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Fathers need to be named on birth cert

(47 Posts)
jofeb04 Tue 19-Jun-07 19:51:02

Heard this on the news, not sure what i think about it yet

here

mytwopenceworth Tue 19-Jun-07 19:54:13

I think it is a good idea, providing - as the article mentions - safguards for exceptional circumstances are in place.

TrinityRhino Tue 19-Jun-07 19:57:06

Hmm, in theory it would be an ok idea but I dont think they CAN properly safegaurd women and children
My friend chose not to put the fathers name on the birth certificate so that he would not be able to try and be her father in later years, he is an addict and a horrid man.
How would they protect her?

jofeb04 Tue 19-Jun-07 19:58:55

Kind of agree with you. Good for one-night stands etc, but my mate was raped, and she never (obviously) put the b***ds name down. Imagine if she got fined

daisyboo Tue 19-Jun-07 20:01:18

Not sure how they could enforce it tbh.....my dh and I weren't married when I had DS and had actually split up. AS it needed him to be there to register the child as we weren't married I had to ask him to do that, even though he was less than enthusiastic about the pregnancy. would I, under the proposals be able to register him as the father without him being there?
Then there are the pregnancies where paternity is disputed, or as a result of drunken one night stands where the mother doesn't know who the father is.
Not entirely sure its workable.

CarGirl Tue 19-Jun-07 20:01:19

so what if the bloke won't come and register?????? You are stuffed, can't claim CSA!!!

mytwopenceworth Tue 19-Jun-07 20:03:09

If the father doesn't come in, he is required to submit to a dna test and (if positive) named in his absence. Maybe?

fennel Tue 19-Jun-07 20:10:54

But what if you make up a fake name of someone you met on holiday and had no details about. How could they possibly check?

CarGirl Tue 19-Jun-07 20:14:42

I think the implication is that both parents have to register the birth???

Anna8888 Tue 19-Jun-07 20:18:03

Unworkable IMO and a step backwards for women.

jofeb04 Tue 19-Jun-07 20:19:04

I assumed it would have to be both parents there, unless theres a specific reason as to why that it is not possible.

Would hope that the fine may stop people havingone night stands withpout protection, but, I somehow doubt that

jofeb04 Tue 19-Jun-07 20:19:26

How is it a step back Anna?

Anna8888 Tue 19-Jun-07 20:24:51

If male partners are unreliable (in any sense of the word) women currently have the option of keeping them at bay by not giving them parental responsibility. Why would you want to include the father in the day-to-day decision making of your child's life if he is not dependable? That can make women's and children's lives a complete misery.

mytwopenceworth Tue 19-Jun-07 20:26:09

I think it could be a step forward for society. We have to stop thinking of children as the womans property, the womans domain. It takes 2 to make a child and yet fathers are so often sidelined and are clearly discriminated against when it comes to custody, contact etc. And we wonder why there are so many feckless dads around.

Of course there are the men who should be kept as far away as possible from their children and the mother of their children, but they are the minority. The majority of men are deserving of equal rights and contact. And children deserve both parents wherever possible and not to be used as pawns in a power game, which happens a lot. - bad break up, stop him seeing the kids. mad at her, refuse to pay for the kids.

We need a major attitude adjustment in this country.

NKF Tue 19-Jun-07 20:29:27

What's to stop women from putting Johnny Depp down as the father?

jofeb04 Tue 19-Jun-07 20:44:35

I agree wth twopence, in that fathers do have a "right"to be named. Obv that deminishes with certain things. Itis not just women who have to bring up childen.


NFK, It might be hardto get Johnny Depp there (on the basis of both parents have to be there!).

NKF Tue 19-Jun-07 20:47:40

Ooops! I didn't realise that both parents had to be there to register. Not much better really. What if it's a messy relationship and the man is denying the child is his? What if he just never shows up? Tough enough for a woman to have a baby with an uncommitted man but to be penalised for it as well.

bookwormmum Tue 19-Jun-07 20:48:11

I don't understand how this can work - currently fathers not married to the mother need to attend the registration or swear an affidavit that they're the father. How can women suddenly name them without this safeguard? You could give anyone's name and they could find themselves liable for maintenance later on - and have to prove that they're not the father. It seems the govt haven't got anything better to do than fiddle with legislation (or social practices) that has worked reasonably well for 170-odd years instead of doing some real work.

What's the system in countries other than the UK for unmarried parents registering births?

RosaLuxembourg Tue 19-Jun-07 20:48:19

I'm not sure how workable this is in practice. How can you force a woman to name her baby's father? Why would you want to? I can see an argument for allowing a man to insist on a DNA test if he believed himself to be a child's father, but not for forcing a woman to name a father if there isn't an obvious candidate.

bookwormmum Tue 19-Jun-07 20:48:59

Oh they have to be there? Well that would let me out. My XP was 'too busy' to attend.

motherinferior Tue 19-Jun-07 20:58:39

What about babies conceived as the result of sperm donation?

Or if you just don't know who the father is? Or what his name was?

RosaLuxembourg Tue 19-Jun-07 21:03:21

Yes MI, there were plenty of 'conceivable occasions' in my past when I would have had trouble recalling the potential father's hair colour let alone his name. Or indeed had an embarrassment of candidates for the paternal nomination.

MissGolightly Tue 19-Jun-07 21:14:23

hmmm... difficult one. I agree that the father SHOULD be named on the birth certificate in all but exceptional circumstances, but I also agree it's unworkable in practice.

As Rosa points out, any mother that doesn't want her partner to be on the certificate only has to say she doesn't know who he is.

I think there is an argument for allowing a man who believes he is a father to insist on a DNA test and, if positive, to insist that he is named on the birth cert (as I understand it, at the moment the mother has no obligation to "allow" the father to attend). Except of course situations where violence and rape are involved.

ViciousSquirrelSpotter Tue 19-Jun-07 21:17:17

How would you prove that violence and rape are involved?

I can't remember the exact figure but I vaguely think that the accepted number of times a woman is hit by the man she lives with before she calls the police, is 34.

If he's only hit her 27 times and she's never reported it, how is she to prove he's a violent git?

No way should this come in.

glitterball Tue 19-Jun-07 21:34:04

I can't see how this will work - the situation now as far as I'm aware is if you are not married you can only put fathers name down on the birth certificate if he comes to register the birth.

how is the new law going to change this? ok so the govt say you MUST put the fathers name down...but surely as the law stands now if you have any kind of relationship with the father of a child he will be going along and being named anyway. of course there are lots of feckless idiots who aren't on the certificate cos they can't be bothered, mums don't know where they are or want anything to do with them - they aren't registered now and i can't see how the govt saying they must be will change anything - are they going to get the police to force them to attend registration of the birth?

alternatively if you just allow mums to put anyone down as the father without them being there how would that be controlled? as an earlier post said you could put anyone down!

seems like some typical government knee jerk reaction to me! probably to show they are 'cracking down' on absent fathers etc........cos of course the last time that was done via the CSA it was so successful!

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