Urgent Parking Eye parking charge notice help needed please

[regularbutpanickingabit]

Hi there
I am feeling a bit overwhelmed by the MSE forums etc. when trying to work out exactly how to contest a Parking Eye charge notice for our local hospital. Please could someone just check I am doing the right thing?

I have taken the standard appeal template from MSE and am about to submit it online but really really need someone to make sure its ok before I press send. This is really stressing me out!

Here is a link to the copy and paste template I am using... forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.php?t=4816822

Some background:
I went for a high risk pregnancy scan at the hospital in Sept. The parking situation at the hospital is always horrific so I arrived an hour early. A new system had been put in place so you pay up front and put in your reg plate details but don't display a ticket.

I arrived at around 8.50, scan was due at 10.10 (but you have to be there earlier for samples) and so I paid for 3 hours of parking just in case something went wrong.

Ultrasound department were running very late so I was seen nearer 11am and out from that at 11.20ish. I then had to go to the day unit next door for blood pressure and urine checks.

They were insanely busy and had me on a waiting list. When i was eventually called, they insisted on a 30 mins observation. I explained about the car park but we were still just about ok for me to be there for this. Bearing in mind high blood pressure is one of my risk factors you can see that this was already not a great situation.

Due to various mess ups, it then took a further 20/30 minutes for them to book my next growth scan.

This meant I left the hospital almost an hour later than the time I had pre-paid for. There are no signs explaining what to do in that situation and so I just had to leave.

We received the letter with a parking charge for £60 if paid by 10 Oct or £100 thereafter. I am so upset that basically I am being penalised for having to waste 4 hours for what should have been a 15min scan and a 5 min urine/blood pressure test with absolutely no way of doing anything about it from the ward.

I understand from the MSE forums that the registered owner (my husband) needs to appeal on the grounds in the template but I don't really understand them. I also understand he shouldn't name me as driver nor add any of the extenuating circumstances above.

Is that right? Do I just submit that template and wait until the next rejection comes through?

Basically it seems insanely unfair way of making money out of patients. I am happy to pay for the time I use but I can't always predict what that will be prior to the appointment time. I thought that 3 hours was excessive!! If the system worked as it does in our local shopping centre then I pay on return and that makes perfect sense.

Please help and apologies for the essay.

[DixieTreats]

If it's Parking Eye, just ignore, ignore, ignore. They are only entitled to pursue you for the sum of money that the company would have potentially made by the area of ground that your car was covering being available. Which would be about 20p. And they would have to take you to court to do this - it's clearly not worth it.

If you're sure it's Parking Eye, seriously just ignore them. They will write a few times, each letter more threatening then they will realise that you aren't going to be conned/intimidated and won't bother. I have done it myself!

[prh47bridge]

They are only entitled to pursue you for the sum of money that the company would have potentially made by the area of ground that your car was covering being available

I'm afraid that is not true. Under the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012 they can pursue the keeper for any sum they want provided they have given adequate notice to drivers in the form of signs on the land concerned. Prior to that they could only take action against the driver and could only claim any loss they had made.

It is still the case that there is a good chance they will go away if you ignore them. If they chose to pursue you it would be a small claim which means they could not reclaim their legal costs, although they could reclaim the court fees. Their legal costs would probably be more than they were trying to claim from you so it isn't worth their while. But there are no guarantees. Yours could be the case they decide to pursue.

Looking at the template I'm not convinced that all the points are valid. Indeed, some of them look a bit silly to me. However, if you want to appeal I think you should submit the template as it stands to the PPC and also complain to the hospital. When writing to the hospital I would set out the sequence of events you have described above.

[NickNacks]

You say 'we' so why didn't you just send the person you were with to top up?

[Elmersnewfriend]

Ok the advice to ignore is no longer correct (as you will have seen from MSE).

Your letter is fine. Submit it and wait. Do not pay anything yet (if you do then your case may be scuppered). Parking Eye will assess and either accept, or deny and refer you to POPLA. I actually think you have quite a good chance of immediate success on the basis you were a genuine patient with a real reason for parking there, and I'm guessing some people aren't. However if it gets referred to POPLA then that is where you need a "better" letter including the legal arguments - but I wouldn't worry about that until you need to.

