Bad morning drop off

[SunnyG0507]

Had a really bad morning drop off and I'm still very upset now.

DS is 22 months and usually cried a short while when I drop him off but after some cuddles from the staff he was usually be ok and started to play by himself.

This morning, however, I was standing outside hearing his crying last for quite a long time, and from crying even to a screaming. Although I cannot see what happened inside as they covered the small windows on the room door with the Halloween deco, I can tell no one actually responded to his crying for cuddles. Then I heard one of the staff spoke loudly to him twice "Can you please STOP CRYING?" In the end I had to enter into the room again and gave him a cuddle. He was quiet down then. The staff asking him to stop crying said " we tried to cuddle him but he kept crying" which was apparently not true! In the end I had to stay for much longer and calmed down DS until another staff held him going to the garden. I left the nursery after seeing DS ok /no crying in the other staff arm.

DS is a bit clingy at this stage but I'm really unhappy with the staff shout at him to stop crying. How can this work for a 22 months toddler? I'm concerned what happened when we were not there every day. Probably the time to change the nursery.

[alittlebitofritasallineed]

Yes that would be a red flag for me, has anything else happened you're unhappy with?

[Tumbleweed101]

Was the staff member one he usually likes? If it was someone he doesn’t know so well sometimes it can make them cry more if that person tries to give them a cuddle.

However what you heard said is different and I’d be upset by that if said in an angry way.

[2018ismyyear2018]

That for me would be sufficient to withdraw my child. I think it is absolutely unacceptable to say that to a child who is distressed at drop off and I would worry about what happened during the rest of the day.

My experience of nurseries is that quality can vary massively even amongst so called outstanding nurseries. I've just changed my daughter after 7 weeks of crying at drop off and staff making no effort to address the issue and I'm so pleased. The new nursery is so friendly and she is definitely happier.

Good luck Op.

[confusedmomm]

We had this happen. We ended up removing him from that nursery and finding a great childminder (who looks after another 2 same age kids) instead. The difference was crazy. He went from crying when I dropped him off and picked him up to running inside excited and not saying bye in the space of 10 days.

[confusedmomm]

I would def look for an alternative to where he currently is

[YellowStickies]

How horrible :( Time to move and make sure the manager knows why!

[kayakingmum]

How does he seem when you pick him up? If he seems really happy every time it's probably okay.
If not, I would try to find another nursery.
It doesn't sound like a caring place to me.

[MySkirtHasPockets]

How long has he been attending this setting? Any other causes for concern with them?

Was his key person there when you dropped off?

I would certainly speak to the room leader in the first instance and the manager too to find out why they responded to your son like they did.

It doesn't sound good but I would investigate further before moving him to a new setting. I work in the early years and if I found out one of my staff behaved like this towards a child, I would definitely be investigating further.

How do you know they didn't try to cuddle him if the window was covered? Just wondering what happened that lead to a member of staff telling him to stop crying in the way you describe (NOT the I'm saying that was acceptable).

Even if you do decide to remove him from the setting, please speak to the manager and tell him/her what you witnessed so that they can deal with it.

[SunnyG0507]

Hi all, thanks a lot for all your advice! What worried me a lot is that the staff told him to stop crying was actually his key worker, although she never bother to talk to me when I drop off or pick up DS. It was always someone else welcomed DS in the morning or gave me some brief info on his day when I picked him up. To be honest I never know what a key worker is for in that nursery as there is no special connection between DS and his key workers.

I can tell no one gave him any cuddle because I can hear their voices for their location in the room. In the end I went in the room as a sort of surprise for the staff and I can see where they were. The staff were far away from DS( it is a big room). There were 18 ~2 years toddlers in the room but just 2 staff, at least when I was in that room for ~ 20mins to calm down DS. I've also seen other kids left crying on their own before, inside on the floor or outside in the cold windy days, while the staff just ignored the crying kids and just chatting next to them. Sometimes I couldn't help comforting the crying kids a bit by saying something or reminding they staff but they just thought that was normal.

Feeling so bad the whole day. When I picked up DS he seems ok though, but really considering moving to another nursery if possible, although it maybe not that easy for such short notice.

[LaPufalina]

OP I took my 19mo DD out of nursery for a similar reason (albeit issues at pick up rather than drop off) and I've moved her to a different nursery. I thought that randomly crying kids was normal, but none do it at her new place!

[MySkirtHasPockets]

That sounds terrible, I would definitely take him out of the nursery and find somewhere more caring.

Do speak to the manager though and let them know exactly what you've seen and heard, it needs dealing with.

[Orlande]

2 staff for 18 under 2s is completely unacceptable, there should be an adult for every 3 children. No wonder they can't comfort them.

[SunnyG0507]

The room is supposed for the 2+ toddlers but DS was moved to this room at 20 months, then stayed with 2-3 years old kids together. The nursery has 1 baby room for under 2, 2 toddler rooms for 2-3 years old and 1 preschool room for 3+. However, they merge the rooms together from time to time which probably due to lack of staff on that day. This morning the 18 kids included a group from the baby room and the group from toddler room1, with only 2 staff from the toddler room. The other day when I picked up DS, they merged the two toddler rooms and again there were only 2 staff. Didn't count the kids number but looked like 15+ at least. DS was sitting alone in a corner, playing blocks on his own with eyes full of tears, while all the other older kids sitting in a circle together with one staff far away, doing nothing when I came in. I was shocked to see this and wondered whether DS was published to have some cooling time? The answer was no. They said he just didn't want to sit together with them after 20mins story telling, so he cried and then allowed to play the blocks by himself. DS could not speak a full sentence at the stage, just learning to speak some words. No wonder why more than 20mins story time seems not attractive to him at all. I had a really bad feeling when seeing him sitting alone there with tears far away from all the other kids, but didn't know what to do at that moment except giving him a cuddle. Really hope DS will not have any bad memories for this.

[Pigeonpresent]

I would be calling Ofsted there is a lot wrong here I’m afraid OP

[toomanyeastereggsurghh]

This is one of the reasons I’m not a fan of nurseries for under 3’s. It’s just not the best environment for little ones, I personally would always choose a childminder or nanny.

[MySkirtHasPockets]

toomany that is your opinion. A good nursery (and I don't mean good by ofsted's standards) can be a brilliant thing for many many children.

There is a thread on Mumsnet at the moment about a childminder who is clearly not very good at her job (ops child is being bitten repeatedly and childminder is not dealing with the issue). There is often an assumption that home based childcare is better for the youngest children but that is not necessarily the case (although I'm not sure whether you're of that opinion or just of the opinion that under threes should be at home with a parent?). Not trying to derail but This is something I feel passionate about.

This nursery is clearly inadequate. Ratio for early years settings (adult:child) are as follows:

Under 2 - 1:3
2-3 - 1:4
3+ - 1:8 (or 1:13 if level 6 qualified).

I would be very concerned about the management of a nursery where all of those things are happening. If you make a complaint to the setting, they have to keep a record of it and ofsted will be very interested in what you have described.

Contacting ofsted is also an option, what you have described would probably trigger a no notice inspection (no chance for them to try and cover things up and just put a show on for the day!!).