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Another case of Asian men raping an underage girl - cue the outrage

(46 Posts)
BasilBabyEater Sun 06-Oct-13 09:31:59

And the analysis about what it is about this ethnic group that makes them want to rape children.

BBC coverage here

Oh, hang on, none of the perpetrators are Asian after all. They're all white. So where is the national outrage? Where are the pages and pages of analysis asking what the problem with white men is? Where the commentaries demanding that white people do something about their dangerous men?

Has anyone else spotted what the connection with all the perpetrators is? Guess what, it ain't race.

Where is the mainstream media response to this case? Why isn't there one?

BasilBabyEater Mon 07-Oct-13 17:46:43

Hmm. I think I probably haven't been crystal clear in what I'm saying. For me this isn't about racism, it's about sexism.

My point is that when the Rochdale Asian men raped girls, the reason for their behaviour was put down to them being "other" - some kind of particularly vicious, unpleasant men with some kind of cultural issues that made them somehow more prone to be rapists. Asians were urged to examine the horrible misogyny in their communities and root it out.

When white men do the same, there is no soul-searching, no examination of the attitudes of mainstream society to sex, rape, etc., no urging us as a society to examine our misogyny and sexism, no ongoing articles and opinion pieces in the press and on the TV and radio. It's just another rape case and in mainstream media, rape is totally disconnected from our wider problem of misogyny and sexism in a way that it wasn't when mainstream media talked about the Rochdale case.

I accept that there was a problem of people not investigating the Rochdale case because of the fear of being accused of racism, but that's not what I'm talking about, that's a completely different issue to the one I'm getting at - which is our unwillingness to confront the fact that our society, whichever ethnic group we're in, has a huge misogyny problem that we urgently need to address but that we actually can't see unless the ethnic group is not mainstream white.

Sorry, I obviously didn't express that very clearly.

PatPig Mon 07-Oct-13 18:20:34

The reason the Asian gangs were such a scandal is because the white power structure covered them up and enabled their crimes.

We know that men have abused in the past and will continue abuse children in the future. Just as we know that houses will be burgled, cars will be stolen, and other crimes happen.

Crimes, unless particularly outrageous, aren't a major shock, they are part of being alive.

The 'Asian gangs' story is a meme ONLY because white institutions (police, children's services) covered them up.

Once that cover-up was uncovered it went from an every day 'crime occurred' story to a government-sponsored conspiracy.

The former is an item on page 12, the latter is quite rightly front-page news.

And with clear proof that Muslim/Asian gangs were protected by WHITE institutions, BECAUSE the gangs were Muslim/Asian, it's inevitable that anything resembling an Muslim/Asian gang will be described by the news as such.

That's just how news reporting work - you have an angle that turns a story from everyday into headline news and of course you go with it.

Just a few years ago a story like this one would have been headlined on the basis of 'internet menace to your children', because the internet was new and novel and frightening to many people. That particular line of reporting is now passé and so they haven't reported it.

Also it's a fact that the various 'Asian gangs' did act in collusion with each other, so you had multiple men abusing multiple girls.

That's conspiracy, and again it should be obvious that 'gang' is more newsworthy than a single vulnerable girl being abused by multiple men separately, and also that where that 'gang' has control over multiple girls that is in turn more newsworthy than a single victim.

So it's actually a fairly simple chain of events:

* white institutions in areas with large Muslim populations are aware of abuse of girls by Muslim men, and decided that it was more important to preserve 'community relations' than to stop the abuse
* this fact is uncovered by the media, creating the 'Asian gang' meme and headline news
* multiple similar 'Asian gangs' operating in very similar ways across the country are subsequently uncovered, and each is consequently labelled 'Asian gang'

'Asian gangs' are not unique, you also have 'Catholic priest paedophiles', and now 'TV/radio presenters from the 60s, 70s and 80s'.

Each of these is now a news category by themselves, and in each case largely thanks to cover-ups by powerful white institutions.

In the future events will no doubt establish further categories synonymous with the abuse of children but for now that's what we have.

Wallison Mon 07-Oct-13 18:27:09

I think the Archbishop of Canterbury should be wheeled out onto News At Ten to publicly explain to everyone that these men are not representative of white, Christian people.

BasilBabyEater Mon 07-Oct-13 18:30:35

That doesn't address the latent racism in much of the reporting around those cases PatPig. I also find it interesting that the (white) mainstream media was suddenly interested in the problem of misogyny in Asian communities while being blind to the problem of misogyny in wider society.

