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Rebecca Minnock - on the run with child after court battle

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MNHQ have commented on this thread.

BreakingDad77 Thu 11-Jun-15 11:16:22

Is this one of those cases we wont get to the bottom of as to whether she is someone with MH problems or scheming father driving her to them?

PattiODoors Thu 11-Jun-15 11:21:52

Not sure if one ought to suspect MH issues or scheming father

A piece in the media indicated she obstructed contact between father and child and made malicious allegations about the father too

Hang on

bbc link

TensionWheelsCoolHeels Thu 11-Jun-15 11:29:43

Knowing the little that's been mentioned about this (so not that much) even though I abhor anyone who obstructs another parents relationship with their child, from the little boy's POV, I cant help but feel for him going to be uprooted from the home/life he's always had (even if it's based upon the mothers efforts to exclude the father - that's her doing, not the child's if that's what's happened). The punishment on her still punishes the child too & I struggle with that. Horrible situation.

SaulGood Thu 11-Jun-15 11:36:57

I have some experience of a similar situation. My good friend had a long, protracted and extremely difficult legal battle which resulted in residency being given to the father. It was a terrible, terrible time and the wrong decision in every way. She complied because she felt she had no choice and once the dc were old enough to choose, they went straight back to their Mum.

Generally, you can never know the full story.

NoNoNoMYDoIt Thu 11-Jun-15 11:50:00

Agree with Tension. He's lived with her since 2013. She may have obstructed contact and made things hideous for the father. If she did that, that was wrong. But the child has lived with his mother all this time and is now being taken away and put with his father, which will be confusing and could be potentially damaging to the child, depending upon how much contact he has actually had with his father up until now.

I assume there are other factors at play here about which we don't know, because otherwise this does seem like extreme punishment. Perhaps there are genuine uncontrolled MH issues which are putting the child at risk. The act of disappearing with the child is certainly one of desperation...

Poor child.

wannaBe Thu 11-Jun-15 11:58:11

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fuzzywuzzy Thu 11-Jun-15 12:07:44

I had the devils own time trying to stop contact, ex was grooming eldest and bullying youngest it was horrendous both children especially eldest was showing very disturbed behaviour. The courts were reluctant to believe me and ex tried to make out like I was abusing the DC.

Thank God I had amazing lawyers. And I continued with contact despite it being completely and utterly damaging to the DC, because I knew any slip up on my side would be taken vey strongly as me being obstructive. I finally ended up with a judge who specialised in DV cases and with the help form school letters, the DV intervention team and Paediatricians contact was finally stopped he as indirect contact and DC are finally getting over the years of abuse.

It took me eight years tho, and I am still neck deep in debt because of the legal fees. My barrister said it was only because I am fairly articulate and composed in court (I don't know how I was dying inside each time I had a court appearance).

I don't make any judgment about the mother over this, I hope she and the child are safe.

wannaBe Thu 11-Jun-15 12:13:05

but people would judge if it were the father. Without question. So why does being the mother change that? The fact is that there are women who use their children as weapons and who do block contact. I have no doubt that she feels desperate, but making up malicious allegations is not the way to go about things.

Badgerlady Thu 11-Jun-15 12:46:18

The two judgments are here: www.judiciary.gov.uk/judgments/roger-williams-v-rebecca-minnock-and-ethan-freeman-williams-2-judgments/

The one dated 8 June give the most background. It appears that Ms Minnock made repeated unfounded allegations and extensively questioned Ethan following contact. It is also apparent from the judgement that the day before the final hearing she took Ethan to hospital and made further allegations resulting in him being examined (nothing was found).

The judge transferred care to the father at the final hearing - the mother did not attend. I note her family are in the press today saying the case should be 'reviewed' by a higher level of court. The way to do that would be for the mother to engage with the court process and appeal the judgement.

PerspicaciaTick Thu 11-Jun-15 12:52:21

The problem is that, by running away with her DC, she has simply reinforced the court's judgement and made things harder for herself and her DC in the long run.

PeruvianFoodLover Thu 11-Jun-15 13:32:48

But the child has lived with his mother all this time and is now being taken away and put with his father, which will be confusing and could be potentially damaging to the child, depending upon how much contact he has actually had with his father up until now.

