Late primary admission - what happens??

[tangledtights]

We're moving down to the Teddington/Hampton area in June. HOORAY!! Its taken a year but DH has finally got himself a job and we can make the move. Completely gutted we've missed the primary admission deadline in January though and starting to panic about whether or not my daughter who is 4 in June will manage to get a reception place for September. Does anyone know what the process is for a late application?

We're thinking that we will rent whatever house we can get that is closest to one of the schools that we like. I have seen a couple of houses up for rent that are 0.07 miles away from one of the potential schools in Hampton (Stanley). How do waiting lists work? If we live closest does that mean that we go up the waiting list even if someone else is already on the waiting list but lives a bit further away?

How do you think I'm best finding out which of the primary schools in the Teddington/Hampton/Hampton Wick area are likely to have more space? If I can find this out, then I suppose the best thing would be to try and get a property next door to the school to try and get her a space.

What happens if she doesn't get a space in one of the local schools? Does anyone have any experience of this? How far out would she have to go and is it always to a school that isn't rated as well?

Sorry lots of questions but panic setting in.

thanks

[vbus]

Congrats on your pending move!

I've no idea about late admissions/waiting lists, it's worth speaking to Council directly about this as they will be in the best position to advise. I would also call the various schools you're interested in and have a chat/visit them to see what they are like.

All the primary schools round here are great but massively oversubscribed. I heard rumours that Stanley is may become 5 form entry. Hampton Wick is undergoing a propsed expansion plan to accomodate more children in the future as they are at overspill too. Renting somewhere is a good idea until you know which school you'll get into.

Good luck

[Devora]

I moved to Teddington in March a couple of years ago, just before my dd started Reception, so I understand how stressful this is. The process, if I remember right, is that you submit an application the moment you have a confirmed tenancy and get your application in. I applied just a couple of weeks before it was confirmed that Collis would have a bulge year, and fortunately I'd moved in just round the corner, so we got a place (and so did children who moved in in the summer). In a non-bulge year, we would have been toast. By June you should know if there is a bulge class being provided somewhere: your best bet would be to rent as close as possible to that school. I think you will come last on the list until all the first applications are dealt with; after that, priority is on distance.

Obviously no-one can guarantee how this will work out for you. Two reasons to be hopeful: one is that Stanley is rumoured to be expanding. it is considered by some to be the least desirable of the Teddington primaries, but I think that is purely and simply because Teddington is stuffed full of excellent primaries and Stanley is a bit more socially mixed than some. In any other part of London, parents would be fighting to get their kids in there - it's a really good school, and everyone I know with children there seems more than happy.

The other thing is that there is always a lot of children who drop out of primary school places over the summer. This is a very affluent area and lots use state school places as back-up for their independent school first choices. The deputy head of Hampton Wick told me that every year they have about 20 children who simply don't turn up in September, and that is when they quickly take in children off the waiting list. So you may have a very anxious summer, but it may all work out in the autumn.

Final tip is to think about what you'll do if you don't get a reception place straight away. The Council told me we would likely be offered a place somewhere in Hampton that was a bit of a nightmare for us to get to (new baby, no car). I researched the options and came across a small private school in Kingston, very alternative, lots of meditation etc, that was very sweet and much much cheaper than usual private schools. It was a tiny school, and I wouldn't have been happy to have kept my dd there for the whole of her schooling (in some year groups they only had a couple of children!) but it would have been a good alternative while we waited on a waiting list for a year or two. I'm not sure I remember the name - Educare? - but if you're interested do PM me and I'll come up with it.

Best of luck. You won't regret moving to Teddington - it's lovely for children.

PS. Other tip is to talk to the deputy head at Hampton Wick, as I did. She handles admissions, and is REALLY helpful and informative.

[tangledtights]

Thanks so much for your replies, really helpful information. Nice to hear Teddington is such a lovely place for children! I called the Local Authority admissions office and was told that they wouldn't know which school might be taking on more than others until August. We'll need to have a rental property by then so we'll just have to take a bit of a gamble.

