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Can adultery be cited in divorce proceedings

(30 Posts)
Joelybear Sun 24-Apr-11 01:31:48

My H and I separated 4 months ago (19 years married and 5DC's) we live in Scotland,

Today H told me he was seeing another woman ( the one i suspected he was close to just after we split up). He says nothing happened before he moved out. If this moves on an thet have a sexual relationship (which I'm sure wont be too far away could I then cite adultery as reason for divorce?

I know we are separated but legally he is still married to me an my husband, or can adultery only be cited if it happened when you still lived together?

Thanks for yor help

girlynut Sun 24-Apr-11 06:53:51

Adultery is one of the facts that can be used to evidence that the relationship has broken down irretrievably. Doesn't matter whether it happens when you live together or after you separate. You're still married so if he has a sexual relationship with another person, he has committed adultery.

Much easier than waiting two years! Especially if he admits to it...

onadietcokebreak Sun 24-Apr-11 07:14:11

You could cite adultery but it may lengthen the proceedings if he won't agree to it. My dp cited this for his now ex. Initially she refused to acknowledge if and our solicitor said it could have been difficult had she not already had new mans baby.

I would recommend going for the reason that is most likely to be agreed quickly.

Collaborate Sun 24-Apr-11 07:33:27

Don't know about Scots law, but in E&W you can provided it was the adultery that made you realise the marriage was debt.

babybarrister Sun 24-Apr-11 08:08:17

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Collaborate Sun 24-Apr-11 18:52:49

Debt???? Wtf? Damn iPhone auto correct. Meant dead.

sneezecakesmum Sun 24-Apr-11 19:35:35

Here it is certainly 'unreasonable behaviour' to be committing adultery and grounds for divorce.

iphone and predictive text are dire - I've told everyone my gay fever is really fearsome at the moment! grin

Collaborate Sun 24-Apr-11 23:07:47

Ha. Love it. But adultery is not UB. it is it's own fact. I issue UB petitions when I don't know the respondent will admit adultery so it becomes an "improper relationship" petition.

Joelybear Mon 25-Apr-11 23:13:47

Thanks all for your help on this. Will phone my solicitor tomorrow for advice re this as we have started to draw up an agreement re permanent financial separation. Wondered if adultery would count as XH seems to want to hurry up financial agreement so he can sign it then feel free to sleep with new woman an me not cite her for adultery.
But surely we are still married until divorce proceedings atleast start - which I am not doing at the moment as only split in December. So maybe i can still get them both for the lying cheats they are an make sure there act is recorded in history for all to read about. There actions are causing me and our children so much hurt and pain its untrue!!
Thanks again

prh47bridge Mon 25-Apr-11 23:59:45

I understand where you are coming from but this may not be the best approach. If your ex isn't happy with you citing adultery he may oppose the divorce, especially if you insist on naming the other woman. That could significantly add to the costs and slow the whole thing down. You may be better off going for either unreasonable behaviour or one year separation with consent.

I should add that I am not an expert on Scottish divorce law so you should take advice from your solicitor.

confuddledDOTcom Tue 26-Apr-11 01:07:21

My partner just divorced his XW and used the fact they are now both in new relationships with children as evidence the marriage had irretrievably broken down but it wasn't listed as adultery on either side. I don't know anything about law but if you can do it as nicely as moving on rather than adultery maybe it will take away the chance of him opposing the divorce?

STIDW Tue 26-Apr-11 01:13:43

In Scotland most (about 92%) divorce petitions are based on the grounds of separation - one year with consent, two years without. For adultery and UB there is a strong burden of proof requiring evidence from a third party. In the case of adultery that means evidence that sexual intercourse took place and that can be very tricky without a confession. The reason for the marriage breaking down isn't recorded on the divorce decree and the other court documents, which are confidential, are destroyed in due course so the act isn't recorded for all to read.

At the risk of sounding trite rather than feeding your husband's ego by fighting over his loss and causing more pain to yourself and the children perhaps the best revenge is to hold up your head high, live well and be happy without him. At the beginning you may need to put on a front but it will help the family move on with the least damage to long term family relationships, which is so detrimental to the emotional well being of children of separated parents, and start building a new life. As many Mumsnetters can testify there is life after adultery/divorce. It helps keeping the practicalities and emotions separate using a counsellor if necessary.

