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David Nutt tells it how it is and is sacked

(219 Posts)
Jux Fri 30-Oct-09 19:44:28

So the Government don't like it when one of their advisors actually takes notice of real evidence which doesn't quite accord with their stated policies (even though they say they want debate) and so sack the guy who says "but hang on...."

southeastastralbeing Fri 30-Oct-09 19:48:53

agree madness

cornsilk Fri 30-Oct-09 19:49:27

what did he do?

MonsterousNasalPustule Fri 30-Oct-09 19:49:38

Fairly typical.

ScummyMummy Fri 30-Oct-09 19:53:05

Agree- policy based on an "evidence base" is often such a myth, despite its chronic overuse as a term. Unless it chimes with what the politicians are already saying you can forget evidence all too often, especially when it comes to a sensitive issue like drug use...

Ponders Fri 30-Oct-09 19:55:12

They had him on PM and he was incandescent.

Hope he continues to kick off now he's free to say what he likes grin

Jux Fri 30-Oct-09 20:34:23

Wish I'd heard him Ponders. Agree, at least they can't muzzle him now.

LynetteScavo Fri 30-Oct-09 20:37:02

Cornsilk, he was government advisor on drugs, who said Canabis and Ecstacy are less harmfull than cigarettes and alcohol. And was scacked for giving his opinion.

I think.

Jux Fri 30-Oct-09 20:38:17

Well, it was his opinion, but it was actually evidence based, so rather more than a mere opinion, LynetteScavo, iyswim

Ponders Fri 30-Oct-09 20:39:36

Try listen again here Jux.

He's at about 30 mins onwards

Jux Fri 30-Oct-09 20:45:30

here a bit at 17:17; Mr Nutt is on at 30:30.

Jux Fri 30-Oct-09 20:46:01

Thanks Ponders - x posted!

pipWereRabbit Fri 30-Oct-09 20:49:39

I was so impressed by him on PM, made his points very well and is clearly hacked off at the government.
Quite agreed with him that it's fair enough for governments to make policy on the basis of moral arguments - just don't pretend it's science when it's not.

Jux Fri 30-Oct-09 20:51:02

He's talking about fact as opposed to 'message'. It's worth listening to. He's not advocating taking drugs, he's merely trying to help to inform the public rather than misinform them.

Jux Fri 30-Oct-09 20:52:46

Yup, pipWereRabbit. He is very good. Sadly, I think rather a lot of people prefer to believe the misinformation the Gov dishes out. (1984 where are you?)

pipWereRabbit Fri 30-Oct-09 20:55:56

I was thinking about MN while he was talking, wondering how many parents here would be prepared to alter their own or their children's behaviour to reflect the scientific data that shows you are more likely to die/be seriously injured horse riding than you are by using canabis.

Jux Fri 30-Oct-09 20:57:44

Hmm, I wonder ...


can't imagine it

pipWereRabbit Fri 30-Oct-09 21:00:30

Get off that horse this instant, and if I ever catch you wearing jodpurs again, I'll ground you.

CoteDAzur Fri 30-Oct-09 21:04:08

Well, in all fairness, death is not the only possible negative outcome when it comes to drugs.

Having said that, I don't understand what the big deal is about drugs like cannabis and ecstasy, which are not terribly disruptive socially nor do they seem to be terribly harmful to the user. In a world where cigarettes and alcohol are legal, I don't see why the hysteria surrounding their use.

My conclusion is that government is the enemy of fun smile

SCARYspicemonster Fri 30-Oct-09 21:10:21

I am appalled by this. Sacked for having the temerity to suggest that drug classification is more about political expediency than truth. Well I never.

Why, on the one hand, are cigarettes banned pretty much everywhere and we're told that we can't drink more than 2 units a day (or none if you're pregnant), because they are so bad for you, and yet they're really not that bad for you?

No one has ever died from cannabis or ecstacy use as far as I know. Mind boggles

Ronaldinhio Fri 30-Oct-09 21:15:36

have they no idea how to manage anything?

what is the dark lord mandelson doing with his time?

shurley common policy for disagreeing with da senior management is movement swiftly into a sideways role with no media mouthpiece pref in Siberia

not blardy sacking him so that he endlessly goes on about it, articulately, to everyone, freely and going against every policy you've written

SCARYspicemonster Fri 30-Oct-09 21:16:49

Perhaps he'll be found hanging in the woods at the weekend ...

Jux Fri 30-Oct-09 21:21:09

No, he'll go for a walk and be found sitting under a tree with a bottle of paracetomol.

Heathcliffscathy Fri 30-Oct-09 21:24:08

have emailed him here

absolute disgrace this.

unfortunately it applies across the board: we're evidence based til we don't like the evidence.

particularly appalling within the realm of environmental research (mrsophable has much to say on this wrt impact of current UK fisheries legislation).

tyres Fri 30-Oct-09 21:30:50

David Nutt is a prominent psychiatrist. He knows what he is talking about and it is not just 'his opinion'. It is shocking that the government has sacked someone who was on the telly the other day testing a new potential drug which it is hoped will simulate the effect of alcohol but is completely safe and has no side effects.

I had the pleasure of being in contact with him via my work on a number of occasions and although I didn't realise it at the time he is a 'maverick' indeed. Lets hope someone sometime soon in power will realise he is talking sense about drugs of all kinds.

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