I think we're leaning towards Hampton Infants. There seems to be a bit more rental property in that area. I think we have no chance of getting into Collis as there never seems to be any rental properties that come up close enough to the school.

I'm coming down next week for 3 whole child free days (woohoo!) to check out the areas and am visiting Collis, Stanley, Hampton Infants and Carlisle Infants. I haven't arranged an appointment at Hampton Wick as the junior school linked is a catholic school and that's not something for us which is a shame as from what I can see its a lovely school. Again though, not much in the way of rental property coming up near enough. I think I'll make an appointment though and see what its like.

When I was talking to the admissions person at Richmond, she said that I might get offered a place at another school and if I declined it then I wouldnt be able to stay on at the waiting list of my preferred school. How does that work? Can they offer me a place at a school I haven't listed on my application? This would be a big worry. I don't mind waiting a bit longer if need be but I would prefer not to put DD into another school until our preferred school comes up. It seems such an upheaval. The Educare school sounds interesting though. i was thinking that if she doesn't get a reception place, that I would enrol her in the same local nursery as my 2 year old DS until something comes up.

Thanks again so much for the information.

[Jenny70]

I don't think that is right about the refusal. We moved in year and were not offered the school we wanted for our daughter (then in year 1)... complicated, but we had our eldest at preferred school and couldn't do 2 schools. So we declined and kept her on the waiting list for our preferred school. Admittedly I had to home school her whilst waiting for a place, and she's ended up at a different school anyway (but not the first one offered), but the basics were we were offered a place, declined it and still stayed on waiting list.

But they are not obliged to offer you anothe place once they have offered you one, ie. you can't then complain your child has NO place if you've declined one offer.

[kateandmax]

Hampton wick is linked to a church of england primary

[kateandmax]

Collis is also nightmare to get into even when applicant is on time .last year cut off was 705m !!

[tangledtights]

I spoke to the admissions lady at Hampton Wick today and you're right, she was very helpful! She confirmed that the junior school is non denominational which is good news for us. She also said that they were now a 3 form entry instead of the 2 so even more hope. They don't do tours though but I'm confident enough from what I've heard that it would be a lovely little school.

Can't wait to come down and check it all out. She also thought that if I turned down a place that I can still stay on the waiting lists for my preferred schools since she is only of reception age and not legally obliged to be in education until she is five.

Thanks again for the replies. Where would I be without mumsnet!

[Devora]

Oh, I'm so glad Hampton Wick lady didn't let me down! She's lovely, isn't she? - even advised me on the right pre-school for my very shy and socially inept pre-schooler.

Get yourself down here and repost - we can all have coffee

[tangledtights]

oooh, might need to phone her back up! I also have a 2 year old DS and am looking for a nursery for him. Any good recommendations? I've got 8 to look at while I'm down! Have high hopes for Grassroots in Hampton and Building Blocks on Fulwell Road. Coffee would be lovely when we all finally make it

[Devora]

I have a friend with a child at Grassroots who absolutely loves it. I hear equally good things about Teddington Day Nursery, which is just behind the High St. I'm afraid I don't know anything about Building Blocks.

There's also some excellent pre-schools: Children's House, Paviliion and Playwam. But there is a long waiting list and you may have missed the boat.

Collis and Hampton Wick both have nursery classes for the year before Reception. Not sure about the other schools.

[vbus]

I think Hampton Wick is amazing, the staff and school are lovely. There's a nice community feel about the school with a lot of attention to each child. I'm surprised they said you can't visit All the kids transfer from Wick to St John's so don't be put off by it's name, there is no religious criteria for admission to SJB.

Although school is expanding, you would need to live v. close to make sure you got in (same as Collis). All the schools on your list are good and have different strengths, you're spoilt for choice! If you're sticking round long enough in the area you would may want to consider which secondary you prefer as these schools you're going to visit feed into different secondaries, so that might also influence your decision.