In any event there is only one divorce decree in Scotland and it is normally only granted once the finances have been settled. My suggestion would be to concentrate your time and energy on reaching an agreement about that and arrangements for the children rather than engage in potentially very expensive litigation over the divorce. It's a good idea to consult a solicitor early on to find out where you stand and what options there are but if you can reach an agreement between you or with the help of a solicitor/mediator it will be a whole lot cheaper than court proceedings.

With regard to predictive text I've been in hot water after texting I would "massage" a solicitor later (which didn't meet with his wife's approval) and for insulting 30,000+ posters on a website by calling them "posers." blush

nocake Tue 26-Apr-11 12:38:56

Agreed. Odd as it may sound, divorce proceedings are best dealt with by leaving your emotions outside. If you try to make a point by citing adultery then you run the risk of delaying the process and increasing your costs. The best way to get through a divorce is to behave in a calm way and come to an amicable arrangement with your ex (if possible).

Then move on and prove to him how good your life can be without him smile

sneezecakesmum Tue 26-Apr-11 19:52:40

I think it is agreed that, despite the urge to name and shame, it is in everyones interest, financially and emotionally, to remain dignified, maybe at a later date have a pile of manure delivered to their doorstep!
[bugrin] massage [bugrin]

sneezecakesmum Tue 26-Apr-11 19:53:15

oh nickers the easter bunnies have gone.

Joelybear Thu 28-Apr-11 00:57:55

Thanks again for this, STIWD comments noted especially aboout building a happy life for family smile trying hard to do this. News of OW came at weekend after denying it by both of them for a few months so me obviously angry an deeply hurt all over again.

What they have done and continue to do is adultry and I feel there crime should be known!! At least I will see if I can divorce for Unreasonable behaviour. It is NOT my choice to part with hime BUT he has chosen this an missused and abused me for along time really so am not prepaired to let it go down route of divorce 1 or 2 years on.

This man is thoughtless and hurtful and has no regard for me and our 5DC's he has hurt them so much and cannot see it. I just want some record of what he has done known via the courts.

In respect to financial/child arrangements we have gone a fair way to reaching a mutual agreement. Just he wants a couple of things changed so I am asking for compromise which he not keen. This matter is not helped by the fact he was looking after DC 4 + 5 in my home and opened my post, reading then resealing the letter up to make it look untouched!! The letter was from my solicitor so he has the upper hand as he knows all my thoughts!! RATS

Its behaviour like this that is just part of the small catalouge of events. Re Divorce, don't think he will want to argue too much on divorce as has no intention in seeing a solicitor regarding any of the separation/ divorce stuff as he does not want to pay legal bills. So guess if we make a good enough case he may just accept it and sign on the dotted line!! Will just have to see.

He is now a man I no longer know sad. Looks more or less the same on the outside. but has an intruder in his body (and underpants!!) LOL

nocake Thu 28-Apr-11 12:43:49

Trying to make a point by insisting there is "some record of what he has done" is exactly the sort of thing that will cause you problems, cost you money and delay the divorce. My ex cited adultery (I met someone else after we split up) but no-one knows or cares what was on the divorce petition.

You seem to be making good progress in agreeing a financial settlement with only the minimum of problems. Please don't spoil it now by trying to score points. It won't hurt him and will blow up in your face.

Can I suggest that you get your solicitor to email everything to you rather than posting it?

prh47bridge Thu 28-Apr-11 15:45:21

Agree with Nocake. STIDW has already told you that the reason for the breakdown is not recorded on the decree and that the other court documents are kept confidential until they are destroyed. So even if you go for adultery there will be no record of what he has done.

confuddledDOTcom Thu 28-Apr-11 17:37:57

I left my abusive ex and he divorced me (we married in church and the marriage hadn't been filed with the registry office when we split so I couldn't get a copy of the certificate and our minister wouldn't do me a copy because it would mess with the numbers on the certificates and he liked that they matched hmm and ex had our copy of the certificate which he wasn't willing to hand over) he made it awful. I had several blokes on the go, expected him ul run around after me and these blokes, I treated him badly etc all totally my fault! I got angry when I read it, I was already very depressed and under the hospital from the split so this added to it. I wanted to contest but my solicitor told me three things. First I couldn't because I was on legal aid, secondly I wanted to be divorced from him as quickly as possible and that wouldn't help but thirdly it doesn't matter. It just tells the judge you really do want to split and then no one will ever know why.

