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CMS question

(17 Posts)
woolythoughts Wed 27-Jan-16 13:48:17

Not sure if this is the right thread - if there is a better home, please let me know.

In terms of full disclosure, I am the wife of the NRP but I have no issue at all with him paying maintenance (other than the fact she has refused to let him see his kids for six years despite him having a judgement in his favour for access). I was had not met him when they were married so I was not the OW.

So the old CSA is coming to an end and he has to move onto the new CMS system.

DH is more than happy to pay direct. He has been paying on the nose every four weeks (its when he gets paid) since they divorced eight years ago. As advised by the CMS, he has written to the PWC asking for her bank details so he can continue to make payments to he directly.

However, we fear that she may well refuse to give them on the basis that she just likes to make his/our life difficult. E.g. as I earn more than he does, she’s repeatedly trying to get him re-assessed since she’s convinced he must be earning more than he is (its out with her life experience that women can have decent careers).

I totally would not put it past her to insist on the collect and pay system just to cost us 20% more (even though she gets 4% less). To give a back ground – every time he’s tried to exercise his rights to see his children, one of their older step siblings (her children from a previous marriage) lodge a claim of abuse against him which is later found to be malicious. They get reprimanded but it doesn’t stop him being investigated and our /and my company’s computers being seized on at least two occasions. No charges are ever brought against the siblings for malicious accusations. He’s tried to insist on contact centre access but the PWC refuses to bring them along on the basis that they are now afraid of him (because of the allegations brought by the siblings). Sadly they are now 15 and 17 so the damage has been done and I don’t think it will ever be repaired.

I guess what I’m trying to understand is:

1.What happens if she doesn’t give her bank details – can she force the CMS involvement even though she is the one being uncooperative
2.DH will continue to put the payments into an account for the kids whilst this is being sorted so there is no issue there however he’s been led to believe that if he’s willing to pay and she wont play ball, there is no official maintenance liability and would therefore be no arrears as she is in effect not claiming it. I find this hard to believe.
3.When his son turns 18, can he stop paying and ask her to prove he’s still in education or training. Again, he’ll keep the money saved in case he is still in it, but he doesn’t want to pay this woman a penny more than he has to. He’s more than willing to help support his son directly if he needs it but I don’t think its unreasonable to expect his son to acknowledge him in this case.
He wants to pay maintenance as required but I don’t see why we should be subject to 20% surcharge because of her vindictiveness.
I’m just trying to make sure I know the facts and where we stand to avoid ill feeling getting any worse.

Thanks in advance

Collaborate Wed 27-Jan-16 15:02:20

1. As far as I'm aware either party can force it through the CMS system, - it's loaded to penalise the payer more than the recipient.
2. I'm not sure, but it's unlikely to be true.
3. After the's finished secondary education all liability under the CMS ceases. If the son wants continued maintenance in further eduction he'll have to speak to his father or apply to court - court won't be happy if he's not set out to his father first details about his studying and his income needs.

woolythoughts Wed 27-Jan-16 15:04:36

" As far as I'm aware either party can force it through the CMS system, - it's loaded to penalise the payer more than the recipient"

This is the problem

Why should the payer be penalised when they have done nothing but co-operate and make every effort to pay - he can't pay if she won't give him the bank details.

Fourormore Wed 27-Jan-16 16:02:42

1. She can force it through the CMS but she can't force Collect and Pay. She would use Direct Pay, it would cost her £20 to do this and no extra charge for your DH. She would need to provide her bank details. Keep any communication in writing so that you have proof. Collect and Pay (20% charge for him, 4% charge for her) is only for when Direct Pay has failed.

2. Well, the CMS don't backdate so your DH would only be liable from the date that exW claimed. I would keep the money in the account until the transition is complete just incase.

3. Your DH is liable for his DC in full time further education but not higher education up to the age of 20, providing they don't marry before then.

fuzzywuzzy Wed 27-Jan-16 16:07:22

Your DH can ask CMS to obtain her bank details and forward them to him.

