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Josie Long - we are more at risk from right wing extremists than Islamic extremists

(445 Posts)
Goodluckjonathan76 Fri 23-Jun-17 12:51:05

A friend just posted a link to Josie's rant on her Facebook page. I honestly felt sick watching it. For a start, in terms of numbers of deaths, we are looking at 2 deaths (Jo Cox and man at Finsbury Park mosque) (please correct me if I am wrong) compared to multiple deaths in Manchester and London Bridge, not to mention the attacks in Paris, Nice and Brussels. Firstly, how is this the time to be comparing which is worse, and secondly, if we must compare then Islamic extremists pose a far greater risk in terms of loss of life. Am I missing something? Or has the world gone mad.

Alittlepotofrosie Fri 23-Jun-17 13:26:42

Well right wing extremists have the backing of the media, so...

BahHumbygge Fri 23-Jun-17 13:33:51

Oklahoma City bomb, 168 killed, 680 injured
Anders Breivik, Norway, 77 killed, 319 injured
Soho nail bomber, 3 locations targeting black, gay & Bangladeshi communities, 3 killed, 140 injured

is that enough to start with?

HattiesBackpack Fri 23-Jun-17 13:38:05

Extremists in any form are dangerous, and right and left wing tend to overlap too.
At the moment I'm not a big fan of the hate being stirred up by some sections of the far left, there is some seriously nasty stuff doing the rounds on social media and I can't understand how the people sharing and liking it don't see how hateful and damaging it is.

Goodluckjonathan76 Fri 23-Jun-17 14:03:47

Ok, I was trying to focus on recent events in the UK rather than what has happened in the last 20-30 years on a global basis. That becomes a different argument. In terms of threats specific to the UK, surely Islamic extremist poses a far greater threat than right extremists, in terms of lives lost?

Goodluckjonathan76 Fri 23-Jun-17 14:06:56

How do right wing extremists have the backing of the media? Everything I read seems to do the complete opposite, i.e. massive downplaying of large scale attacks by Islamic extremists compared to mass hysteria when one alleged right wing extremist (yet to proven) attacks a mosque. The outpouring of grief and horror is way beyond what we saw at London Bridge where people were basically getting their throats cut.

pigeondujour Fri 23-Jun-17 14:10:58

Specifically what downplaying of which Islamic extremist attacks do you mean?

BeyondOfbob Fri 23-Jun-17 14:16:47

Are they just talking about risk of terror attacks, or risk in general?

As a right wing extremist is more likely to gain a position of power in the Uk than an Islamist extremist.

Goodluckjonathan76 Fri 23-Jun-17 14:17:13

Well, the Sadiq Khan saying that terrorist attacks are part and parcel of everyday life for a start. Jeremy Corbyn's reaction for another. Shedding tears over the loss of one life in Finsbury Park. Did he shed tears at London Bridge, in Manchester? And, my personal favourite, the flurry of articles and commentary we had after every other attack, how are we be upset when these attacks happen all the time in Syria, Iraq, Afghanistan etc. Where are those commentators now saying the same thing? Where. That is the type of downplaying I mean.

Goodluckjonathan76 Fri 23-Jun-17 14:20:24

Beyondofbob, I am talking specifically about risk of death, not political risk, in light of the comments made by Josie Long who said she is more frightened by the far right than Islamic extremists.

BahHumbygge Fri 23-Jun-17 14:22:38

No, they're not separate things. The narratives of right wing ideology are still as current today as they were a couple of decades ago. Sure, thought evolves over the passage of time somewhat, but it's still underpinned by the same underlying ethos. USA Right politics is slightly different, in that they have the libertarian strain, post-revolution, but the Right is converging globally under Alt-right narratives.

And Anders Breivik could easily have happened here, we are quite culturally similar to Norway, socially democratic. Indeed he was in close contact with many far right groups & internet forums in the UK like EDL.

surferjet Fri 23-Jun-17 14:22:42

Who's Josie Long?
This is one of the reasons I look at social media less & less - too many idiots on here.

