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LONG SHOT !! Anyone assessed on old CSA rules with.......

(17 Posts)
charliecat Mon 19-Feb-07 21:37:09

2 children at home and 1 absent earning 500 per week.
How much maintence are you paying?

Twinklemegan Mon 19-Feb-07 23:15:03

I hope someone comes along soon charliecat. Bumping this for you. Are you having problems?

charliecat Tue 20-Feb-07 10:13:59

No, very long story....DPs only working 2 days a week at the moment since he was made redundant.
So hes been assessed at NIL, meaning he doesnt have to pay anything. Hes paying off 1800 worth of arrears at £9 a week.
Hes thinking of taking a job at £500 a week. But ive had a look at the old rules website and it says they will take 30%, 40% with arrears.
So his £500 a week wage after tax and NI would be 430ish? Take 40% of that and it really wouldnt work as after rent and council tax there would be just enought money for petrol to get get to work and gas and electric.

Cant be right that he can sit on his arse doing 2 days a week and be poorer working?

But I think its right as we werent managing before he was made redundant.
We were handing over 90 a week in CSA and having £32 to spend on 4 of us for food.
ARRGGGHHH

Twinklemegan Tue 20-Feb-07 12:47:19

Hi Charliecat. Can't respond in detail now as I'm at work but will post tonight. We have had similar experiences in the past.

jampot Tue 20-Feb-07 12:51:19

if he's been offered a job at 500 per he should take it and get those arrears paid off quickly. Then of course you will have more money in the long run. Or alternatively if he's bringinghome over 2k per month get a 2k loan just get rid of it

bigcar Tue 20-Feb-07 13:01:44

We are still on the old system, if you ask for a review, i was under the impression, that they would reassess under the new system which works on a percentage based on the number of children you have and the number of children you are paying csa for. I think if my memory serves me correctly (please correct me if wrong!) you pay 10% (or poss 15%) for the first child and 5% for each child thereafter, so if dp has 2 kids 15% (or poss 20%) of his earnings. From that 15% you get 5% back for each child living under your roof and dependant on you, which would be 10%. Dont forget when one of you is woking more than 16 hours per week you become entitled to child tax credit on top of what you earn, which to my knowledge is not couted as income from working with the csa.

Aloveheart Tue 20-Feb-07 18:16:30

It's 20% with two kids under new rules.

Now what i can't understand. Is why don't they review all the old claims and re do them in the new?? Why is that so hard to do??? I just cannot understand it and it doesnt seem way fair to me. And why is it that only the people that pay seem to get all the probs and men go without paying for whatever reason. So they have targets to meet and hit the fathers that do pay. Of course i could be completely wrong on this so apologise if i am. My ex has to pay £58 for two children. Now how is it fair that CC partner has to pay way more than that and having only 1 child?? I would love to know who thought of them rules at csa. i really would.

Twinklemegan Tue 20-Feb-07 21:38:48

I really sympathise with you charliecat. My DH has two children living with their mother and her husband and until recently always worked on short-term contracts due to the nature of his industry. Until he was able to regularise his income by setting up a limited company, his income would fluctuate wildly from month to month. The CSA took so long to catch up with this that it caused us severe hardship. At one stage the assessed amount was so much in relation to his earnings at the time that DH literally couldn't afford to get to work - for those of you who don't know, the CSA allows a paltry 10p per mile (an amount that has never increased along with fuel prices) and allows nothing at all for the first 150 miles.

Unfortunately the situation you envisage is probably true. The way the rules work is that as long as the NRP's family income doesn't fall below the poverty line, taking into account his wife's income too, then the "first" family can pretty much have the rest up to the 40% limit. It's a very very harsh system that hits the caring fathers the hardest unfortunately.

BTW there's no point in paying off the arrears quickly. I'm guessing they've built up through CSA delays/cock ups? There's no interest to pay (yet, thank god) so why suffer the financial pain?

I've dealt with the CSA a lot over the years charliecat, so feel free to CAT me if you like.

