New! EU wants to forbid forward facing car seats

[MissHH]

Read more here:

kidsincars.blogspot.com/2008/06/new-european-research-children-should.html

What do you think? I can clearly understand why looking at that report.

[FairyMum]

Rearfacing is the way forward!

[MissHH]

I agree with you! It will be nice when they make RF seats more available across Europe.

I live in Norway so I have the luxury of having RF seats easily available.

I think it's a shame that the right authority's haven't done anything about this until now, but this is a good start.

[MissHH]

Have you read the post or the study? I hope that most people understand the seriousness of this. This is about life and death in sadly very many accidents.

We are talking about FF for car seats for children age 0-4. Therfore the word car seat, if I meant highback boosters I would have used that word

[MissHH]

If you are concerend about the legrom please read this:

kidsincars.blogspot.com/2007/09/bent-or-crossed-legs-are-not-dangerous.html

[FairyMum]

Yes, the studies really speak for themselves on this issue. LOL at lack of face-to-face contact. Hopefully as a driver you should not have too much face-to-face contact with your children while driving anyway. Also, you can get little mirrors in the back so you can still see your child if you must.

[MissHH]

Yes, there are several mirrors for this use. Then you can look in the little mirror in the front and se your child in the mirror at te back.

And face to face contact parent to child in the car... That doesn't sound like a very good driver to me

[Pixiepants]

I'm still amazed at so many peoples negative responses to this tried and tested safer product. My (pretty intelligent) neighbour thinks I'm being over protective with my DD's new RF seat and her response was that she "just drives safely" Duh! Who doesn't?

I was going to start a thread on this later MissHH so thanks!

I'm also in the process of getting the report to out MP,road safety officer and local news, and although I'd prefer to just see the seats available in more shops so parents can make an informed choice, I'm starting to realise that legislation might be the only way to protect the majority of children as so many parents are reluctant to see the dangers of FF in a collision.

[DaisySteiner]

The only thing I would say with this is that ds3 was really very very unhappy in a rear-facing seat and although I tried very hard to keep him in it as long as possible (he was over 1 when I turned it round) it got to the stage where he would actually just get out of the seat himself when he was rear-facing which IMHO is a lot more dangerous than being front-facing! And yes, we did try all the gadgets to stop him escaping but he was Houdini-baby! Once he was front-facing he was happy to stay in the car seat.

[FairyMum]

I am not sure if legislation is the way forward. I think some children can get very car sick when travelling rearfacing and the seats are very big so I think could be difficult to have two of them in a smallish car if you have 2 children in this age-range. These seats do obstruct the view and create a blind spot. I would not feel comfortable with a blind spot on two sides.

Is it just me who think British people in general are very resistant to take information of this type aboard?

[misdee]

good!

i am looking at the concord ultimax for #4. its birth to 4, but can be kept rearfacing till child weighs little over 28lb, two of my children didnt reach this weigth till around 4 years old anyway. one was this weight at under a year old though, so its a gamble i'm going to have to take really.

[missorinoco]

28 lb at 1 year. wow! your poor back.
interesting link.

[misdee]

she was my giant baby. she was 9lb born and just didnt stop growing. she is still well above average in height and weight for her year group at age 5.

[MissHH]

I'm sure that for children with special needs there will be an opportunity to go to the doctor to get a permission to use a FF seat. If one really needs it that is. THere are far more FF children than there needs to be.

[NineYearsOfNappies]

But not all children can use high back boosters MissHH. Some children need car seats up til the age of ten or older, children with physical disabilities who need the extra support.

And some children can't cope in the rear facing ones anyway - it was much safer to have my dd in a forward facing seat as early as possible so that I could see her, make sure she was breathing and wasn't silently vomiting than it was to have her her rearfacing where she'd have been safer in a crash, but where my chances of having that crash were much higher for trying to get a glimpse of her through the mirror and work out whether she was breathing or not.

I'm all for making rear facing seats more widely available, I just don't think you should make the forward facing ones illegal.

[Pixiepants]

I agree FairyMum. Choice would be tonnes better than legislation. And it's not just you re. the UK attitude to carseat safety, although I'm a Brit, and as soon as I heard about the benefits of RF I realised that I couldn't get a FF as I'd planned...it was a no brainer for us. Also feel obliged to let others know so that they can decide....it's frightening that technology is so more advanced than the info UK parents are receiving on this.

Its a bit complicated too. I can understand why manufacturers/retailers don't push the product when they're trying their hardest to stop people going FF too soon and just making sure the seats are fitted properly....but how can UK parents ask for a product when they don't know it exists.

[Pixiepants]

Nineyears, from the age of 4, most childrens head's/ necks are in proportion to their bodies and strong enough to go FF safely.

[misdee]

my dd1 will be in the car seat till she is tall enough to be out of one,. that is age 11 i belive.

[edam]

Interesting study. I do wonder though, how much of the avoidable injury and death in front-facing seats is because dangerous products are allowed onto the market. Which? tests have repeatedly found seats on sale that are just not good enough - that disintegrate in crashes, for instance. If all seats had to perform to Which? standards, not the current legal minimum (Which? tests at 40mph front and side impact, law only demands 30mph front impact) then forward facing seats would be a darn lot safer anyway.

And if FF seats were the law, manufacturers would have to change car design so luggage in the boot didn't hammer into children. There would have to be a mass education campaign so parents with older cars didn't overload the boot.

[Pixiepants]

According to the AA 7/10 carseats are incorrectly fitted Edam, so this too increases the risks to young children when travelling. However, this does not take away from the fact that RF is 5 times safer than FF for children upto age 4 (approx).

The whole issue about re-eduacating car users is long over due in this country when you consider that these seats have been standard in Scandinavian countries for more than 20 years. (I think they've been in existence for 40?)

[FairyMum]

Scandinavians generally speaking drive much older cars than Brits because cars much more expensive.

[Pixiepants]

I'm still ploughing through the full report in each spare minute, and have just read that basically car body shells have become stiffer in the past 10 years to protect adults in frontal collisions. However this is increasing the risks to children as carseat designs aren't keeping up with car manufacturers. This is another reason why all technical bodies agree that RF is by far the safest way for children up to about 4 years to travel.

So if FairyMum is correct and more people in the UK are driving newer cars it's even more reason to see RF carseats more readily available here?

[MissHH]

NineYearsOfNappies : I do not think you understand. It will be legal for older kids to sit FF. And I am sure that for children with special needs there will be an opptunity for buying FF seats. But as long as the majority turn their kids FF way too soon than I really cannot see that there is any other way to do this.

[MissHH]

If I have understood correctly.. In this study there is cases of 8 children killed in car accidents in England. 6 of them would have survived if the sat in a RF car seat

[SparklyGothKat]

My DS1 is 10 1/2 and still in a high back booster, and will be until he is tall enough, but atm he is only 128cm tall