Wallison Mon 07-Oct-13 18:36:34

I've actually almost given up on trying to talk sensibly with people in rl about this. Even friends who have been verbally/sexually abused/assaulted for not wanting to have sex with (white) men after being bought a drink by them etc on a depressingly frequent basis, including one friend whose mate was literally kicked in the fucking teeth in front of her by a frustrated (white) suitor, talk in terms of the 'threat' of Asian men. It's depressing.

edam Mon 07-Oct-13 18:49:12


V good point, Basil, sorry it went straight over my head.

SeaSickSal Tue 08-Oct-13 16:34:39

Put it this way OP. If this group had raped a girl of a different race from them and there was evidence that their races had enabled a cover up of the crime e.g. a white police officer minimizing or ignoring the crime because they were white and the victim wasn't - then yes, you would be seeing pages and pages of coverage asking why.

What do you want to happen, do you want to ban coverage of any crimes if they don't portray your favoured groups in a positive light?

Honestly, people with attitudes like yours smack of the deep south where the favoured group (whites) were always assumed to be innocent and their crimes against others minimized because their race was a more important factor than their guilt or innocent. But you've simply chosen a new group to favour.

Nice to see you're shouting racism at others when you appear to be an incredibly accomplished racist yourself.

SeaSickSal Tue 08-Oct-13 16:37:14

PatPig white institutions are to blame really? How come in Rotherham it was discovered that much of the cover up was initiated by the perpetrators asian relatives on the council?

BasilBabyEater Tue 08-Oct-13 19:30:32

You clearly haven't understood anything I've posted seasicksal.

Try reading my posts again.

This isn't about race.

EldritchCleavage Wed 09-Oct-13 12:18:26

I do agree with you OP. Thanks to the recent, scandalous cases, people are very eager to point out the misogyny in Asian groups that contributed to their sex offending. They are not at all so prepared (whatever their ethnicity) to do the same with their own groups/cultures.

Because everyone does this. The pattern of offending may be different according to whether West African, African-Caribbean, Irish Traveller, Scottish or whatever men are doing this, but sexual offences against young girls, organised or individual, are a common place.

And despite the paedo panics that blow up from time to time, there is a marked and widespread reluctance to consider what it is in our ostensibly equal, rights-cognizant country that drives or enables this to happen. I.e. to think politically, culturally, anthropologically about it rather than see it as only inexplicable individual failings by evil men.

musicismylife Tue 15-Oct-13 22:24:43

I agree 100%.

Like I have mentioned on another thread, when you are white and you commit a crime, you're a criminal. When your black and commit a crime you're a black criminal. Makes a big diffremce

musicismylife Tue 15-Oct-13 22:25:04

You're *

Pocketangel Sat 26-Oct-13 10:20:25

Message deleted by Mumsnet for breaking our Talk Guidelines. Replies may also be deleted.

cory Sat 26-Oct-13 16:07:44

Pocketangel, in most cases like these it turns out the child has already been abused and is damaged and traumatised- in other words, that she has already "learnt" all the wrong lessons.

BetterWithCheese Sat 26-Oct-13 16:26:37

Yes I agree with cory - it will almost certainly be the case that she was subject to some form of sexual abuse prior to advertising herself. Blaming young girls for being over sexualised makes no sense - they haven't created the culture which has over sexualised them they are a product of it. You are still victim blaming.

ZangelbertBingeldac Sat 26-Oct-13 16:30:59

Hate the title of this thread.

"raping an underage girl" underage for what? rape??

AnyFuckerReporting Sat 26-Oct-13 16:37:28

I remember this case. The girl joined a dating sure, claiming to be older. These men, once they knew her age, still went ahead with meeting her and sexually exploited her. It's not exactly the same as some of the grooming cases involving Asian men but still disgusting behaviour. One of the men lives very locally to me.

MothershipG Sat 26-Oct-13 16:54:17

Pocketangel I find your post really disturbing, you think it's ok for an adult male to have sex with a child? And then you think the blame lies with her?

I have reported your post for victim blaming.

FrightRider Sun 27-Oct-13 09:54:05

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

LordPalmerston Sun 27-Oct-13 09:57:32

Pocket. She was raped!!

caruthers Sun 27-Oct-13 11:16:56

Whichever way this is dressed up,having sex with a 13 year old should carry a longer sentence than 3 flippin' years confused

These men were abusers and certainly shame me as a man...the courts could have given them much much longer but for their own reasons decided not to.

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