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Should I allow XP to see his children?

(29 Posts)
Supercherry Mon 20-Jul-09 15:03:07

I don't know what to do for the best anymore. We have split up repeatedly for a while. He is verbally abusive, has serious anger issues and breaks things in the house, he threatens me.

He has told DS, 17mths, once to 'shut the fuck up' when he was crying.

He lacks patience with DS.

I am just picking out the bad bits.

On this basis, would you feel justified in cutting him out of DS's life aswell as my own?

I just want to do the right thing by DS and my unborn child, due October.

Overmydeadbody Mon 20-Jul-09 15:10:55

I think you might need to start with supervised contact, rather than cutting him out completely.

Legally, I don't think you could stop him from seeing his children though.

And from your DS's perspective, you don't want to do anything that he could turn around and blame you for later on in life, like blaming you for not having a father in his life.

It is a tricky situation, I know. I would have gone through the same but by ex is so crap he hasn;t bothered to visit for the last four years despite having open access. His loss.

You need to have no more to do with him though, apart from what is necessary for the children. Do you keep yo-yoing between being with him and not? You need to cut him out of your life emotionally.

mosschops30 Mon 20-Jul-09 15:12:48

You have no legal right to stop this twat from seeing his children Im afraid.
Best to do it on your terms rather than getting courts involved IMHO

JaneSa Mon 20-Jul-09 15:15:17

I think you may need to get some legal help.
Even if you want him out of your life the decision to take him out of your childs will never be yours to make.
I agree that supervised contact may be the safest way forward.
Do you have friends or family locally for support. Must be hard having a 17 month and being pregnant if your feeling alone. xxxx

Supercherry Mon 20-Jul-09 15:35:06

That's a sad story, overmydeadbody, but yes, it's definitley your XP's loss. I am finding it hard to cut off emotionally, I lasted 9 days last time and then it's as if something switches in my head and I begin to trivialise the verbal abuse and keep thinking of the good stuff. If I keep thinking of my DS and unborn baby though, I know I am doing the right thing. It would be unfair to bring them up in this environment.

It is going to be hard JaneSA, I have a little bit of support, but not much. I have been suffering with back pain making it difficult to pick up DS and put him to bed etc, I hope it clears up by the time the newborn arrives!

I think too, for my own sanity I need a good break at the very least from XP so I can emotionally distance myself from XP before contact starts.

Would this be reasonable? To stop him seeing DS for a little while, say 3mths, until after I've had DS2?

The thing is also, although legally I can't stop him, he doesn't want to go to court in case I highlight some illegal things that he has done.

JaneSa Mon 20-Jul-09 15:43:41

I am in the same situation (with the verbal ex bit, not the baby bit) but about 6 weeks further down the line than you.
I went back to him twice but on third occassion when i walked out with my children I knew it was the right thing to do. Now six weeks down the line things are hard, scary and i have to say i am petrified about the powers cafcass and the court have but, i still know it was the best thing i could do for my children and i feel like a wieght has been lifted off my shoulders. They are like different children, happy, fun and very loving. Good luck to you with evrything you do. x

Supercherry Mon 20-Jul-09 15:48:52

Thank you JaneSA, good luck to you too.

Niceguy2 Mon 20-Jul-09 16:29:46

I don't think based upon what you've said there's a case for "cutting him out" of your son's life.

But if lacking in patience and swearing once at your child is grounds for denying contact then Social Services would be inundated.

The question is "Would ex take reasonable care of your son?" And I stress the word reasonable. He won't of course take care of him to your standards since they are YOUR standards, not his.

If the answer is no then your choice is clear.

cestlavielife Mon 20-Jul-09 16:39:07

are the illegal things relevant to his care of the chidlren and to the childrens welfare?

if not then his lookout. he should be hauled up anywya - if you nwo he has done illegal things then you should tell police?

if they ARE relevant then have it go to court, he should not get away with it,

tho dont see any benefit in saying no contact for three months? for your child i mean.

dont folow tho if you with him now or not? if he living elsewhere what is current arrangement in terms of contact?

why not just go to mediation nnow and agree something?

Supercherry Mon 20-Jul-09 16:48:34

If reasonable is an objective word Niceguy, then please tell me what 'reasonable' care of a child amounts to.

XP would keep DS fed, changed etc but I'm concerned about DS's emotional wellbeing. Shouting frightens children, I don't want my child subjected to his dad's temper, impatience and swearing. XP thinks nothing of using words such as 'cunt' in front of my son.

Would a court have concerns, I don't know?

Supercherry Mon 20-Jul-09 16:52:28

Cestlavielife, XP is at his mum's. He only left yesterday so not discussed anything with him yet.

The break would be for me so I can clear my head and get through the next 3mths of pregnancy without being harassed. I don't want to hurt DS though obviously.

Supercherry Mon 20-Jul-09 16:55:08

I'm not sure whether a court would see the illegal things as relevant to his ability to care for his child. They have never affected DS to date.

It is possible he would go to prison though.

I'm not interested in informing the police- it's nothing to do with me and I don't know if he's doing it anymore anyway.

mosschops30 Mon 20-Jul-09 16:57:58

supercherry - if swearing in front of your child is your only concern then Im sorry but it just isnt enough!
Most of us would have been positively delighted with an XP who 'just' swore, well I would anyway!

It sounds like your whole basis for denying contact is for YOU to get your head sorted out and have some peace which is not reasonable.
If you have genuine concerns for ds and dont want to have anything to do with xp then either allow his parents or yours to supervise some contact, or go to a family centre and discuss it a mediation and possibly have contact take place there.

