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Man made climate change a lie?

(106 Posts)
Cortina Wed 21-Oct-09 12:46:27

Know there is a thread on this (sort of) but read this and was interested in what the 'true facts' are as far as we can tell?

Here's the deal. Global Warming Alarmism and keeping the lie alive is now a massive industry. If the IPCC gets its way, it will become the single biggest industry on the planet consuming significant financial resource and killing many other industries. Globally there are already hundreds of thousands of jobs at stake entirely dependent on this lie. The scientists, IPCC, lobbyists, green energy, Govt agencies were the first to feast in this trough. Now with emissions trading schemes, etc. on the horizon the money involved will rapidly escalate from the tens of billions to the tens of trillions of dollars. With those numbers coming, we now see the greediest pigs of all getting involved - the bankers and financiers.

How did we get to this? Well the average person is essentually stupid and has virtually no understanding of science and physics. If a message is repeated enough by people they trust they will eventually believe it is true despite all the evidence, data and facts that show otherwise. That's why we still have religions and belief in god and gods, and accepted that WMDs existed without any proof at all.

It is simple IQ test.

Belief in Man-made Global Warming = total idiot

Iklboo Wed 21-Oct-09 12:48:35

What a lot of studies fail to tell people is that a lot of the predictions are computer extrapolated. And the computers are programmed by the people who want to put a particular spin on their findings.....

throckenholt Wed 21-Oct-09 12:58:51

do you really believe this ??

The people running the computer models could just as easily be running models on something else - they have very transferable skills. they don't do it to con you into paying their salary !

There is incontrovertable evidence that the arctic sea is melting, that global temperatures are rising, that glaciers are retreating etc etc etc - sadly.

Burying your head in the sand and denying it won't make it go away.

somewhathorrified Wed 21-Oct-09 12:59:47

There's no evidence to support man made climate change and tbh I think it's yet another example of human arrogance to think it is, which is now being exploited and turned into a very lucrative money spinner. However, non renewable resources are diminishing and as such I think it only makes sense to be a bit careful on our useage. Offsetting carbon footprints is the biggest joke of all, even if you do believe in global warming....what do they think they can do, pay off mother nature!

VulpusinaWilfsuit Wed 21-Oct-09 12:59:57

What, unlike the vested interests of the Oil industry?

What nonsense.

overmydeadbody Wed 21-Oct-09 13:03:31

therockenholt denyiong that climate change can be blamed on humans is not the same thing as denying climate change.

Of course the arctic sea is melting, but that cannot be blamed on humans.

Tis just life. Nothing sad about change imvho.

overmydeadbody Wed 21-Oct-09 13:05:59

And I agree, offsetting carbon footprints is a joke.

But I do not agree with: Belief in Man-made Global Warming = total idiot

It is more a case of Belief in man made Global Warming = totally ignorant or gullible or doesn't have the time to research themselves so believes what they read in the paper.

thatsnotmymonster Wed 21-Oct-09 13:08:41

There are parts of the arctic that are melting and also parts which are expanding and thickening- it's just that the media only report on one side!

DH works in the environment industry and he and most of his colleagues don't believe in man-made climate change.

The temperature of the earth has always gone up and down.

throckenholt Wed 21-Oct-09 13:09:18

>Of course the arctic sea is melting, but that cannot be blamed on humans.

why do you say that ?

>There's no evidence to support man made climate change

can you explain this ? You can make statements like this without backing them up.

Bottom line is that there is a finite amount of carbon in the world - much of it was tied up in fossil fuels - it is now in the atmosphere and the ocean. And that is not caused by natural processes. However, natural feedback will mean that huge amounts of greenhouse gasses may well be released as a result of our initial activities. And once they start there is no stopping them.

Hundreds of different unrelated strands of evidence are now on record to show that this really is happening and only human activity can be responsible.

Iklboo Wed 21-Oct-09 13:11:37

And remind me again - was it the dinosaurs not switching off their TVs that caused the last ice age - or Neanderthals driving 4x4s on the school run that brought ot to an end?

I KNOW people running the computer models have transferable skills but it's not me paying their salary it's the people who have commissioned the report

Lancelottie Wed 21-Oct-09 13:11:58

Of course thay are computer-predicted.

Quite how that lets you believe the more comfortable option beats me.

It took a lot of 'evidence, data and facts' to persuade most scientists that there might be a problem. One of the initial sceptics was my brother-in-law, who is a climate scientist and has been since before most of the current alarm kicked in. Unfortunately, his own satellite measurements show otherwise (you'll realise that I'm now singlehandedly crediting him with the work of his entire international collaboration -- he doesn't personally make satellites and stand in his garden chucking them skywards).

