Angry, angry, angry

[Sussex1983]

Long time lurker, wanted to post many times but didn't because it would make this situation real. I
had a six week scan yesterday after my third ICSI attempt. We have male factor infertility.
First attempt was unsuccessful & second was a missed miscarriage discovered at my six week scan. Yesterday revealed that I've miscarried again - presumed around the 6 week mark.

For those of you who have been in this situation, were you as furiously angry as I feel now ? Not with any person, just at the whole sorry situation.
I'm absolutely apoplectic with rage that the universe is taking the piss out of me by letting me go through this hideous treatment process, let me get pregnant, feel that joy, then steal it away from me.
I feel like my heart is broken in two. I don't want to be strong, I don't want to be positive (I swear if one more person tells me to be positive - including my husband - I'll strangle them) , I want to scream & stamp my feet at how unfair & cruel this feels.
I am aware that there is a whole lot of 'I' & 'me' in this post. Please tell me I'm not alone in this bubble of selfish self pity

[Anotherdayanotherdollar]

Sorry to hear that. No experience here but feel free to rant. Life can be shit

[IsthisMummy]

So sorry to read your post.

You don't have to be positive. You are allowed to be as sad, angry and bitter as you need. I've only been ttc since April and I already want to punch people who tell me to stay positive. It must be horrendous.

Thinking of you. x

[Pinkheels]

You're not alone, and it's not selfish to feel how you do. I've had three failed cycles and each time it has been absolutely crushing. One was a chemical pregnancy and the faint glimmer of hope was destroyed so swiftly, I can't imagine how you must be feeling. I think anger and rage and bitterness is sadly part of the process and no-one can tell you how to feel and what to do. Being positive is sometimes the same as putting a mask on what you think are ugly emotions which are perfectly normal consequences of this shitty, gruelling process. My husband is exactly the same, but maybe that's how he copes with things. As for me, it's been a case of plodding from one day to the next. Thinking of you

[Sussex1983]

Thanks for the replies, yesterday wasn't a good day, you have definitely made it just a little bit better with your support.

[mypropertea]

It is shit. I am sorry it is shit for you. I am also angry for you, it is so unfair.

In my experience the gym and rage music helped, but I still wanted to thump all the stay positive people. Especially the "we had the same and now we have kids people". Just cos they had a happy ending it didn't mean I would.

[Tryingno1]

Hi Sussex so sorry to hear of ur losses and Tx :(

I've had 6mc and 3 isci cycles so I know too well ur emotions. It's hideous esp in the immediate aftermath of a loss. It's unfair cruel and emotionally physically and finically draining.... I haven't given up just yet though, some madness keeps me going!

I always tell myself after each mc the utter despair and pain I feel does somehow lift slowly and life becomes a bit more bearable although still sad...

Hope u and ur oh are staying strong through it all and u have people around u to help hugs to u xxxx

[Daisiesandgerberas]

I've been in your situation having TTC for 15+ years.

Get angry, swear, shout, go silent, back away or get in their face, do what you need to do. Those that care won't mind, that's what I learned.

I am so so sorry you're having to feel this heartbreak. It's absolutely shit & I wouldn't wish it upon my worst enemy.

I'm sorry there's nothing I can do to help but we're here to talk with you You're allowed to have a pity party xxxx

[INeedNewShoes]

You're allowed to feel sorry for yourself. It isn't fair

Following four rounds of fertility treatment this year I have had two chemical pregnancies (lost at 5 weeks) and a MMC at 11 weeks. I'm pregnant again and fear a miscarriage every single day.

After my miscarriage I requested a load of blood tests and discovered that I've got a blood clotting disorder that may have caused the MMC and the chemical pregnancies. Getting that treated might be what is making a difference this time.

Give yourself time to be upset and regroup, and if you haven't already been tested for some of the causes of miscarriage, look into having some tests?

But for now look after yourself and allow yourself to wallow in self pity a little.

[Sussex1983]

Thanks again for all the replies, it really has helped. The anger has subsided a little, now I just have that low down pit of sadness. Think I preferred the anger.
I'm sorry too for your losses & struggles - this isn't a club anyone wants to be part of.

INeedNewShoes - I've to go back to the clinic this week for another scan & to discuss why they think this may have happened. Our issue is male factor fertility, so the miscarriages have just been another unexpected issue. I am going to ask them about bloods for anything that may have contributed. I would have thought that they check these things before you give them your life savings, but silly me......
I'm understand your fear, but I am keeping everything crossed for your pregnancy to be happy, healthy & successful. I think we've all had enough bad luck, something good has got to happen

[INeedNewShoes]

I went to see my GP (NHS) with a list of the blood tests I thought would be worthwhile and she ran all but one of them for me, so it might be worth you seeing your GP.

The hollow sadness is typical after the anger subsides. Remember you are basically grieving. The only thing I found helped me through was to resist my inclination to block everyone out. Spending time with friends and family let some small rays of light permeate the bleakness. Look after yourself and let others look after you too.

[Sussex1983]

Thank you.
If you have time, would you be able to let me know what bloods you asked for ?
Much appreciated

[INeedNewShoes]

I'll seek out the list at lunchtime and let you know.

[Sussex1983]

Thank you - much, much appreciated

[Tryingno1]

Sussex we too have male factor

I've had all the tests imaginable including immunes (privately). Not much found except the odd thing which is controversial anyways (I'm still getting Tx for these just in case!) but all the NHS screen came back normal. After 3mc your Gp will refer you to your local rec mis clinic where they will do a whole lot of bloods!

Turns out we finally found out that we were making a huge no of abnormal embies despite my age (hence no one suspected it and no one was pro me doin pgs). Our last mc was trisomy 13 and our 3 frozen blasts were all abnormal - we defrosted them and tested them and refroze them.