Im sorry but with the information youre giving you do sound incredibly selfish and although your xp may not be the ideal man he's certainly not as bad as some who get access and no the word cunt does not count as child abuse!

Supercherry Mon 20-Jul-09 17:03:52

Mosschops, you would not be 'positively delighted' with my XP, I can assure you, that is, unless you would like having an 18 stone bloke threaten to smash your face in and rant and rave and shout in your face because you have disagreed with something he has said. (In front of DS)

Obviously, I'm not in the best place emotionally at the moment, which is why I'm posing the whole contact question on here.

I know I should act reasonably, and I probably will, but I am only human and this time, I really don't feel like acting bloody reasonable. He doesn't deserve it.

mosschops30 Mon 20-Jul-09 17:06:39

Ahhh another drip feed thread! When youve filled us in on the whole story, I will come back and comment. Tis no use you giving us snippets of information then ranting because Ive said your unreasonable based on the information youve given.

FWIW even in court, him threatening you would hold no water, yes it sucks but that the family courts for you.

Supercherry Mon 20-Jul-09 17:25:57

Mosschops, I suggest you re-read my original post, I said he is 'verbally abusive, has serious anger issues and breaks things in the house, he threatens me'.

How am I drip feeding?

piscesmoon Mon 20-Jul-09 17:26:23

I should get legal advice-it sounds as if you think you can just stop him having contact and I'm sure this isn't the case.(or not if he fights it).

Supercherry Mon 20-Jul-09 17:28:03

I'm not ranting, if that's what you think I am doing, because you think I'm unreasonable. I'm agreeing with you it's likely I am being unreasonable. I objected to you saying anyone would be delighted with my XP.

Supercherry Mon 20-Jul-09 17:30:50

Piscesmoon, the question I posed is more a moral one than a legal one.

Legally, I know I couldn't stop him having contact, in reality though, I know he wouldn't take me to court so yes, I could stop him.

I was asking should I?

Overmydeadbody Mon 20-Jul-09 18:59:15

Supercherry from a moral point of view, you shouldn't try to stop your DS from seeing his father.

FWIW your ex may have aggressive abusive tendancies around you you he may have anger management issues with you but that could be because your relationshipo is just not right, for either of you, and brings out the worst in each of you.

That doesn't mean he will behave that way with his DS when he is looking after him. If you two argue together then just make sure you are not ever in that situation.

Let him see his DS, let your DS build up a relationship alone with his dad, independant of you.

You do not have to be involved, you could even have someone else do the handover if you think it would be better not to see your EX. So you split up yesterday?..... Make sure it's permenant.

Overmydeadbody Mon 20-Jul-09 19:08:14

If you want to do what is best for your children, then this is what I recommend you do:

Make sure this break from your ex is permenant, no more yo-yoing back and forth and holding on emotionally. You need a clean break.

Your children deserve consistancy in their lives, they will be much more settled and happy if their mummy and daddy don't keep living together and then living apart, being all lovely and then being shouty and angry and abusive. Don't let your children experience this kind of inconsistancy in their lives.

Your DS doesn't deserve to suddenly not see his dad for three months, he needs consistancy at this time of change, and that includes seeing his father and building up a relationship with his father independant of you.

Your ex deserves to at least have a chance to be a good involved dad, independant of you.

Lots of parents shout, without it affecting the children too much as it becomes the norm, so doesn't scare them. I'm not advocating his behaviour but I don't think you need to worry so much unless your DS is actually showing signs of being frightened of his dad.

GypsyMoth Mon 20-Jul-09 19:11:40

could he have access at his mums? is ex mil a good person,willing to do this and help out?

Supercherry Mon 20-Jul-09 19:48:48

Overmydeadbody, thanks for the advice. You're right, I will do the right thing, just having a bad day. It's all emotionally gutting to be honest. I am not above admitting that I bloody feel like hating the ex, I wish him ill, I feel like cutting up all of his clothes and giving his beloved bike to the tatters. The thought makes me giggle a bit.

I won't do any of this though, I will be the adult here. Just need to calm down over a few days.

It wasn't arguing lately in front of DS. I lost the will to argue to be honest, just sat there crying and feeling sorry for myself while he yelled and yelled and yelled. He would lose it over anything, the slightest disagreement. Pathetic I know. I begged him to stop in front of DS, DS got upset. It's all been a right mess.

The MIL has always been nice and civil but at the moment I don't feel like talking to any of them- she constantly praises him, she has no idea.

piscesmoon Mon 20-Jul-09 21:41:43

Morally you have to do what is best for the DCs, regardless of personal feelings-however it isn't a lot of help if the legal position doesn't give you a choice. It sounds as if you could do with some outside help and family mediation.

Overmydeadbody Mon 20-Jul-09 21:45:28

oh dear. Of course you are feeling that way right now, it is early days.

You need to give yourself some time to mourn what you have lost (or what you now realise you never had but wanted).

You are not a failure for this relationship coming to an end. You will get over it in time and your DS is young enough that he won't remember the shouting and crying etc.

You need to concentrate on rebuilding your life independantly, on rebuilding your happiness and self esteem and contntment, because once you are more content you will be able to make more rational (and less emotionally charged!) decisions for what is best for your DSs.

Good luck with everything. Don't feel you have to get over this instantly, allow yourself the feelings of hate and anger etc. towards your ex. Work through them and you will come out the other side feeling much better. I promise.

I was there too grin

Good luck. FWIW it sounds like you are better off without this ex. You'll

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