I do not fear right wing extremists no, but I worry pretty much all the time now about Islamist attacks.

pigeondujour Fri 23-Jun-17 14:27:13

Well, the Sadiq Khan saying that terrorist attacks are part and parcel of everyday life for a start. Jeremy Corbyn's reaction for another. Shedding tears over the loss of one life in Finsbury Park. Did he shed tears at London Bridge, in Manchester?

Sadiq Khan literally didn't say that. The sentence he did say had an entirely different meaning. So...

Didn't check his tear ducts but Jeremy Corbyn was at the vigil in Manchester soon after the attack.

Goodluckjonathan76 Fri 23-Jun-17 14:28:35

Google it surferjet, or maybe not unless you want to feel like the world has gone mad.

I live close to Finsbury Park and my kids go to school in the area. I worry all the time about Islamist attacks, especially retaliation attacks in light of what happened last week. I don't fear an attack from right extremists in the least, most likely because there have been far fewer.

pigeondujour Fri 23-Jun-17 14:29:45

Are you BME, OP?

Goodluckjonathan76 Fri 23-Jun-17 14:33:30

The response that I saw on the social media to the Manchester and London Bridge attacks was very different to the attack on Finsbury Park. In Manchester and London Bridge, there seems to be a sort of acceptance, it's happened again, too bad, people are dead etc etc. With Finsbury Park there seem to be a lot of people expressing shock and outrage. Just an observation and maybe incorrect but that is how it seemed to me.

Goodluckjonathan76 Fri 23-Jun-17 14:33:52

BME??

pigeondujour Fri 23-Jun-17 14:36:47

BME??

That'll be why you don't fear far right extremism then.

Social media is an echo chamber. That said, with Finsbury Park what a lot of people were outraged about were how it was a direct result of anti-Muslim propaganda from the government and the mainstream media. Hence, you know, the fear of the far right.

YokoReturns Fri 23-Jun-17 14:37:07

BME = black and Minority ethnic. The fact that you don't know this suggests you might want to do some reading on the subject you are discussing.

surfer why would you fear far-right attacks when you're clearly not the target?

I fear for society when people like the OP sow division.

Goodluckjonathan76 Fri 23-Jun-17 14:42:17

Noone is trying to sow division Yoko. It's rants like Josie's that sew division and pitch people against each other.

To say you shouldn't fear attacks if you are not the target is ridiculous. Many people are killed by accident or where they are not the direct target, just wrong place, wrong time. Who even knows who is the target in the warped mind of extremists? If we want to talk about Anders Breivik then he targeted his own, didn't he? He wasn't targeting BME, to use your terminology.

If you want to blame people for sowing division, blame extremists and people like Josie rather than people trying to discuss the topic in a balanced way.

Hidingtonothing Fri 23-Jun-17 14:42:40

If when you say 'far right' you mean the likes of Britain First and the EDL then no, I don't think they pose anything like the same level of threat as Islamic extremists. IS supporters have deeply held beliefs, are prepared to die for their 'cause' and have access (either direct or online) to highly organised, trained jihadi networks and weapons, bomb making knowledge etc. The average EDL or Britain First supporter is, by contrast, prepared to get pissed up and gobby at demo's and spout their nonsense on FB. Do I think it's possible the odd nutjob will become radicalised by what they see online and carry out an attack, yes of course but it's on nowhere near the same scale as the Islamic terrorist attacks we've seen in recent years.

Goodluckjonathan76 Fri 23-Jun-17 14:43:47

What reading should I be required to do before I post on this topic? I pay my taxes and I would like to have the right to leave in peace and to raise my kids in London without fearing for their lives.

Goodluckjonathan76 Fri 23-Jun-17 14:45:38

"live" in peace.

CrossWordSalad Fri 23-Jun-17 14:52:24

I fear for society when people like the OP sow division

How is the OP sowing division?

OP I felt quite sick hearing Josie Long's piece.

pigeondujour Fri 23-Jun-17 14:54:18

What reading should I be required to do before I post on this topic?

It's no one here's job to educate you. You're free to post on the topic but don't expect not to be challenged if your points are weak.

Anders Breivik didn't target BME people, but he was an anti-Islam right wing extremist, and "I don't fear an attack from right extremists in the least" could only be said by someone with un-self aware white privilege.

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