Now could you imagine the uproar if the same rule was applied to English speaking Brits........

[fannyannie]

who were moving abroad to live/work...\link{http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/6380867.stm} - there'd be an AWFUL lot of people not able to go to live their 'life in the sun' - or whatever if was they had planned..........

[FluffyMummy123]

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[fannyannie]

but lots of Expats AREN'T lonely - as they join expat communities, with their own little groups of English friends, English bars, English clubs and English pastimes........hmmm sounds like what a lot of immigrants to this country get lambasted for doing.

[FluffyMummy123]

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[fannyannie]

not really us Brits do it all over the world - whether we move for "Corporate" reasons, or up sticks on our own......

[FluffyMummy123]

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[FluffyMummy123]

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[fannyannie]

well yes there are some exceptions to the rule - but sadly most of the 5.5 million British Citiziens living abroad prefer to live in British communities, eating British food, with British TV and English conversation .

[nailpolish]

oh you English people...

[LIZS]

In some countries , if you have to take say a driving test to renew or convert your licence or to get a work permit it would be conducted in the local language and you fail otherwise. Not sure that this is much different. Could be hard to apply within EU anyway I should think.

[JillyBeansNW]

I knew a bloke once who even refused to change time zones when he went abroad on business (to avoid jet lag )
I never found out what the people in Singapore thought of him only accpting meeting times really late or early in their day

[fannyannie]

lol Fio - just log into one of the 100(0?)'s of Expat websites and you'll see that most like to keep to themselves.

Funnily enough they usually live close together and socialise a lot together - in English too - setting a really good example for those who want to come and live in the UK of how to intergrate.

[Callisto]

I don't see a problem with this at all. Why on earth wouldn't you try and learn the language of your adoptive country? When I lived in Italy I learned to speak Italian - no big deal. What do you have against this Fannyannie?

[prufrock]

Difference is that expats from the UK generally have a high standard of living in their adopted country, and whilst the lack of local language might be morally and culturally a bad thing it doesn't actually hurt them economically or politically.

Not being able to speak English in this country often leads immigrants to be unable to access services or get jobs, and condemns them to a life of poverty and exclusion. I lived in Tower Hamlets and met so many Bangladeshi women when in hospital having dd who had a terrible time because they couldn't speak a word of English and were totally reliant on their husbands - which gave their husbands huge control over their lives.

Whilst the liberal in me would hate to see immigrants being forced to do anything, I do think that giving strong encouragement and support to people to enable them to learn to communicate in their new country is one of the best ways to solve the problems that ghetto-isation causes

[Eleusis]

I think any country, no matter what the native language, has a right to expect it's citizens and residents to use it.

It is, however, much easier to get by without learning the local language if your native language is English because English is usually the language of business.

I called DH's hotel in Bangalore, India earlier this week and they answered the phone in English.

[FluffyMummy123]

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[fannyannie]

Callisto - it's the hypocrisy (sp) of it that irritates me. Like the Brits in general are so perfect and make such an effort to mix into their new countries/communities..........of course there are those that make the effort - and I think they tend to enjoy the Expat experience more than those who shut themselves off - even sending their children to English speaking schools (even if they plan on living their long term)

[KathyMCMLXXII]

Isn't it about citizenship versus the right to live/work here?
You can get citizenship here without speaking English which is pretty unusual. My brother lives in Japan and if he wants to apply for citizenship there he will also have to have people come round to inspect his house and make sure he is living in a sufficiently Japanese style (which is unlikely because his Japanese wife likes being western. She also cooks a mean Yorkshire pudding - no Aunt Bessies for her.)
Bit excessive, but OTOH I do rather like the idea of all these English people in Spain being inspected to make sure they are living in a sufficiently Spanish way - that would be fun.

[Callisto]

Hmmm. I think you will find that the vast majority of Expats integrate completely - the rest come back to Britain. I can see several reasons for sending ones child to an English speaking school, not least that English is the international language of business. You seem to be anti British expats - I'm curious to know what your experience is of expat communities?

[Chandra]

"I think any country, no matter what the native language, has a right to expect it's citizens and residents to use it."

I think that't the minimum consideration you should show to the country that receives you.

It takes some time to learn a language, but being language the main carrier of culture, just making an effort to learn it/understand it, it shows some respect to the local population, otherwise the locals might feel "invaded" regardless of the economical conditions of the immigrants.

Besides, being a "rich" immigrant doesn't guarantee you are not bringing economical problems to a country. There is a lot of outrage in med countries at locals not being able to afford to live in their own towns due to house prices being adjusted to the pocket of the migrants with more powerful currencies.

[LIZS]

fannyannie, that is a bit of a generalisation . May well be true in soemcountries but as an ex-expat our "community" was a diverse mixture of nationalities, for whom the common language did happen to be English as the International school was english speaking, but equally I knew expats whose children were going through the local school system and were likely to be more permanent so took more trouble to intergrate both linguistically and socially. Shorter term expats tend to be subsidised by their employers and can often afford to live in areas which local people cannot, hence why you get pockets of expats.

[Chandra]

I think just a minority make an effort. Others just feel no need to as there are a lot of English speaking people all around the world.