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So unfair that self-employed NRPs can get away with not paying maintenance

(19 Posts)
ScrambledEggAndToast Wed 23-Mar-16 18:09:01

I know this is a generalisation and I'm sure many SE NRPs do pay but I know it's a huge problem for the CMS, as it was for the CSA. My ex takes great joy in not paying a thing, insisting that he isn't earning anything. He won't even answer the phone when they call. I suspect that when he sees a private number, he ignores it in case it's them asking him to pay for his son how dare they If someone didn't pay their gas/electricity/council tax for four years and built up thousands of pounds in arrears then they would have been in court by now. Although they are trying, nothing seems to be happening very fast. It's so frustrating and so unfair.

Just wanted to get that out!

Namechanger2015 Wed 23-Mar-16 22:21:15

I hear you. My bastard ex is exactly the same. How do these men sleep at night when they are deliberately depriving their children.

And why can't CMA just demand a copy of their self-employed books or bank statements as a matter of course when the case is first opened??

ScrambledEggAndToast Fri 25-Mar-16 11:07:53

They should be ashamed. Plus, he is living with a woman who gets maintenance for two of her three children. So he's happy to spend another man's money but won't pay for his own son. I would bet on it that he'd be jumping up and down if this other man didn't pay his maintenance.

VertigoNun Fri 25-Mar-16 11:09:31

Someone on mn has started a petition on this.

LineyReborn Fri 25-Mar-16 11:13:04

I find it very strange that a government agency ie the CMS seemingly cannot or will not access tax records held by another government agency.

Why the hell can't the CMS and HMRC communicate with each other, when supporting children is involved? Who is there no political will to fix this?

tribpot Fri 25-Mar-16 11:28:22

Agreed. I'm self-employed (not an NRP) and like many SE people I pay myself in a tax-efficient way, which is a small salary and larger dividends. But it's not rocket science, I declare it all to HMRC. They manage to collect tax on all my income, whatever the source, I don't see why they couldn't figure out how to deduct CMS from it.

dontknowwhoiam Sun 27-Mar-16 00:08:38

Totally agree. I've just had a variation request succeed as I'd asked them to take into account my X's unearned income (dividends). There was an extra £25,000 that they were going to completely overlook had it not been for me getting on at them. They told me I couldn't apply for a variation, but I went ahead and done it anyway. Currently battling on with a mandatory reconsideration request as the additional income still doesn't come close to his actual earnings.

The system stinks. What other laws are there when you have nowhere to turn when someone breaks them.

I swing between being completely exasperated/angry and sick of dealing with it... To battling on for what my DCs deserve. It's time consuming and infuriating.

My X pretty much thinks it's hilarious that he doesn't have to give ME a penny. Doesn't actually consider that it's for the children.

SaveSomeSpendSome Sun 27-Mar-16 00:17:19

I did read somewhere that 80% of people who use the csa only get £5 a week.

tribpot Sun 27-Mar-16 06:56:51

I wonder if HMRC refuses to share tax records because it knows a good proportion of those wanting to evade CMS responsibility would falsify their tax returns and pay less tax?

CheeseAndOnionWalkers Mon 28-Mar-16 04:15:58

... Or some senior HMRC and politicians are using clever accounting loopholes to not paying the minimum amount of CM. hmm

tribpot Mon 28-Mar-16 07:19:28

Well, most of them will be salaried employees, I doubt they're exploiting the dividend loophole (although will have unearned income from other sources e.g. multiple properties and suchlike).

TheRegularShow Fri 08-Apr-16 08:27:06

Please Sign this petition regarding child maintenance

toothgenie Fri 22-Apr-16 20:48:03

I've just signed this, I can't believe there have only been 616 signatures. My children's father delights in avoiding his responsibility to them. I also believe that he's hoping they don't carry over the outstanding debt of £4000 from the csa to the cms. He hasn't done a tax return since 2010! He's self 'un'employed! I don't know how they can sleep at night.

ArrestedDevelopment Fri 22-Apr-16 21:07:03

Toothgenie it's disheartening that people aren't getting behind what should be a no brainer.
You'd be surprised though there is women against this petition as they are second wives/partners and they don't want their partner to support their other children as it affects theirs

foragogo Fri 22-Apr-16 21:11:12

I don't get this either. HMRC manage to tax me on my dividend. The fee paying schools take them into account when calculating bursaries (via tax returns) so why aren't they able to use them.when calculating child maintenance? Are they actually not declaring them in which case aren't they going to get massively done for tax evasion?

KP86 Fri 22-Apr-16 21:21:38

In Australia they take it from your tax return if you don't pay properly.

WorldTraveller1988 Mon 12-Jun-17 06:42:28

Even those who are Self Employed will have to submit a Self Assessment Tax Return each year. This will include details of all income; salary, dividends, bonus. Copies of Accounts are also available from Companies House at small cost. So should be easy to determine what the Self Employed Director of the Ltd Company is receiving unless it is difficult to obtain copies of Self Assessment from HMRC?

Traveller123 Thu 22-Jun-17 12:51:16

Possible that HMRC are reluctant to reveal Self Assessment Tax Returns for fear that once Self Employed NRP realize they will be sent to PWC, the NRP will then use all accounting methods (and there are lots apparently) to reduce profits and hence CM liability. Another possibility is that CM is not taxable and hence of no benefit to HMRC to assist PWC in obtaining more CM?

Traveller123 Thu 22-Jun-17 12:55:59

Former colleague went Self Employed and new wife is the major Share Holder. Ex Husband is paid minimum wage by the Ltd Company and New Wife receives large dividends which is also enjoyed husband (house, cars and holidays). CM is based on husbands earning as works out at less than 10 pounds per week.

All perfectly Legal

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