Do PM me if it does need a letter to POPLA. I won my case about a year ago and am happy to help.

[Elmersnewfriend]

Actually I just realised your letter is the template - as a first step I think just setting out the story as you've done here is fine.

[Seriouslyffs]

Nicknacks that's brilliant! Of course now you've shared your brilliance the OP can use her time machine to so just that! Well done you!!!

regular I ignore parking eye, I've also read that the law changed recently but I'd still ignore in your case, imagine the potential for sad face DM/ letters to the hospital trust etc. However, it sounds as if it's really stressing you out so consider paying it if you can afford to. It's not fair, you shouldn't have to, but would you pay £60 for the peace of mind?

[ChineseFireball]

Elmersnewfriend is right. Appeal on the grounds set out in the MSE template letter. Ignoring is not the current advice.

I just recently had a parking charge cancelled after I appealed. There is advice re: genuine pre-estimate of loss and there is case law which says that if the company charges a punitive amount this is unfair. Also technically if Parking Eye is not the landowner there is something about contract law which states that they can't enter into a contract with you - not sure exactly what this is without checkin.

But essentially, yes - send the template appeal letter, don't give your reasons for being late, don't confirm who the driver was. Also - my parking charge said i was being charged for staying longer than the free parking period - since I paid for my ticket I also enclosed a copy of the ticket and told them their accusation was clearly BS because I'd paid and therefore there was no free period for me to overstay. So check that the accusation/allegation in the Parking charge letter is correct.

Good luck.

[regularbutpanickingabit]

Sorry, I lost track of the thread somehow.

I have appealed as per the grounds on the MSW letter and I have complained to the hospital. Hospital have phoned to say they are investigating for me and will email on Monday which would be great if they help appeal/cancel the ticket.

Nicknacks - in the post I said that we received the letter, not that 'we' were at the car park. I think even I would have worked out that having someone with me could have meant they could have topped up the parking in time

Chinesefireball - very interesting. I think my letter says something very similar and I was confused by it. Will have a look tomorrow and check for next round if needed.

Thank you!

[borisgudanov]

prh47bridge "I'm afraid that is not true. Under the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012 they can pursue the keeper for any sum they want provided they have given adequate notice to drivers in the form of signs on the land concerned."

Bollocks.

Have a look at the DoT guidance on the application of the "Protection of Freedoms" (sic) Act 2012 here [https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/9155/guidance-unpaid-parking-charges.pdf] which says:

"Charges for breaking a parking contract must be reasonable and a genuine pre-estimate of loss. This means charges must compensate the landholder only for the loss they are likely to suffer because the parking contract has been broken. For example, to cover the unpaid charges and the administrative costs associated with issuing the ticket to recover the charges. Charges may not be set at higher levels than necessary to
recover business losses and the intention should not be to penalise the driver. "

(FAQ question 1).

Know also that the "Protection of Freedoms" (sic) Act 2012 does not apply in Scotland.

HTH.

[prh47bridge]

Guidance is just that - guidance. It is not the law and the guidance specifically says it is not legal advice.

It is, of course, true that the courts will not enforce an unreasonable charge. The point I was making is that DixieTreats argument that the operator would only be able to recover "about 20p" is clearly wrong. That would have been closer to correct prior to the Protection of Freedoms Act as previously the operator was generally not allowed to recover their administrative costs. I did consider making the point that the charge needs to be reasonable but in the context of DixieTreats point and the amount being claimed by ParkingEye in this case felt it was not necessary to do so.

Parts of the Protection of Freedoms Act do apply to Scotland but not the part relating to parking charges. And it does protect some important freedoms.

[forago]

I'm currently appealing a parking eye supermarket carpark one, used a similar temate, no pre-estimate of loss, blah blah, also that I have receipts to prove I spent over £100 in the supermarket, the contract thing about they aren't the landowners and also the fact that how can their be any loss to them when its a free carpark? I used to just ignore (1 other supermarket, 2 train stations, supermarket sent threatening letters for a year, nothing happened, never heard from train stations ones), now I do the template letter. hell will freeze over before I pay a private carparking company 95 quid for the priveledge of spending a couple of hundred quid in a shopping precinct openly desperate for customers. I also tweeted the supermarket (who own the carpark (free)) and moaned at them.