with my mum. They never rejected her, my DAD just gave my mum ultimatum him or her, as she was causing trouble between them, my Mum is like making up for the way I was treated, she always takes DD side.

You would think, this gorgeous weather would make me happy, but it's not. I don't understand.

[dollius]

I'm really sorry, but what is standing out from your post to me is that you do not really view your daughter as a person with feelings, emotions, problems of her own.
She comes off as a bit of a nuisance to you, an inconvenience. And you sound terribly sorry for yourself.
You talk at length about your own problems, your depression etc and you seem to be taking lots of steps to seek help for yourself, but what have you done for her?
Do you even recognise that she is having a lot of problems in herself that she can't possibly be expected to understand or do anything about?
Could she be suffering from anxiety and depression as well?
It doesn't sound as if she has experienced a lot of love in her life, frankly, and I don't think it is very surprising that she is kicking back against you now. She is probably feeling a lot of pain and anger, but she probably doesn't even recognise these emotions as such, certainly not enough to articulate them.
Why can't you start focusing on what she really needs? As posters above have said, she does not need television sets and god knows what else, she needs to know that her mother loves her and is there to support her, come what may.

[darlyd]

Going back to when she stayed with my Mum for 6 months, she decided to come live with us because she was causing so much trouble she had many people after her. And now it's going on up here. It's like she is a pitbul she thinks bad behaviour is good. She think's no means yes.

Had to call police on her one evening, we had a lovely day, painting nails, shopping etc, then she wanted to go skating we said she could go for first session 6.30-8 but not till 10, she freaked out, smashed our front door glass panel, carried on freaking out, had to call police to help calm her down.

It's so bad. I can't understand I try so hard, I never let on to her I don't like her, I treat her as a normal child, BUT she acts like this when she is told no?

[darlyd]

Dollius - If you read proply you will see I am not seeking help for myself, but for her, CAF and CAHMS are involved now. But not seen CAF, CAHMS are seeing us again, as they recognize a problem with her mentally. she may have ADHD (her sperm donor has this) but it's not been diagnosed as such.

She is not a burden on us, no way, we love her to bits, and want to help her, but she bites at us. Wish I could have a 24hour camcorder here, you would all see what I mean.

She lies, steals, and is horrid to every child that walks near her.

If she can not get what she wants, she goes mad, In school last week, PE told her to get changed bk to uniform for last lesson, she argued, then went and flushed her shirt down the toilet so she didn't need to get changed. :(

[RitaMorgan]

You say you never let on that you don't love her - but she probably knows how you feel on some level. Children know.

[cory]

"You need to understand too, It's DD that is making me feel this way"

Well, if you think about it, your dd could quite well have said that about you in the early days- that wouldn't really have solved any problems, would it? You needed help then, she needs help now. You speak of your husband helping you out of your depression as a natural and good thing, but you won't take the same attitude towards your dd's depression: she is causing problems, which is not the way you speak of yourself when you were depressed.

And how good would you feel about your mum telling you that her rejection of you as a small child was all because of your personality?

"They never rejected her, my DAD just gave my mum ultimatum him or her, as she was causing trouble between them"

Can you imagine a bigger rejection than that for a vulnerable child? Particularly one who already has been rejected once by her mother. It is well known that this is precisely the kind of rejection that causes attachment problems- which is why adopted children often struggle.

Remember, your dd will be surrounded by families where this does not happen, where the whole family would rather go down together than abandon one vulnerable individual. Of course she asks herself why she can't have that kind of love, rather than the kind that buys television sets. Telling her you love her won't matter if she doesn't believe you really love her- as per my definition in my earlier post. And that means stop blaming her, realise that she is suffering, telling yourself that if my daughter is suffering helping her is my first priority.

You really must get help. And you must learn to talk about it as a family problem, not one you can solve by taking your dd out of the equation.

[SenoritaViva]

'You need to understand too, It's DD that is making me feel this way, she does not do nothing, has no respect, and is horrible in school, I have NEVER let on to her I don't love her'

Right, I think you need to look at this differently. You have created your daughter the way that she is. Stop blaming her and start taking some responsibility. Yes, she might be behaving badly now, but that is because of what she has been through. All this blame and 'you are making me feel depressed' etc. WILL get through to her. You might not say it and you may never have let on that you don't love her but it shows in other ways. You might see her before she goes to school because she comes into your room to steal your serum (is that really stealing? Or is it using? Because if it's stealing then you should stop her as you are sending mixed messages that stealing is OK sometimes. If it is borrowing then use the right words). But you lying in bed saying bye and I love you is passive, anyone can mumble a few words. Getting up and being there for her shows you care. And I am not saying all parents need to do this but your daughter has been through so much you need to start making the effort NOW.

As Dollius said, you seem to have quite a victim attitude. This comes across in your description of DH, moaning about not getting on with an extension but also that you are short of money. Building an extension is a big thing so maybe there are reasons for not doing it yet.

Your dad DID reject her. He said it's her or me. That is rejection.

I understand that you did not have good role models as parents and therefore that can be a challenge for you, but you are the only person that can change this.