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Self employed nanny?

(16 Posts)
Myusername2015 Wed 08-Nov-17 15:05:56

Hi all; been speaking to a possible nanny who is self employed (checked this status out with paperwork etc) she says this has all been accepted by hmrc. She divides her time between families and has 3 regulars. I would be using her 2 days a week. She has one other family on 2 full days and the others on ad hoc basis. Do I need to personally call hmrc to check this? Will they discuss this with me? Every site I can find says I have to employ her personally and that she can’t be self employed. Thanks

RicStar Wed 08-Nov-17 15:09:19

It's not one status for her - it's one status per job. If she is working fixed hours for you / under your instruction / can't substitute / can't cancel then she is probably an employee in your role. If you are ok employing her then just offer to do that - the risk of getting it wrong is on you i.e. you will have to pay costs / fines.

Swizzlesticks23 Wed 08-Nov-17 15:12:30

Can she not just invoice you each week or month ? It's up to her to determine her own ir35 status

Is she set up as a Ltd company or ?

Marcine Wed 08-Nov-17 15:17:30

She's likely to be self employed for the ad hoc work but employed with you if she is doing set days and you're requiring her personally to be at your house eg 8-6 Mon & Tues.

AlexanderHamilton Wed 08-Nov-17 15:24:34

Swizzlestiks advice is poor. It would be the employer (you) who would be liable for unpaid national insurance etc contributions if HMRC found you to be an employer.

As Ricstar says, employment status is determined for each individual job, not an individual person. Ad hoc/short term nannying would be classed as self employed. Regular hours that you determine where you direct her time & she isn't allowed to send another nanny in her place would more than likely be classed as employed.

nannynick Wed 08-Nov-17 16:11:18

I agree, this is employment. Some nannies do not understand that you can have a mix of employed and self employed work.
You are not talking about casual babysitting, you want two days per week and you want them to turn up. Mutuality Of Obligation - they are obligated to work for you and you are obligated to provide work. Is that not going to be the case?

Do it as employed. Agree a gross salary. Provide a pension scheme (they would be automatically enrolled if you are paying £10,000+ and they are aged 22+).

Myusername2015 Wed 08-Nov-17 19:47:52

Thanks for the advice all; she doesn’t agree; unsure why she’d rather operate as self employed as surely that doesn’t have the security of pension payments etc so will keep looking.

nannynick Wed 08-Nov-17 20:56:26

Yeah keep looking. I am starting a one day a week job and the parents are doing it as me being an employee. Far better for me to be an employee and for them as they know they are doing the right thing and can tell me what to do.

Blondeshavemorefun Sun 12-Nov-17 16:33:06

She can ben employed by you but se in other jobs

Sadly many nannies want to be se as fiddle the tax

Ask her why she wants to be se

And yes if you dictate the hours and days it is employment

OliviaBenson Sun 12-Nov-17 16:47:48

I have my cleaner for 3hrs per week every Friday. She's self employed. I don't understand why it's not the same for a nanny? She has availability 2 day per week for hours as needed by the client?

jeanne16 Sun 12-Nov-17 19:09:01

Nannies are not allowed to be self employed. This is specified by HMRC. Unfortunately it is not up to you or the Nanny to decide this. You will incur a fine if it is found you are not paying her tax.

AlexanderHamilton Sun 12-Nov-17 19:13:47

Olivia - most cleaners bring their own equipment, as long as they do 3 hours it doesn't overly matter whether it's 10 am - 1pm or 11am -2pm. They tell you when they are unavailable & they could send another cleaner in their place if necessary.

AlexanderHamilton Sun 12-Nov-17 19:14:15

They also have many many more clients than a nanny.

Blondeshavemorefun Sun 12-Nov-17 22:47:05

Seems almost any profession that works in a home can be self employed - cleaners - gardeners - HK - ironing ladies - cooks

Just not nannies

MHarper Sun 12-Nov-17 23:56:53

Nannies can be self employed but it varies by job and there are requirements.

I'm self employed as I work for multiple clients at different times and dates, I don't have any set hours and can turn down work. If a job is set days/times and the nanny can't turn down the work then it will need to be employed. A nanny can be self employed and employed at the same time. For example, previously I was employed by a nursery and self employed for my ad hoc nanny work.

If she's self employed she misses out on benefits such as sick pay, maternity leave, holiday allowance however she gets to choose when she works so she could turn round and say she won't be available next week. She is also responsible for paying tax and NI but you can never be sure if it's all done legally.

Hmrc aren't always correct when you call up to ask, I know there are many nannies that are told they can be self employed when they should be employed.

Here are the requirements:
Make sure you double check as you could end up in a tricky spot if it's wrong.

Do make sure you agree a gross wage, previously nanny work has often been quoted in net but there's a lot of work to get it to gross. If you agreed net you could end up paying a lot more than expected.

Blondeshavemorefun Mon 13-Nov-17 12:39:00

Sorry I meant in a same day same hour set job , they can't be se

Where as a cleaner gardener etc can be even if they do every mon and thur 8-3 for example

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