HW nursery is not expanding currently and is heavily oversubscribed so you might need to keep your options open. My little one is at the Preschool Centre which is great, he loves it and it's 5mins walk from the school so makes drop off v. convenient

[tangledtights]

Good to hear that vbus. I saw the Preschool Centre online and think I'll try and organise a visit to them as well. I've been hoping for a nursery place for my DS that will be during school holidays as well but then again, I'm not sure if I need that now that my DD will only be in during school term.

I was checking out Hampton Junior which is the one that the outstanding rated Hampton infants feeds into but it only gets a satisfactory rating which has really put me off to be honest. Hampton Hill Junior seems a better junior school with Carlisle Infants being the feeder into that one. So much to think about! Anyway, all shall be clear once I've been down and had a look around. Although I haven't seen Hampton Wick, I'm confident enough from what I've heard that it would be a good school. I'm presuming that SJB is a good junior school?

thanks again for everyone's input.

[vbus]

SJB is rated oustanding per Ofsted. It has a different vibe from Infant school, I have friends with older kids there who like it there, teaching is good. It then links into Teddington school. Again, just phone them up and see if you can visit.

Preschool has a short waiting list, if you're flexible on days (you have to enrol min 2 sessions/wk) then you might get in quicker. Mrs B is great and very much in tune with the kids, it's a home from home. I didn't think I would use it in the holidays as had older one home from school, but I have to say it's been a lifeline for the odd day you need a break or want some quality time with older sibling. At least you have the choice of sending them in if you want to!

Feel free to PM me if you have any specific q's

[cinqueterre]

Hello, we're thinking of moving to Teddington too and saw a property that we really like, but it may probably just miss Collis if the catchment area further shrinks smaller than 705m. If DS can't get into Collis, we may probably also miss Stanley (the property is just over 1 mile away from Stanley and the catchment area for Stanley seems to have shrunk substantially last year). We are not Catholic and thus no hope to get into Sacred Heart, St James etc. If that happened, will we have a chance be offered a school outside Teddington? If we rejected the offer, can we be reserved on the waiting list for both of Collis and Stanley?

[teddyton]

You can go on the waiting list of up to 6 schools in the borough . You are placed on the waiting list on order of their over superscription criteria.So you place on the list can move down as well as up.
There is also Hampton Wick Infants outstanding school which is converting to 3 form entry for Sept 2012 and St Mary and St peters also outstanding.
Although secondary a long way off teddington school catchment will reduce as they are likely to approve the use of home to school distance for sept 2013 entry.Worth bearing in mind especially if you are buying not renting.

[Dottymcdot]

Stanley is a great school. I do not think that they are expanding further, if you look on their website you will see that there are plans for the new school building and each year group has four classrooms. They moved to four form entry in 2009.

Yes the school is big, but it is incredibly friendly and the head of the infant school pretty much knows all the children by name, I am not kidding you. The school manages its size very well, with differentiated play times for the reception year during their first year. They do for example differentiated year group sports days The only time that you notice the size of the school is at pick up and drop off time.

My very shy DD thrives in this great and caring school and has progressed well so far.

[londoniana]

Hello ladies, I'm joining the late admissions crowd for Reception, as we had an offer accepted recently and planning to move to Teddington early June. IF all goes smoothly with the purchase. Fingers crossed.

Closest school is Collis, then Hampton Wick Infants. Stanley is more than 1.5 miles away. How to they measure distance anyway, are they doing walking distance to the closest school gate?

And does anyone know how to actually apply? I wasn't able to find the form to download from the council website. I only found information about the proof of address they require, and it looks like it will have to be proof of completion, which in our case won't be available until May.

Last but not least, I'm not sure if we should submit the application now, or wait at least until valuation and mortgage are done. Or wait until we complete?

Many thanks!

[teddyton]

The best thing to do is ring the in admissions department directly at the council.
But I do believe you need to have completed and have council tax bill for your new address before they will put you on the waiting list.
welcome to the area.