Twinklemegan Tue 20-Feb-07 21:42:20

Aloveheart - yep the caring fathers are easy targets and they get clobbered. Apparently there aren't the resources to re-assess all the old claims - we've been waiting for years but haven't pursued it as we don't think it would make a great deal of difference now (it would have in the past though). They've managed to impose all the inflexibility of the new computer system though, like making NRPs pay towards arrears even if they have no income at all.

charliecat Tue 20-Feb-07 22:05:33

Twinklemegan, the arrears built up when he first split up with her and he was paying her cash in hand while she was on IS...one year later he started to pay an amount...about £38, which slowly crept to £90 over the years because thats what they told him to, and about 4 years later they said...OH...from the dase she went onto IS you owe nearly 4000...this is it slowly down to 1800(which they demanded all in one go last month But accepted 10% (180)which was all of dps wages and our tax credits for the week so that was a fecking nightmare, we couldnt go shopping or put the fecking heating on coz we had had to transfer our wages to the CSA...ARRRGGHHH.
And it not that he minds paying but FECKS SAKE. Look at the circumstances first ay?
I think we should be paying £13 a week now, that they havent noticed. So when they do it will be clomped ontop of the 1800....sigh...

Twinklemegan Tue 20-Feb-07 22:36:31

Charliecat - that's such a common problem. The CSA takes so bl**dy long to sort anything out that the NRP ends up helping his ex out in the interim. Unless he knows to make sure each and every payment is recorded then he ends up having to pay twice. As I said before, the diligent, caring fathers get the worst deal of all from the CSA.

Am that they demanded the arrears all in one go. Was this a standard letter? If so, I think they do it just to shock the NRP into action. My DH has arrears of signficantly more than £1800 unfortunately. These built up because he made a complaint about his assessment years back, which he couldn't afford if he wanted his own roof over his head (was staying with his mum hence had no housing costs - big catch 22). He then didn't hear from the CSA in years and had an informal arrangement with his ex (admittedly stop and start between contracts). Then a few years back they suddenly got in contact and backdated the current assessment by six years - that was suddenly his arrears. There's not a hope in hell of ever paying them off in full so I've stopped worrying about it. The figure they came up with would never stand up in court IMO. But it sure looks scary when you get one of their standard letters demanding you pay x thousand pounds now!

Twinklemegan Tue 20-Feb-07 22:40:23

Sorry - I just read your post properly. They were actually really demanding you pay the amount and "accepted" 10%. That is an utter disgrace - the arrears arose due to their own delays. You must have just cause to complain about that - there are several organisations with a web presence that can advise on this sort of thing, I think. I'll try to have a dig around tomorrow.

Oh I so wish there were people out there willing to listen to stories like ours and take some meaningful action.

bigcar Wed 21-Feb-07 09:40:08

Would you believe, our arrears built up because dhs exw had lied to the csa about when she had walked out on dh, so she could claim more money. She had failed to tell them she had since married him and had another child with him, this we werent aware of. Because of this she refused to answer their letters for about a year, during which time we had responded quickly, and provided proof of earnings and any other information they asked for. Their answer was, well you prove it, marriage certificates, apparently are not proof of living with someone, and as we were 3 years on dh couldnt find any old rent books, we were buggered! Dh wants to pay towards his kids, we have no problem with that, but why should we have to pay for her lies and deceptions, it wasnt us that held up the assessment. To some extent i cant blame dh exw shes just playing the system, its the csa that makes me angry. I have the greatest sympathy for the majority of people bringing up thier kids after a breakup, there should be much harder consequences on parents that dont pay. The csa is definately biased against the second family.
I think i have steam coming out of my ears now, so id better stop my rant here, but i could go on for ages![seething anger emoticon]
Sorry for venting, but its not often we come into contact with people who share our frustrations.

charliecat Wed 21-Feb-07 10:29:08

This has just ended up a mad CSA rant hasnt it???
The letter appeared out of the blue, totally, no gentle..."Oh cant we remind you of your arrears could you please start to pay them back"...No just You owe us 1800...pay it now or we will send the debt collectors round<<<shhrriieeekkkk>>>They have his phone number. They could have rang.

Aloveheart Wed 21-Feb-07 10:32:38

CC did dp take the job in the end??

Have you heard anymore from csa??

FioFio Wed 21-Feb-07 10:36:43

Message withdrawn

charliecat Wed 21-Feb-07 10:41:45

Dont know Loveheart, he didnt say last night and i didnt ask. Dont want to know...think its gonna be a fecking nightmare.
Emailing you now Fio. Thanks xxx

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