Do it nice and get it over with as quickly and cheaply as possible.

sneezecakesmum Thu 28-Apr-11 20:02:02

I certainly wouldnt make a major issue of the adultery if it is going to delay things. If he is being stupid enough to self represent it is a good indication that he is not going to contest your demands re property and children, and that you will get a good deal. I would let sleeping dogs lie if I were you, after all you know he did it so does he and probably most of your friends and family - not something he can hide really, so that is vindication enough for you. Hopefully you can deal with this via mediation and save yourself some money.

Xenia Fri 29-Apr-11 20:15:43

As said above adultery etc is all much h arder in Scotland (not much harder to do but harder to use in the case). It is different from English law.

It sounds like under Scottish law 1 year separation is the best ground to use but if he will admit adultery or UB then go for those.

60% of rebound relationships fail so it is likely he won't much enjoy his life with the new woman and might even come skulking home again when he realises she's worse than you are or perhaps she might not like the 5 children being in his cosy little love nest more than she wants and waking them up at 5am.

Joelybear Sat 30-Apr-11 23:40:42

Thanks again for advice, understand what you are saying. I just feel so hurt an let down by there actions an what thet have done. But not worth putting down I guess. I think it should be recorded for all to see!
We are making progress with financial agreement but when something happens he doesnt like he tells me he will need more money out of the property, I say I'll go to CSA re maintenence, He says he'll go to court for 50/50 settlement. I tell him fine (as having 5 DC's to care for youngest 20months oldest 18yrs) He may not get as much as we've agreed. Also he would have to pay legal cost which he does not want to do.
Regarding him opening my mail I am nolonger letting him in the house as that was his final act to destroy any trust I had in him. HIS LOSS in the long run

Xenia Sun 01-May-11 09:54:26

My ex got 6-0% of our joint assets in England despite our 5 children living and being solely supported by me (but I earned 10x what he did so probably not your own position). he was told not to leave our house until the court order was agreed and property and money transfers done so again different from your position. I wasn 't surprised he read my correspondence with my lawyer.

if you want once you have the money and court order you can make some publicity although it tends to backfire. We were careful about the wording of the confidentiality clause in our court order as we b oth wanted some scope to write and talk about the divorce but some will prohibit all disclosures and discussions. People pay for gagging orders in divorce cases.

Of course there's no assumption you rather than he shoudl have the chidlren. We shoudln't be sexist and some may well choose to live with him and he will need a home for them to live in with him presumab ly.

Joelybear Sun 01-May-11 20:32:45

Oh there is no way he wants DCs at the moment, they would cramp his style with OW, unless he borrows them for a few hours so they can play happy families!! He soon sends them back, they were to stay the other night, but one wanted to come home so he phoned me to meet him an returned all 3DCs as he wasn't going to drive them back to me AGAIN the next day!! Older DC's 18 + 16 want nothing to do with him as they feel disgusted at what there dad has done and his behaviour now and over the years.

Dont think he will want to go to court as doesnt want to pay any legal costs atall. Opening my solicitors letter was final act of betrayal by him so have decided he is no longer allowed in family home. He chose to leave family home and he is certainly no longer a friend. My home is for me an children to feel comfy an settled in + to have family an friends visit, in which he is neither now so will not be welcome over the doorstep!
Thanks again

Xenia Sun 01-May-11 21:18:57

Sounds difficult. If he doesn't want them just make him have them, as many as possbile to cramp his style and say you're away that weekend and if he can't have them he'll haev to find childcare. That might make him sit up and think being a single parent is going to mean weekend after weekend whilst you're away having a good time or with a new boyfriend and he is doing hours and hours of childcare with his new woman and not getting any time alone with her.

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