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What is the matter with these men? (Not funny)

(181 Posts)
Janh Wed 04-Feb-04 13:22:00

Another one who killed most of the family and then jumped off a bridge - left the baby in the car this time

BBC

dinosaur Wed 04-Feb-04 13:25:03

Oh that is just heartbreaking.

This seems all too common! I agree with you Janh - what is the matter with these men?

lilibet Wed 04-Feb-04 13:25:56

there seems to be a case like this every week at the moment. They are all so sad, but what on earth makes the men do it?
I don't think that I have ever seen a similar case with a woman, has anyone else?


btw Janh, thanks for the cheque

Northerner Wed 04-Feb-04 13:26:47

God only knows Jan.

Makes my blood go cold reading this. Tragic.

emmatmg Wed 04-Feb-04 13:27:14

Kayleigh Wed 04-Feb-04 13:29:29

Oh god, that poor baby.

How could anyone do that two those beautiful little girls.

Awful, just awful.

handlemecarefully Wed 04-Feb-04 13:30:38

Is there a word for women who don't like men ?(the equivalent of mysogny) because I know its not very pc, but I am increasingly finding myself in that category

lydialemon Wed 04-Feb-04 13:35:48

Not excusing the bloke at all, but I remember a program about this a couple of years ago. The explanation they came up with was that, in the fathers irrationality leading up to the suicide, they truly believed the family would be better off with them, than being left behind. So, they do it because they love them.......bit scarey I think

There does seem to be an awful lot lately though.

fio2 Wed 04-Feb-04 14:00:33

god how awful they all looked so lovely, what a waste. I really never understand men like this

aloha Wed 04-Feb-04 14:02:18

The men are often violent to their wives - often with a long history. They believe they own their wives and their children, and I think they like the power they can exercise over them. And what is the greatest power of all? That of life or death.

Nicksie Wed 04-Feb-04 14:12:52

Message withdrawn

WideWebWitch Wed 04-Feb-04 14:13:23

Awful.

Tom Wed 04-Feb-04 15:06:34

Horrible.

It's called "misandry" when you hate men.

And it's not just men who do this.

What's wrong with anyone who can even hurt a child - I've no idea.

handlemecarefully Wed 04-Feb-04 15:11:46

Tom,

On dispassionate reflection, I'm not ready to be a 'misandrist' yet - and I apologise for my prejudices. I really must do better since I am about to bring a baby son into this world, and I don't want to raise him with a complex about his gender!

dinosaur Wed 04-Feb-04 15:12:26

But there don't seem to be many stories about women killing their former partners and their children?

Twinkie Wed 04-Feb-04 15:18:21

Was a cutting edge about a guy who did this ages ago and I think a thread too - all his friends forgave him as well as his wives family (he slaughtered his wife, their 3 kids and then killed himself) - everyone said it was completely unlike him and he must have just flipped - it was all done so coldly and calculated though - not like someone who had flipped - mind you if it was mental illness and I believe that not everyone of the men can have just been evil to the core maybe we should at least try to understand it no matter how abhorent we find it.

Tom Wed 04-Feb-04 15:19:09

A possible reason (please note: not excuse - reason) is that because 96% of post separation residence orders are granted to women, there simply aren't many women driven insane by lack of contact with their children - maybe?

eddm Wed 04-Feb-04 15:19:48

Aloha's right – often triggered by wife leaving them or belief that wife is having an affair.

dinosaur Wed 04-Feb-04 15:25:04

But if my DH left me and got residence for the kids, then whilst I might entertain murderous thoughts towards him, or suicidal thoughts myself, I cannot imagine how I could ever take it out on my kids. I just cannot imagine it.

eddm Wed 04-Feb-04 15:26:23

Tom, something like 5,000 women have been wrongly separated from their children by the family courts system – see the Roy Meadows thread – and yet none of them has physically attacked the social workers or lawyers involved, let alone their children. And that's not just for practical reasons as some women do have contact visits. But I've never heard of a woman using a contact visit for violence, whereas sadly there are cases of men using these visits to attack or kill their former partners and kids. It's about power. Some men need to dominate and control their wives and children and hate the thought that their familes might escape them. In extreme cases this leads to murder.

Tom Wed 04-Feb-04 15:27:04

Nice to hear handlemecarefully...

The last thing a boy needs is a mum who hates men. They need people who respect men and women equally and on merit.

Did you know that boys and girls who grow up with highly involved fathers or father figures have much more equal views about men and women?

Tom Wed 04-Feb-04 15:28:59

Quite agree eddm, although there is a level of misery, frustration and despair among separated fathers that I don't think you'll ever grasp.

Nothing excuses violence and control though, and in many of these cases, the violence started well before the separation.

Twinkie Wed 04-Feb-04 16:57:09

Tom - I have been through 14 months of being seperated from my DD and I did contemplate suicide more than once believe me but would not have harmed a hair on my daughters head - these men if they are doing it for the reason you say are heartless awful bastards - if they are mentally ill I understand to a degree but I have lived with the sepeartion, the unfairness and the utter despair and not once would I have raised a hand to my DD let alone killed her.

I did not kill myself because I thought that would be even more detrimental to my daughetr than being seperated from me - but killing her???

As for the last 3 cases where the man has killed there spouse that I have heard of none of the men were seperated or divorced or thought there wives were having an affair.

And if you loked into the statistics I am sure that your reasoning would not add up - there are countless women in this country that are in despair at being seperated from their children (my sister is one of them) and I know that she would not dream of harming her child or think that taking them with them to a better place would be preferential to letting them be alive.

Sorry but I do think jumping on the 'Families need Fathers' bandwagon here is a bit lame when talking about this emotive issue.

eddm Wed 04-Feb-04 17:21:50

Oh Tom, I am capable of sympathy for separated fathers (my parents divorced when I was 8) but this thread was about men who kill their families.

dinosaur Wed 04-Feb-04 17:27:47

As for regarding it as a possible reason - that's a pretty terrifying scenario for any woman who is trying to pluck up the courage to leave her violent/abusive partner or husband, isn't it

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