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Majority of women if Afgan jails there for being victims of rape

(135 Posts)
Monkeytrousers Tue 19-Aug-08 10:35:18

Glad the mainstream press have finally picked up on this

jesuswhatnext Tue 19-Aug-08 11:53:05

makes me realise how lucky i am!!!

poor women sad

TenaciousG Tue 19-Aug-08 12:47:08

god bless the patriarchy. angry

nickytwotimes Tue 19-Aug-08 12:52:10

I had heard this, but haven't read about it in the press, so glad it has been picked up.
Truly dire.
sad

mamadiva Tue 19-Aug-08 13:12:05

That's such a shame for these women/girls.

Do Afghan men get jailed for raping or running away with someone the same as the women? I read something a while backa bout their murder laws can't remember where but it said that if a man kills a child or a woman then he won't be jailed as they are only worth half a life yet if a woman kills a man they are jailed fo life or killed. angry

constancereader Tue 19-Aug-08 13:19:46

I was feeling quite sorry for myself today before reading this.

Certainly puts my life into perspective sad

This is evil.

Blandmum Tue 19-Aug-08 13:24:58

These types of arrest are also not uncommon in parts of Pakestan

Monkeytrousers Tue 19-Aug-08 13:51:27

That was where I was first alerted to it MB. It is true of all Muslim states sadly.

feedmenow Tue 19-Aug-08 13:56:37

I didn't kow anything about this, but it (sadly) does not surprise me.

What did the official say about disease and agreeing with the prison sentences? Surely if there are men going round raping women, the authorities would be better to target them to reduce the spread of disease.

As others have said, makes me realise how lucky I am....

Alambil Tue 19-Aug-08 14:09:29

guess that's what happens in places where women aren't people, but posessions

HappypillsGalore Tue 19-Aug-08 14:30:39

horrifying
and feminisms 'gone too far' has it? (popular belief) 
yeah right.
sadsadangry

suedonim Tue 19-Aug-08 14:33:13

And it's funny how there's no mention of the men in this article on sex workers being rounded up under Shariah law. sad

DaddyJ Tue 19-Aug-08 14:57:40

Certain parts of rural Pakistan, yes, but all Muslim states, MT?

This is certainly a grotesquely ugly state of affairs but, MT,
before indulging in knee-jerk Muslim-bashing
it's worth remembering that the men who are enforcing this system
were financed, equipped and trained by the West.

And the fact that they are barbaric Islamic fanatics was precisely the reason
why the West so enthusiastically embraced these arseholes.
They were deemed (correctly) to be excellent allies against the godless Soviets.

This is the toxic legacy of the Cold War.
The Afghani people, particularly women, children and ethnic minorities,
paid the price for a glorious victory against Communism.

Monkeytrousers Tue 19-Aug-08 15:46:48

Oh so it's our fault hmm

So we should deny Islamic states and the people in them an agency of their own, is that correct?

Without the West's interfearance, they woudl be beyond criticism, is that it?

Shades of the 'noble savage' don;t you think? And the worst kind of orientalism, as Said would have it - yes, it's a bit of a paradox I know.

But regardless of such attemts to deflect from the issue to hand - the chronic suffering of these women should maybe, by your thinking, should maybe come second to politically correct back yard bashing, and western guilt (which in another paradox, is actually westerners putting their bruised sensibilities before the suffering of the people in situ - in the guise of being outraged for the poor senseless natives).

Or is it the issue that needs to be muddied? This is really about western imperialism not human rights - if the issue is complicated the Socialist worker treatment should hammer it out and put the plight of these women last and the plight of the western idealists first


Yes...so we should think nothing of it, is that

Monkeytrousers Tue 19-Aug-08 15:48:03

Ever heard of Moynihan?s law DJ?

DaddyJ Tue 19-Aug-08 16:39:45

Try Zbigniew Brzezinski's Islamic Green Belt policy, MT.

I recognise what you are are saying and, yes, white man's burden
can be a bit of a tiresome argument, particularly when it's used
to belittle 3rd World peoples and release them from any responsibility for their plight.

HOWEVER, when it comes to Afghanistan the West has to fully accept its share of the blame.
These gentlemen might be barbaric, misogynistic, Islamist fascists but, as they saying goes,
they were our barbaric, misogynistic, Islamist fascists..

And it would be rather hypocritical of you or anyone else
living their charmed litte lives in the West to forget that.

TenaciousG Tue 19-Aug-08 17:04:03

Excuse me but I don't see what is hypocritical about people being outraged by barbarism or misogyny, just because it was bankrolled by 'the West'. I rather think that it is you being hypocritical, saying don't lump all 'Muslim states' together, then talking about some nebulous place called 'the West' (when perhaps you mean North America?).

BellaDonna79 Tue 19-Aug-08 17:04:27

I read an article a while back that stated in some Islamic states a girl of 9 or over would be stoned for seducing a man if he raped her. It is truly awful. They are animals

dittany Tue 19-Aug-08 17:13:12

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Monkeytrousers Tue 19-Aug-08 18:14:15

Sorry, I'm not buying it.

Life and politics makes hypocrites of us all. That is the essence of Realpolitik is it not?

People (and states) should be allowed to change their minds. I don't have the same ideals as I did five years ago. I supported Palestine, Hamas and all, Islamic misogynists and all,simply because I followed the fashion of a good PC liberal rather than face the comlexity of the situation and realsing that taking sides was the easiest thing to do.

Do NGO's take political sides? Non partisan writers? Even if they did before? Are they hypocrites for doing so? If so, I'd be proud to be called a hypocrite to find myself in such company.

The west did not invent Islamic practice when it comes to women.

Monkeytrousers Tue 19-Aug-08 18:17:38

Dunno about 'they' Donna, it's a bit neblous and these thinsg have a tendency to blow up if they dont come with a caveat - the people who carried out the judgement, the people who sanction it, the people in power who do nothing to stop it, yes. IMO of course.

TenaciousG Tue 19-Aug-08 18:17:55

Exactly dittany, tis the patriarchy writ large. Women who report rape are treated with suspicion and stigma in pretty much every culture. Different regimes get away with different degrees of it.

Monkeytrousers Tue 19-Aug-08 18:21:22

and of course, DJ, we are aware and 'outraged' about certain regimes being backriolled by the west at ceryain times, for certain reasons. Just becasue you show outrage for one crime doesn't mean you sanction those that aren't mentioned.

Communism/totalitarianism has a worse record than facism too actually...why is fighting facism right yet communism (as it was practiced as totalitarianism) wrong?

fuzzywuzzy Tue 19-Aug-08 18:26:27

I read a really heart wrenching newspaper article a while back. The women interviewed spoke of the rule under the taliban and their lives now in Afghanistan. Under the taliban, they could sleep with their doors wide open and walk the streets unmolested, however they starved if they had no male breadwinner in the house as they were not allowed to work.

Now theoretically they can work, but they live in constant fear of rape, whether they lock their doors at night or no!

Must find the article it was gut wrenching reading.

Blandmum Tue 19-Aug-08 18:27:40

hmm there was a fair bit of molestation under the Taliban as well.

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