ExH harassment, court case coming up - scared :(

[Montessorisam]

Hi, does anyone have any experience of a court case similar to this? In brief, my husband pleaded not guilty to harassment and now the case is going to court soon. So scared. Worried that his solicitor will rip me apart and I will fall apart! It has been a very hard past few months and I don't feel like I can cope with this at all. Has anybody ever made a retraction statement to stop a case?

[MadameDefarge]

This is the downfall of the court system. But have you tried getting an advocate on your side? Mackenzie's Friends might be one avenue. Or a local advocacy group. Our local one advertises in the doctor's surgery.

These are not legal aids, they are people to support you through a trial.

They might really be able to help you face this, and come out the other side vindicated.

[Joy5]

I'm in the family courts tomorrow over finances, not using a Mackenzie friend as i decided as they couldn't act as a solicitor then i'd cope as well alone without the cost of one (they usually expect travel expenses etc). On such a low income i just couldn't justify the expense.

So i'm looking at facting a solicitor tomorrow. Only thing driving me is that its for my 2 younger sons, we need support from my ex until i can do it. Absolutely petrified, but was my decision not to borrow off relatives to pay legal costs, so its down to me to do my best tomorrow. Was told by a solicitor it would costs thousands to get me through the pre liminary hearing and a court hearing, just don't want to take years to pay that back to relatives, who would have gone without things themselves to help me.
Theres a good book, i got it from the library 'Family courts without a lawyer : a handbook for litigants in person / Lucy Reed' thats really good and explains all the steps if you can find a copy.

I've spoken to a local charity that gives free legal advice, and they said the judge won't let you be verbally attacked by the others solicitor. Its now like a criminal court, family court is much more civilised. I face cross examination if it goes to a full court hearing, but i've only told the truth in my papers so long as i stay calm and don't panic i should be ok (sounds easy, but know it won't be!).

Hope you manage to cope with the court action and hoping you find the strength to do it, six months ago i couldn't have, not sure where my strength has come from, but the outcome will affect my 2 youngest sons for years to come, so i'll do it for them. Its bad enough there isn't legal aid to help me, when its harassment its even worse.

But look into Mackenzie friends, just having someone there, might just make it possible for you to go through with the court action.

[MadameDefarge]

joy, good luck to you. are you local? I am in London. If you need someone just to be there an on your side I will come.

[Joy5]

Thanks MadameDeFarge, but i'm up in the North.

Going early, want to be seated away from my ex in the waiting area, hes been violent in the past.

Meant to be up early today, but not quite this early!

[LineRunner]

I have done family court twice without legal representation. The ExH's barrister was actually very pleasant to me, probably because it was clear her client had behaved very poorly. So yes it was stressful, but turned out ok in the end.

I also rang and wrote to the court beforehand, and rang CAFCASS separately, to say that I could not be placed in the same waiting area as ex. (He was 'known' to the domestic abuse unit.) They arranged for me to wait in the witness waiting room, a separate area from the main waiting area where ex was.

[Joy5]

Am aiming to be at court early, so i can ask to be seated away from ex.

He has been violent in the past, and can imagine if he can he'll stare straight at me to try and intiminate me.

But i'm ready for it, just wish i could go now! Am wide awake like a springed coil may have to resort to waking the dog and taking her out for a 'brisk' walk to calm down!

[LineRunner]

Good luck! Yes, ask one of the court clerks (in the black robes, in the style of Hogwarts teachers) if they could please sit you away from your former partner because you are worried.

Make sure they know where you are, though. Cafcass managed to lose me once...

[Joy5]

Thanks LineRunner, just walked the dog for a few hours, feeling a bit calmer now, and not so 'in your face'.

Will look out for the court clerks and ask to be seated separeately. Not seen ex in over a year since he was violent, so if can leave it until we're in the court room will feel like a minor victority, hes not upset me before we go in.

[LineRunner]

Thinking of you both, Montessorisam and Joy.

[ladyjulian]

Montessorisam - I have experience of these cases (as an advocate). Advocates are not monsters, they are also not stupid, and "taking apart" a victim is a really good way to get a guilty verdict. If you know which court it is in advance, go in and have a look round to familiarise yourself with it. When you get there, go straight to Victim Support / Witness Support and explain how nervous you are. They will help.

In court, don't look at your ex and talk to the judge not the advocate. Direct your answers to the magistrates / district judge - so the advocate says "What is your name?" - you turn slightly away from him / her so you are facing the bench and respond "Montessorisam, sir / madam / your worships." If you have a district judge, they are sir or madam. If you have a panel of three magistrates you either use sir / madam (depending on the one in the middle who is the chair) or 'your worships.'

Don't be afraid to disagree with the advocate. They say "This text was nothing more than a polite enquiry into your health, wasn't it Ms Sam?" - it is perfectly acceptable to say "No, you're completely wrong. Even seeing his name come up on my phone screen terrifies me and he knows that, I felt it was an attempt to intimidate me."

It is also quite okay to say "Sorry, I'm nervous, let me rephrase that," to ask for a tissue or a drink of water, or even to ask for a 5 minute break to compose yourself. (Although beware ham acting, obviously.)

