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Harriet Harmen is an idiot

(30 Posts)
FabulousBakerGirl Fri 05-Jun-09 17:29:21

"He has a mandate...."

He doesn't!

"The labour party elected him!"

Yes, the people didn't.

Jux Fri 05-Jun-09 17:39:38

There are much better reasons for loathing HH, but that one will do grin wink

FabulousBakerGirl Fri 05-Jun-09 17:41:24



janeite Fri 05-Jun-09 17:45:05

Harriet Harman is an idiot - this is NEWS?!!

TheCrackFox Fri 05-Jun-09 17:51:30

Most of us worked out she was an idiot years ago. wink

FabulousBakerGirl Fri 05-Jun-09 18:00:46

merely pointing out her latest nonsense

georgimama Fri 05-Jun-09 18:28:37

She is an idiot (but curiously beloved of MNers, no doubt on the grounds that she is a woman, and a Cabinet Minister, and therefore inherently "a good thing").

Listening to her squirm whn Eddie Mayer quoted Alan Sugar's thoughts on employing women of child bearing age (basically, you wouldn't, obviously hmm) was almost too much to bear. Almost, but not quite, because I really do loathe her.

edam Fri 05-Jun-09 18:36:23

The people never ever elect a prime minister directly, though. Gordon's the leader of the party that had the most votes at the last election - and there can't have been anyone who voted Labour who didn't think we were going to get Brown before too long?

georgimama Fri 05-Jun-09 18:41:37

I think you'll find it was a manifesto commitment that Tony Blair would be PM for the whole term. So yes, I would imagine a fair few people did think they would honour that (not me obviously, as I'd look out the window to check if Tony Blair said it was raining).

Tinker Fri 05-Jun-09 18:43:03

Exactly as Edam says. Why do people keep trotting out this "we, didn't elect him" line. You elect your own MP.

georgimama Fri 05-Jun-09 18:45:45

man·date (mndt)
1. An authoritative command or instruction.
2. A command or an authorization given by a political electorate to its representative.

Nope, he hasn't got one of those.

EffieGadsby Fri 05-Jun-09 18:46:34

The majority of the country seem to think this way about Gordon Brown, but Harman is right, as is Edam. If you voted Labour at the last election, you voted for the Labour candidate in your constituency - you did not vote for Blair unless you live in Sedgefield. You do not vote for the Prime Minister in this country! Do people really not understand this? I don't think Harman is the idiot here.

I don't recall people calling for an election when John Major replaced Thatcher; he didn't call one until a year and a half later, when an election was due. As was his right. Equally, Brown doesn't have to call one based on not being elected by the people. I personally feel an election should have taken place in May, but not for that reason.

nancy75 Fri 05-Jun-09 18:50:54

slightly off topic, but is mandelson actually an elected mp, or was he made a lord just so they could bring him back (like they are doing with alan sugar)?

georgimama Fri 05-Jun-09 18:51:38

You vote based on a manifesto. That manifesto contained a commitment that Tony Blair would be PM for a whole term. He is not. A fundamental manifesto pledge has been broken. That is why he doesn't have a mandate.

To quote "do people really not understand this?"


georgimama Fri 05-Jun-09 18:52:11

Second bit nancy. Don't you love democracy?

edam Fri 05-Jun-09 18:53:05

I seem to remember people complaining that Major hadn't been elected. And no-one thought he could possibly win when he finally did go to the country. Only he did... (not that I'd stake a single penny on Gordon pulling off the same trick).

Btw, Harman's equalities bill will do more to give women a fair deal than anything since the Sex Discrimination Act. AND she managed to fight off Mandelson, who thought a recession was a good reason to let companies carry on paying women less.

nancy75 Fri 05-Jun-09 18:53:16

i thought that was the case, but thought i must have got it wrong, why are people not up in arms about that?

HumphreyCobbler Fri 05-Jun-09 18:56:03

I heard this.

However much I dislike someone I still cringe for them when they are really on the ropes.

People don't JUST vote in their MP though. Of course they choose which party to vote for on the basis of their feelings about who they want for PM.

Gordon Brown could have called an election at the time he became PM. He chose not to.

EffieGadsby Fri 05-Jun-09 18:58:16

The influence of too many non-MPs in government is not a good thing. Mandy's BERR is, I think, half and half Commons and Lords, which doesn't sit right with me.

I'm not saying it's right about not electing the PM directly - I'm saying it's the way it is and has always been, so Brown isn't doing anything unusual or wrong. Just as when you vote for an MP, they can just change allegiance and go to another party, and there's sod all you van do about it. You don't even really vote for the party in a General Election - you vote for the individual.

edam Fri 05-Jun-09 19:04:21

You are right about that, Effie, very dangerous for democracy to have so many key posts held by Lords. How can MPs hold the government to account if they can't even question the people in charge?

It's like we are back to 1905 or something. In terms of women, too. Is there only one in cabinet now?

EffieGadsby Fri 05-Jun-09 19:11:48

I've just been skimming a PDF of the 2005 Labour manifesto and running searches on key words to see where it says that Blair would stand for the full term. I can't seem to find that pledge.

Those of you posting above must have a more intimate knowledge of the manifesto than I - can one of you please point out for me which page the pledge is on? Ta.

ThingOne Fri 05-Jun-09 19:17:03

Blair's commitment wasn't in the manifesto but he made a clear, public commitment to the full term in the job. Brown wailed liked a pig at the time.

I can't say I believed Blair at the time and did expect to get Brown part way through. But he did pledge the full term.

People certainly complained when Major became PM!

JeffVadar Fri 05-Jun-09 19:31:33

Hattie Harperson is an idiot, but she is very good at carrying on relentlessly repeating whatever she has been told to say by the spin doctors, and not be distracted by actually answering the question she has been asked...Until today!

I love Eddie Mayer's cheekiness, but he played a blinder today!

I really like Chris Heune too - I can't think why the Lib Dems chose Clegg as leader

edam Fri 05-Jun-09 19:43:24

'Harperson' is a dig usually made by misogynists. How dare a pesky girl stand up for women's rights... oooh, how funny her name includes the word 'man', bet no-one's pointed that out before. <sigh>

As bad as the more backwards members of the Tory party thinking it's amusing to call John Prescott over to fetch them a drink.

georgimama Fri 05-Jun-09 20:22:40

Edam, it is equally sexist to assume that she must be great and is getting picked on for being a "pesky girl" playing men's game.

She gets picked on because she's rubbish. It's got nothing to do with her being a "pesky girl". That belittles women.

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