Ethan has been spending 4 nights a week with his father since earlier this year - at least, according to the court transcripts linked above.

Sadly, his mothers actions have now robbed him of one parent - either his father if they are never found, or his mother if they are tracked down safely.

AuntieStella Thu 11-Jun-15 13:42:12

They surely cannot stay hidden for long.

And what she's done is hardly going to give any assurance that she will be capable of co-parenting in the coming years, particularly as it comes with a history of disrupting contact and false allegations.

Rudawakening Thu 11-Jun-15 13:53:47

As sad as this is for the mother, the court must have some great concerns about her ability to parent the child.

Making allegations and blocking contact does not put the needs of the boy first, it's about using him to punish the Father.

I agree with wannabe as well, if this was the other way around the Father would be denigrated and probably never see his son again. Why is any different for a woman?

Dervel Thu 11-Jun-15 14:08:00

Well actually hang on if the father is not going to obstruct contact (probably why the court made the decision they did) there is no reason for the boy to not to have meaningful contact with both parents.

The child's interest here has to be prioritized over punitive action imo. I'd say that irrespective of what gender the bat shit crazy parent who bolted is.

She has without question acted abominably, not just for in terms of bolting, but in blocking contact and fabricating allegations against the father. Thanks to the media storm this makes things that little harder for mums with genuinely abusive exes.

My hope is she comes to her senses and does the right thing. He looks like a lovely little boy.

VoyageOfDad Thu 11-Jun-15 14:09:49

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KingTut Thu 11-Jun-15 14:15:23

I haven't read the court papers, what were the allegations against the Father? I thought I read her psychiatric assessment said no mh or PD issues.

happybubblebrain Thu 11-Jun-15 14:22:52

Anything anyone on here can say is really just speculation. None of us know anything about this case really.

What I have noticed is a particularly one-sided point of view put out by the media today. Why am I not surprised. And the constant 'the courts are on the mother's side' mantra is a complete lie, certainly not anymore.

How many mothers really do stop fathers seeing children when there aren't very, very good reasons for them to do this? - I suspect hardly any. How many fathers are telling lies about this to gain sympathy/feel better about not being arsed to keep up contact etc? - I suspect many.

PeruvianFoodLover Thu 11-Jun-15 14:23:33

tut firstly, allegations of drug abuse, then some months later, controlling behaviour and inappropriate sexual behaviour. All found, by the District Judge, to be fabricated.

Dervel Thu 11-Jun-15 14:24:11

That may be so, but purely from that little boys perspective his life outcomes are most positive when he grows up feeling he has access to both parents.

You can make the argument to throw the book at her to make an example. However in this instance the little boy's interest should take priority in my view.

I'm a dad myself who is separated from my child's mother, and my situation gets pretty acrimonious at times, however the mantra has to be what is in the child's interest.

It may not be fair, but life isn't sometimes, and you just have to roll up your sleeves and get on with it as best you can.

PeruvianFoodLover Thu 11-Jun-15 14:26:34

bubble The court has released the facts of the case to the media in order to try and find Ethan - it's not speculation that contact was prevented by his mum and that she made false allegations, it's a matter of court record.

In contrast, your assertion that "hardy any" mothers stop contact without good reason is entirely speculative.

VoyageOfDad Thu 11-Jun-15 14:29:34

My ex was obstructive for no good reason until I suggested she find a solicitor as I'd have no choice but to take the legal route

I think it happens far more than people think.

Not on Mn obvs

VikingVolva Thu 11-Jun-15 14:32:59

From the judgements linked to this thread, the boy did have access to both parents, on a fairly even 3/4 day per week basis, until one parent frustrated it. Repeatedly.

KingTut Thu 11-Jun-15 14:35:26

What evidence was found to show the Father wasn't controlling/taking drugs and so forth?

happybubblebrain Thu 11-Jun-15 14:35:37

Everything on court record is 100% true then, ok hmm. We don't know everything about this case just what the media is telling us. The mother obviously thought she was doing the right thing. But who really knows.

PerspicaciaTick Thu 11-Jun-15 14:36:10

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