[londoniana]

Thank you, I spoke to them and they'll take proof of completion to put her on the wait list but they did say to call and register closer to the completion date which is June 1 tentative.

tangledtights and cinqueterre, have you secured your move yet?

Perhaps we can all get together for coffee in the summer :)

[LucyCamille]

Hi there, very interesting reading all of your posts! I moved to Teddington just inside the application cut off, so applied Jan 11th with the notes that I was moving on Feb 2nd (cut off for having to actually move was 13th Feb so literally - by the skin of my teeth).

It was an absolute nightmare to get that far in the space of time I had but we managed it - really pushed for it and provided all the necessary back up to LBRUT. Today letter has come about our place. No offer!

The catchments list shows Collis 658m, HWI 1157m, Stanley 1809m, Carlisle 958m, Trafalgar 2629m

We are literally just outside for Collis, HWI, Stanley and Trafalgar. It's ridiculous.

I realise quite a few people drop out down the line, but what I am wondering is this - will the waiting lists work on a 'first come first served' basis or will people with late applications who live closer be placed before us? The letter says that lots will come available in the next few weeks which would make you think that they will go to the closest of the on-time applicants. Will the schools actually offer places over the next few weeks or will they wait until August so they know who is closest by then?

Also, if you are offered a place at one school, do you automatically come off the lists of the others, is there a window where you can take it up - say for instance Stanley offer a place, but we wanted to hold out for Collis as it is nearer (even though a lot less likely) would we have to turn down the Stanley place straight away and hedge our bets, or would there be a certain timeframe we could wait (say until the beginning of August) to decide whether to take up the offer. Can you get 2 offers at the same time?

Sorry for all the questions! I have been in a complete panic all day - what if we dont get an offer from any - does anyone have any experience of this?! It seems crazy that you can live in central Teddington and not be offered a place at any of the 6 nearest (non religious) primary schools even when you do apply on time. If anyone has been in a similar situation I would be happy to hear from them! I know some neighbours fon the same street who had the same thing happen to them and they were offered HWI right at the last minute.... but was a few years ago and it seems to be getting a lot worse year by year :(

[londoniana]

Hi, sorry to hear about it. :(

From what I know the wait list works on distance and siblings, not first come first served basis, so yes late applicants can go higher on the list if they are closer to the school than you.

However, those who applied on time get placed on the wait list right away - May 2 is the deadline for accepting/rejecting initial offers after which the wait list is created.

So if you are high up on the wait list AND you get an offer in May or June, accept it and remain on the wait list for the other preferred schools. List is kept at the council until early September after which it goes to the schools.

www.richmond.gov.uk/home/education_and_learning/schools_and_colleges/school_admissions/primary_school_admissions/primary_step_by_step_guide/primary_step_by_step_guide_step6.htm

Good luck!

[playgroup]

I know that sacred heart are taking a bulge class but that is probably because catholic places are over subscribed as well.
One of the other community schools will have to take a bulge class I am sure the demand is there lets hope so
Have put all my mummy friends to work at collis to find out if they are taking no word yet

[LucyCamille]

Oh wow, so if I am lucky enough to get offered a place before the summer break then I can accept it (to hold on to it just in case) and also remain on the waiting list for the school I was hoping for until DS starts in September - or later if I find a temporary alternative like was mentioned in earlier post?

I am concerned, does anyone know if you can ask the council to tell how far up/down the list you are for certain schools?

Thanks for the link thats a great help! :)

[LucyCamille]

It is completely infuriating, we are only 0.4 miles from collis, so I am hopeing we are relatively close to the top of the list but we'll just have to see what we get offered.

I think this has hapened the last few years and a lot of people down our road were offered Hampton Wick Infants at the last minute. I would be happy to send our son there but Collis would be so much closer and as I dont drive that is a major factor for us!

[playgroup]

You can ask the council from 2 may that's when waiting list begins.
I think we should apply pressure on the council so they add an extra bulge class in community school