Forget everything you have ever seen on TV about courtroom dramas. It is unlikely that the advocate will try to rip you apart - it is far more likely that they will drown you with sympathy and then gently suggest that you're mistaken, as they are more likely to get what they want that way.

However with harassment cases it's often a matter of evidence - the text messages / Facebook posts etc. It is not at all uncommon for a defendant to wait and see if the victim turns up, and plead guilty if she does.

Retraction statements: treat with care, because they can potentially lay you open to a charge of wasting police time (or perjury depending on where the case has got to). If you retract you are basically telling the court you lied to the police. It could also make it difficult to get a conviction if it happens again.

Joy5 - good luck with the family court :)

[none of this should be interpreted as legal advice as I don't know the ins and outs of your situation, and you don't know who I am, if in doubt speak to a lawyer in person etc etc]

[LineRunner]

I would agree that you should not retract, and turn up. Just be truthful. People on here can help get you through it.

I think was really good advice, ladyjulian. Extremely helpful.

[Spero]

Yes, really good advice LadyJulian.

I agree that if a barrister does try to 'rip you apart' this will make him/her look stupid and will probably be stopped by the Judge anyway.

you may have to face some pressing questions but no competent advocate should ever resort to aggression.

[Montessorisam]

Thank you. This has all put my mind at rest a little. I have however decided to make a retraction statement. I simply feel that I cannot go through with all of this. My statement will be coming from the angle of the children and how this whole case has disturbed them. My daughter (age 11) saw my ex being arrested which disturbed her greatly. The bail conditions set were that he was not allowed any contact with me and unfortunately this put her in a horrible position of arranging the contact (I have no family to help). I do feel that eventually my ex and I could become amicable once this has all settled down and this can only benefit the kids - if he gets a criminal record then it will put him in a position where he will find it hard to get work - and ultimately will not be able to provide for the kids. I am talking years down the line here. Not the immediate anger that is felt at times of a marriage breakdown. I guess the cps decides whether to accept my statement anyway and I may still end up in court....so the above advice is still very helpful. Thank you.

[Joy5]

On a totally different topic, i attended the family court today, wasn't too nervous and answered all the questions.

At the end, the judge said 'costs', my ex's solicitor said 'yes' and the judge said we could leave. So i did.

Its only come back to me tonight, but have i been awarded my ex's legal bills? Am now going out of my mind with worry, i can't afford a solicitor so had to self rep i'm just so worried i've somehow been awarded my ex's legal bills, just because i didn't understand what the judge was doing.

[Spero]

Hopefully the Judge said 'no order as to costs?'

And the other lawyer said 'yes'.

The general rule is that there is no order as to costs, each side pays their own unless there has been some extremely bad litigation behaviour.

You should get the typed up order from the court, hopefully within a week or so?

I think it very very unlikely you will have been lumbered with any costs but you can appeal if you were as you obviously didn't understand what was going on.

[LineRunner]

Joy, that will have been no order as to costs.

[Joy5]

Thanks Spero, the judge sort of shouted it, so i could have just heard the last word.

I only hope you'er right, didn't know i'd receive a typed up order from the court, i didn't see anyone taking notes, although it could have been recorded.

I'm glad u think i can appeal if it has happened, but i'm just so tired and fed up of it all, just want it to end. Just don't want another legal argument to have to try and defend myself.

[Joy5]

LineRunner

Thank you, missed ur reply as i was typing my last post.

I only hope you're both right, i only remember the word 'costs'.

Just now going to spend the weekend worrying, until i can ring the courts and ask on Monday.

Thank you both for trying to put my mind at ease. I just can' t say how exhausted i am right now, i'm working, gone back to uni to get a qualification, and i've defended myself today in family court. Thought i'd covered everything, then tonight the judges words came back to me!

[Spero]

I know it is very stressful, but please try and rest easy tonight.

I have tried and tried to get costs orders against people who have behaved appallingly and never managed it!

so as long as you didn't do anything awful like forge some documents or try and punch the judge, you should be fine.

[Joy5]

Thanks Spero, thats comforting to know.

I came away so happy that i'd told only the truth in my documents, that in the questionaire i'd only been asked for more proof of the truth which is so easy to do (just a pain having to get the same info over and over lol).

Then had a sort of flashback earlier tonight, and remembered the judges last words. I talked lots and lots while i was in court, don't know what happened to me, but my nervousness just went, but apart from that i smiled and was really polite.

I just hope i only heard the last word and you're all so right.

Thank you again to everyone whose taken the trouble to reply.

[LineRunner]

Honestly, Joy, if there were to be a costs argument it would have gone on for ages.

[Joy5]

Thanks LineRunner, it was done with in seconds.

Hoping it was as you suggested 'no order to costs' and the only bit i heard and remembered was 'costs.

If thats the case, then i'm happy this morning. Did my absolute best yesterday. answered all the questions, totally blanked by ex, but when his solicitor had tried to argue he didn't have to answer one of my questions about his finances, the judge said he did and backdated too (i know he can't do it, as i have the receipts for what he claims to have for paid for our youngest son as it was me who paid) i did allow myself to smirk at him then looking away first. Was most satisfying to find my ex was looking at me anyway.

Fingers crossed you're right :)

[ladyjulian]

Well done Joy5, it sounds like you did really well. I hope you get a relaxing weekend now!