She has to supply the details otherwise she's as no come back with insisting on collect and pay CMS are hot on allowing time and fairness to the paying party go have an opportunity to pay.

I had to send my bank details to CMS who forwarded them to ex. They'll get in touch with her and ask her to do the same send them her bank details.

woolythoughts Wed 27-Jan-16 16:16:36

Thats all we want.

DH has no issue providing for his son if he's still in education but if direct pay works, we have been told the CMS won't notify us if he's left education at 18. We don't trust her to be honest and tell us if he has.

Even if he has left education, we/DH have no issue supporting his son if needed - just not continuing to give the exW the money.

Fourormore Wed 27-Jan-16 16:23:28

I think, but am not sure, that her child benefit will stop if he leaves full time education. Child maintenance is linked to child benefit so they should be able to check.

kittybiscuits Wed 27-Jan-16 21:09:03

Child maintenance is payable until the end of August in the year in which the child turns 18 if they are in full time education. Eg child is in full time education and turns 18 in September. CM is payable until the following August. I don't think you can go straight to collect and pay. Maintenance and contact are completely separate issues. If your OH has a contact order then he must have had a hand in not ensuring contact takes place. How long have you been together?

kittybiscuits Wed 27-Jan-16 21:12:35

He has a legal and moral responsibility to financially support his child/ren. It does not depend on them having a relationship or contact.

woolythoughts Wed 27-Jan-16 21:22:04

Where has there been any implication he is not willing to support his children?

Please read what was actually written.

For once this is not a father wanting to shirk his responsibility

justjuanmorebeer Sun 31-Jan-16 01:25:29

Rather than wait for her to start a CMS claim why doesn't he start it himself now?

woolythoughts Sun 31-Jan-16 18:55:15

We've written to her asking for her bank details so we can pay her - until we get that we can't. As its now been nearly two weeks - we were beginning to think she might try to force it through collect and pay out of spite.

The money in the mean time is in a savings account ready to pay as soon as we know where to pay it

Penfold007 Sun 31-Jan-16 19:14:08

OP I'd be inclined to go to the CMS and bypass her altogether. Yes there will be a cost but DH's back will be covered.

justjuanmorebeer Mon 01-Feb-16 23:14:08

You pay £20 to cms, they ask her for the details then they pass them onto you. You don't even have to have a conversation with her. Probably sorted in less than a week.

LeeRBob Fri 08-Sep-17 21:40:18

Contact cms, they will ask which service you wish to follow. State collect and pay and explain your situation, they will offer you a free service whereby they collect 50% from you and pay to exW, you pay remaining 50% direct (cms will give you bank details provided by exW to them) this service is free, there is no 20% charge. So long as you keep payments up, after 6 months it will revert to direct pay and then you are sorted. Paying direct and avoiding charges.

Dad2312 Mon 06-Nov-17 12:05:22

Hi. I am in exactly the same situation. My daughter's mother will not give her bank details and both cms and I have tried to get them off her. We don't talk directly due to a lot animosity so we use text or contact sheets. I have been asking for her bank details since CSA said they would be closing my case and she didn't provide me with any . Payments stopped for 2 months after closure due to lack of bank details. The cms call me (which I anticipated) and said she opted for DIRECT PAY!? So I was confused but fine with that explained that she didnt need to apply and waste her money to apply for it but ok no problem, asked for her details and they didn't have them so they have been chasing them for 3 months as have I. I have called to ask and say look I have 3 sets of payments already. It's getting out of hand I shouldn't have to hold the money because she wants to be awkward nor should I have to open another bank account for it. It's.not fair I have a family at home to consider to and this causing me stress that I don't need and shouldn't have! Especially when I want to provide! How did yours get resolved if it did? because I don't know what to do. They say only she can close the case and can't even give her an ultimatum to say claim the money or lose out because that would probably get her to cooperate I feel as if I'm being penalised for doing the right thing.

Collaborate Mon 06-Nov-17 17:33:39


1. Open a new account and pay the money in to there. Make it available to your kids when they leave school (provided CMS tell you there is no historic debt).
2. Start a new thread?

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