He, erm, wishes he thought he was making it all up for the sake of his research funding.

I do remember the early days of debate on this, because I am really old an ex-editor from a decent journal in this field. I suppose on the current reasoning that actually means I can't have an opinion because I was paid to do my job.

Debate is fine, but 'belief in global warming = idiot' is not a debate.

<<sits back and waits for ABD to come on and say that he used to work in this field too, and it IS all politics...>>

throckenholt Wed 21-Oct-09 13:12:11

>DH works in the environment industry and he and most of his colleagues don't believe in man-made climate change.

which branch - most people I know in that field firmly believe the evidence they see to support it.

>The temperature of the earth has always gone up and down.

but never so quickly, and never without out other underlying physical processes going on - which is not the case now.

>a case of Belief in man made Global Warming = totally ignorant or gullible or doesn't have the time to research themselves so believes what they read in the paper.

that is hardly worth answering ! And very condescending.

throckenholt Wed 21-Oct-09 13:13:47

> caused the last ice age

ever heard of Milankovitch cycles ?

Iklboo Wed 21-Oct-09 13:15:48

I'd rather by Raleigh cycles - they last longer

stuffitllllama Wed 21-Oct-09 13:16:01

Oh yes I believe this, I believe global warming is happening but I don't believe it's our fault.

I think pollution, garbage, landfill, smog and so on are far greater problems than CO2 and that focus on one is taking attention away from the other.

stuffitllllama Wed 21-Oct-09 13:17:29

I believe Prof Ian Plimer, the Australian geologist, who says it's part of earth's great cycle. He's terribly interesting.

GrimmaTheNome Wed 21-Oct-09 13:19:14

I'm a scientist, my DH is a scientist ... we are not total idiots. hmm

Sure, climate change can be natural. That doesn't mean it can't be man-made too. I've seen a lot of evidence correlating with human activity and frankly not a lot that negates this.

In any case - whether we are to blame or not, climate change is happening so we need to do whatever we can to mitigate it.

throckenholt Wed 21-Oct-09 13:21:48

>I'd rather by Raleigh cycles - they last longer
grin - hardly - can't see you (or anyone else) peddling your trusty steed in 40 000 years !

There are none so blind as those who will not see.

illgetyoubutler Wed 21-Oct-09 13:21:54

Google "The Great Global Warming Swindle".

stuffitllllama Wed 21-Oct-09 13:22:04

Grimma but if it's part of a cycle there isn't much we can do anyway. Much better to focus on the things we CAN do something about like landfill, pollution etc etc which are different.

OrmIrian Wed 21-Oct-09 13:22:53

Agree with throckenholt. Carbon that last saw the light of day billions of years ago is being released by human activities. It isn't 'natural' for that to happen.

And do you know what? I don't care whether climate change is man-made or just a little parlour trick by some bored deity, there are many many valid reasons for not carrying on as we are. Regardless of climate change. Pollution, the destruction of our natural environment with all that it holds for our physical and emotional well-being, the fact that we are running out of that carbon (that apparently isn't doing anything nasty at all) to burn.

Can't say that piece of 'journalism' sounds particulaly impartial or scientific hmm And for all the vested interests in the environmental industry, there are much richer, more powerful ones, with a great deal more to lose in those that oppose change.

onagar Wed 21-Oct-09 13:24:17

I don't know if it's true or not. It's too late now for me to go back to school and become a specialist in these things so I'm left at the mercy of those who claim to know.

However, there are those arguing both sides so it would seem it is not proved as such. Also I do see groups latching onto it as a means to an end.

My electricity company wants me to use less electricity, but pay them as much or more as I did before. This is to 'save the planet' and not of course to increase profits.

Most of the plans to combat it are ludicrous too (except in that they profit somebody). If we want to do something about mankind affecting the environment (and certainly there are provable effects from overpopulation without bringing in icebergs) then we need China's one child policy until we get back to a reasonable population.

stuffitllllama Wed 21-Oct-09 13:28:39

Of course I don't think people are idiots for belieiving in man made global warming. But neither the other way.

Iklboo Wed 21-Oct-09 13:29:32

Or those that won't listen to both sides of an argument wink

OK - I do agree that there is climate change, that much is obvious. However, it is not all necessarily entirely down to the evolved ape that is man

I do agree that we need to make changes to the way we live if only for the landfill/pollution/smog etc

I don't agree that various governments should tax the feck out if their populaces to make it look like they're doing something and then manipulate facts & figures to justify it

And the Raleigh cycle post was a joke grin

stuffitllllama Wed 21-Oct-09 13:29:45

"Well the average person is essentually stupid and has virtually no understanding of science and physics."

Cortina that's silly.

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