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Did the Orlando attack just hand the presidency to Trump

(63 Posts)
ftw Mon 13-Jun-16 20:49:02

I've just watched a Trump speech. Oh dear God; no nation building in the ME, no immigrants from certain countries, American Muslims must turn in the bad ones, he's going to protect all the law abiding Americans etc etc

I fear it's going to play well.

claig Mon 13-Jun-16 21:45:02

I think Trump would have won anyway.

The Democrats are all out for gun control but I don't think that will play well enough with the majority and Trump is for maintaianing the Second Amendment. After a terrorist attack, people look for more safety and protection.

claig Mon 13-Jun-16 22:06:52

The killer was a registered Democrat, his father supports the Taliban and has met with senior Democrats before, his brother-in-law is anti Trump and blames it on America's gun laws (as do the Democrats). The killer worked as a contractor for the Department of Homeland Security for G4S. The Democrats are talking about gun control rather than radical Islamic terrorism.

I haven't heard what Trump has said, but I expect he will ask what is going on.

lionheart Tue 14-Jun-16 08:58:36

The Democrats are talking about radicalism.

claig Tue 14-Jun-16 09:09:47

'The Democrats are talking about radicalism.'

Yes, Hillary has been forced into using the term by Trump but Trump was on Fox last night and said she said she "would" call it Radical Islamism and Trump is not happy with that, he says she "isn't" calling it radical Islamic terrorism.

The Democrats will try to make it about gun control as they have done so often before, but the Democrats have failed on that before and I think they will fail again this time as Trump calls it Islamic terrorism.

originalmavis Tue 14-Jun-16 09:11:40

Tbh if that arse said he would scrap the second amendment, I'd vote for him.

ftw Tue 14-Jun-16 09:21:16

The Democrats will try to make it about gun control as they have done so often before

It should be about gun control. You can't stop people hating, but you can stop them having guns.

claig Tue 14-Jun-16 09:44:44

'It should be about gun control.'

It has never worked before and won't work now. The Republicans don't trust the Democrats and the voters will think that Hillary is missing the elepant in the room, which is Islamic terrorism.

Trump said yesterday that we have a President "who sounds as if he is asleep" when talking about it and if you watch Obama talking about it, that is not far off, whereas Trump has grabbed the issue by the horns.

Branleuse Tue 14-Jun-16 10:01:17

err gun control works pretty well in every other country, and the US havent tried it

claig Tue 14-Jun-16 10:03:37

It hasn't worked as a political policy in the US in convincing the Congress to change the law, and the Democrats will probably try to make it an election issue, but it is unlikely to work this time either as it will ignore the elephant in the room, which is what Trump has been accusing the Democrats, Hillary and Obama of doing all along.

DorynownotFloundering Tue 14-Jun-16 10:23:09

I think we have to accept the bizarre obsession with the Second amendment many Americans have .( amendments suggest updating in line with current needs does it not? Written when citizens were using muskets and bayonets not AK15's )

So given we cannot get them to give up weapons surely a compromise could be reached? Banning ownership of rapid fire weapons of any description, licensing of handguns and closure of these horrific gun supermarkets would be a start.

Trump is capitalising on the deaths of others children, this was a hate crime against gays fuelled by radicalisation but NOT condoned by the many many law abiding US Muslims now in fear, yet again, of walking down their own streets because of the Islamaphobic rants of the despicable man. The thought of him representing the US in the world arena fills me with dread.
He cannot win.

claig Tue 14-Jun-16 10:28:56

There are reports now coming out that the killer was gay and was a regular visitor to the club.

DorynownotFloundering Tue 14-Jun-16 10:38:26

That may or may not be the case and really if true if anything it makes it even more sad that the poor man was so riven with guilt and loathing for his own self that he did that. He only bought the guns recently if those guns had not been so easily available, if someone had quizzed him on why he wanted them, t might have been prevented or at worst reduced the death rate.

BreakingDad77 Tue 14-Jun-16 10:45:43

Repubs created the environment for someone like Trump to step in.

He saying exactly what the masses (for more wrongly than rightly) want to hear.

Its the same anti immigrant hypocrisy as in the UK, Conservative/Republican profit using cheap labour, then say we need to 'build a wall', 'take back control'.

The polarisation between repubs and libs in America is quite something, on another level when you compare Cons vs Labour in UK. People will write with conviction about how liberalism is a brain disease, that 40,000 etc who would die with out state health care should as basically they are workshy scroungers etc.

I thought after the school shootings they were going to try to at least try to limit gun ownage to people with mental health problems?

ftw Tue 14-Jun-16 11:48:53

So it looks like it was an act of extreme self-loathing by a born-American. But Trump's still shouting about radical terrorists from Syria. sad

UnderTheGreenwoodTree Tue 14-Jun-16 11:54:42

I believe the world has actually gone mad.

The slide towards the extreme right wing is really, really worrying.

ChipsandGuac Tue 14-Jun-16 12:02:06

As sad as Orlando is, it will be forgotten by November as far as the election is concerned so, no. Trump is still a long, long way from being President.

ftw Tue 14-Jun-16 12:19:30

You don't think Trump will keep beating this particular drum chips?

FarAwayHills Tue 14-Jun-16 14:54:15

I fear that this will come as a boost to Trumps campaign. It is a sad measure of him as a person to use this tragedy for his political point scoring.

How can Americans believe that banning immigrants from certain countries would have prevented the Orlando shootings. This was an act commited by an American and as long as guns are available the biggest danger to Americans is Americans themselves.

MadamDeathstare Tue 14-Jun-16 15:00:14

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

LaserShark Tue 14-Jun-16 15:08:46

There just seems to be this incredibly entrenched belief amongst pro-gun people that the safest solution is more guns. If the teachers had guns and could shoot the shooters, if the club-goers had been armed they could have shot him and so on and so on. As has been stated, if Sandy Hook changed nothing then what will turn the tide towards gun control? It's bewildering and terrifying and I shudder at the prospect of Johnson as prime minister and Trump as president - it makes me afraid for all of our futures. But I think Trump will sadly pick up further support for his dangerous and frightening rhetoric in response to this tragedy.

LaserShark Tue 14-Jun-16 15:10:10

Am very heartened by what Madam said though.

DorynownotFloundering Tue 14-Jun-16 19:12:51

I am hoping that like Madam there are many quietly horrified Americans who will make an effort to get to the polls & vote to stop The Donald.

All but one of my American friends are so embarrassed and repulsed by his rhetoric and table thumping.

I think I'm right in saying that traditionally there is a low turn out for US elections ( Madam is this true?) but hopefully this awful man will spur them to vote just to keep him out. It's a shame there is only Hilary as an opponent as I am told many don't like her but she is a damned sight more suited to the job than that slimey bigoted pervert!

MadamDeathstare Tue 14-Jun-16 19:26:45

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

PartiallyAnaesthetized Tue 14-Jun-16 20:16:32

That may or may not be the case and really if true if anything it makes it even more sad that the poor man was so riven with guilt and loathing for his own self that he did that.

Are you for real? Poor man!! You're actually sympathising with a mass murderer less than 2 days after he took fifty lives?
If his loathing was for himself he was free to commit suicide. I'll guess his loathing was for our liberal values like every other terror attack.

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