If ur male factor is severe it can contribute to this (and Also it's normal for approx 50 percent of blasts to be abnormal at age 30, not sure why they didn't tell me this !) and so we are now doing pgs to check chromosomes of any embies which go back in . It's not a guarantee but means I won't mc due to a trisomy or other genetic issue again (at least)

May be worth discussing , hope ur ok

Xxx

[bananafish81]

I'm so sorry for your losses

I've never known such anger as I've felt during this shitty process of infertility and miscarriage

After two losses of chromosomally normal embryos I feel untold anger towards my body

I feel boiling anger when I see pregnant women stroking their bumps on the tube

I hate myself for feeling angry at the world when I read happy news on infertility forums about fellow warriors moving forwards - because I'm happy for them, but sad for me that I'm left behind on the bench of boredom (I'm actually going backwards as I'm on frigging contraception to try and help me stop losing healthy babies)

I feel horribly angry when well meant people say 'have you tried...?' (Yes, I have tried frigging everything. I've tried more things than you've ever heard of. I've tried things my Dr has never done before with any patient because we are rapidly running out of options)

I've never known anger like it. The anger powers me forward - I'm actually more concerned that my anger feels like it's waning and being replaced with a resigned sadness, as it feels like my fight is being snuffed out

Thinking of you xx

[Cityzen74]

Sussex - I'm very sorry for your losses. I'm not surprised you are angry and I think you are entitled to be.

Take care of yourself as best you can.

[Sussex1983]

I still have 2 frozen embryos - all of my frozen (had 4 in total) were top grade/quality. At the risk of sounding silly - can they still be 'abnormal' or is this something that would need to be specifically tested for, as opposed to being part of the normal process ?
Thank you again all for taking the time to respond to me. I feel so utterly alone in 'real life'.
I'm usually the strong, pragmatic & rational friend/sister/wife - and this probably contributes to me feeling like no one can say or do the right thing to make me feel better and those who do know the situation we have found ourselves in just want to give some sympathy & move on. Not because they are being bad or nasty, they just don't know what else to do.
I need to shift these feelings of anger & upset & start doing something to feel like I am in control of my life, if not my fertility.

[Sussex1983]

I clearly have lost my ability to count, I had 5 embryos in total as a result of my first egg collection.

[bananafish81]

Sussex sadly it is possible for 'top quality' embryos to be abnormal - the grading is a beauty contest but doesn't say anything about its genetic integrity. I had 4 frozen embryos from my second round, all 'excellent quality', but we thawed, biopsied and refroze them (like trying) and found that all 4 were genetically abnormal. Statistically at aged 34 at least one of them should have been normal, but they were all duds

Our third round was better - we got 9 embryos to blast that were suitable for biopsy and freezing, and got 6 normals. The 3 abnormals were all 'top quality'

Sadly you really cannot judge a book by its cover 😓

I feel very much the same as you in that all it seems I am is a professional infertile (and a pretty rubbish one at that, as no bloody baby!) and the lack of any control is maddening (and saddening). I don't think there is a right thing my family and friends could say or do, it's just completely shit! Never have I tried so hard to get precisely nowhere xx

[Sussex1983]

Thanks Banana, I hadn't realised that - I assumed that the grade took everything into account (ohhhhh, the blind assumptions I have made..) it's something for me to check with the clinic when I go back this week.

[littlebeek]

So sorry to hear this

I've had 3 failed IVF attempts and just found out I have immune issues. So after TTC for 18 years I'm now having to make the decision if I try again or go for donor eggs.

My point is I get angry at the situation, but mostly sad.

YANBU.

[INeedNewShoes]

Hi Sussex - sorry it took me a while to get back to you.

I can't find the exact list that I requested but I got it from a recurrent miscarriage clinic website. It definitely included the following:

Lupus anticoagulant
Anticardiolipin G and M antibodies
Thrombophilia screen
Thyroid levels (TSH, T3, T4)

I would assume that you were tested for all STIs (Chlamydia can cause miscarriage) before your clinic would start fertility treatment, but if you weren't then definitely get the full lot of STI checks.

The same goes for hormone levels, I'm sure your fertility clinic must have checked these before you started, particularly:

Luteinising hormone levels (FSH/LH)


On people saying the wrong thing, its almost impossible for anyone to say the right thing to you. They will try to be positive to cheer you up. You just have to develop what I call a 'shit filter' and filter out anything unhelpful before it gets to you. Especially at this point you need to allow yourself to wallow in your misery a bit, but do try not to push people away

[littlebeek]

Op I would imagine the next step would be level 1 & 2 immune testing for you which is what I've just had done.
They test for NK cells, clotting issues, antibodies etc.
They cost me £2200 and my GP could only do one of the tests so I still had a huge bill from the clinic.

My good friend has suffered 4 miscarriages and now had the tests and she has nk cells. I've never been pregnant because of my immune issues.

It does cost a lot but at least you might have some answers that they could treat you for on your next cycle.

Good luck.

[Sussex1983]

Thanks littlebeak & NewShoes

[bananafish81]

Here's the level 1 immunes - not sure what your GP will do but here's the list to ask for:

FBC, anticardiolipin antibodies (IgG and IgM), antithrombin 111, factor V Leiden, factor II prothrombin gene, activated protein C resistance, Protein C, Protein S, lupus anticoagulant, MTHFR)

Level 2 are only done via certain clinics (ARGC, CARE, Dr Gorgy, Mr Shehata, Zita West) and have to get sent to Chicago - many clinics (like mine) will treat empirically for immunes without the tests

Good luck xx