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Mother and 2 children found dead - suicide/murder

(139 Posts)
ShaggingZumbaStylee Sun 14-Jul-13 00:46:10

It sounds like she was really struggling, but I find it so difficult to understand why she killed her children with her.


HeySoulSister Sun 14-Jul-13 00:49:49

Yep, find that difficult to 'get' as well

blueshoes Sun 14-Jul-13 00:52:28

Her children's lives were not hers to take. RIP

It sounds like she was terrified of leaving them behind for her abusive ex to raise.

A tragedy that she was pushed so far she couldn't keep fighting.

AlfalfaMum Sun 14-Jul-13 01:07:05

Awful terrible tragedy. That poor woman and her children.
Please, before directing anger at her, think of the abusive man 28 years her senior who put her in the state of mind to do this.

Solo Sun 14-Jul-13 01:07:24

Agree with SummerRain and I strongly believe that we cannot judge this Mum or anyone else in this situation because we cannot know what she was going through. 'There but for the grace of God go I' and all that.
I hope they all rest in peace.

theorchardkeeper Sun 14-Jul-13 07:07:56

What's sad is that it was preventable. Poor family. RIP thanks

chicaguapa Sun 14-Jul-13 07:29:34

Stories like this break my heart. That little boy was on his mum's back because he trusted her to look after him and she jumped! sad I find some of these stories really hard to deal with.

LtEveDallas Sun 14-Jul-13 07:34:22

Message deleted by Mumsnet for breaking our Talk Guidelines. Replies may also be deleted.

HeySoulSister Sun 14-Jul-13 10:19:45

Sounds like they should have been removed from her care... Hindsight and all that

KatyaRachmanova Sun 14-Jul-13 19:44:27

I live close to Haytor and can't stop thinking about it. While it is totally horrific I just feel so so sad. i cannot find it in me to hate her, I am just appalled that the help she so obviously needed was lacking. RIP all three of you.

SoulTrain Sun 14-Jul-13 19:53:07

LtEveDallas - what a hateful post.

Without knowing the circumstances leading up to the terrible tragedy, and obviously never having experienced desperation, possible depression or fear as this lady probably has how could you possibly comment? You're rationalising with a sane mind, you can't even begin to understand what she might have been going through. Stop spouting "speaking as a mother" shit and spare a thought for a family member who could possible be reading your post - you hope she burns in hell? Who on earth actually thinks like that?

Your post has made me feel quite sick. sad

TabithaStephens Sun 14-Jul-13 20:16:38

I can't help thinking that if genders were reversed, the feelings would be quite difference.

crescentmoon Sun 14-Jul-13 20:24:36

"Her children's lives were not hers to take"

yup agree. also agree that feelings would be very different if this had been a male family annihilator. RIP

SoulTrain Sun 14-Jul-13 20:51:01

hmm Oh right, a feminist thing is it?

cresent and tabitha;

I base my opinion on the (often scant) facts available from each case, not on MN consensus.

I've noticed when men do this the facts often suggest it is done as an act of vengeance on the mother for leaving. They are often accompanied by phone calls or letters to the mother accusing her of 'causing it' and statements along the lines of 'If I can't have them nobody can'.

If a male suicide/murder case occurs where I feel (based on the information available) that the man had acted out of desperation and fear i do feel exactly as i do in this situation. There have been cases here in ireland due to the economic crisis where men have killed their families due to a mental health breakdown resulting from severe financial hardship.

Equally I have seen female suicide/murder cases where I have not sympathised as strongly with the mother, where it has seemed like there were other options for the child/ren than to go to an abusive ex in the mothers absence (a close extended family, a loving husband, foster care as no family/ex on the scene).

Sympathising with the desperation a person must have felt in their final hours is not the same as condoning their actions. What this woman did was wrong, but it's not my place to judge her actions and condemn her to 'burning in hell'. I simply expressed horror at the situation that pushed a woman to feel she had no other escape, and more so, that leaving her children behind could possibly be worse for them than them dying at her hand. Think about that statement... she actually felt murdering them was safer than leaving them behind, can you imagine the fear she must have been living with?

crossparsley Sun 14-Jul-13 21:35:26

I don't believe in hell or vengeance but I'm with Lt Eve. It's not as if every family-murder-then-suicide father was untroubled, whatever we think of the specific troubles of each individual. I know that when you are in the grips of mental distress you don't think straight but really, if you ever are seriously thinking of killing children and you don't GET SOME HELP, in a country that has its faults but has got emergency facilities, then you are not just a victim. You have some responsibility.

HenWithAttitude Sun 14-Jul-13 21:49:54

The husband has been arrested for assaulting her in April. I don't think I can imagine she was thinking straight. I agree that if this was a man I'd view it differently (rightly or wrongly). I'd view it more as an aggressive act to deprive the mother rather than an act of desperation.

She went missing 3 months ago and was found in a distressed state. She obviously had mental health issues set against a background of an abusive relationship. Very tragic story and hard to comprehend her actions

LtEveDallas Sun 14-Jul-13 22:28:08

A family annihilator is a family annihilator, male or female. I care no more for this murderer than I cared for the bloke that jumped out of a hotel window with his kids, nor the guy in Shropshire, nor the ex soldier and so on.

If you kill your children, you get my hate, not my understanding.

I save my thoughts for the innocent children whose lives were selfishly ended by their murderers.

Oh and soultrain, I've never said 'speaking as a mother' in my life so don't know where you get that shit. As for sparing a thought for a family member? Is she had been my family member I would still feel the same. There is NEVER an excuse or a reason for killing an innocent child in cold blood. Better she handed the children into a police station and killed herself than take them with her.

If my post makes you feel sick? So be it. Frankly the murder of two children makes me sicker.

noddyholder Sun 14-Jul-13 22:29:42

Having sympathy/empathy for someone who has done something like that isn't the same as condoning it

CuttedUpPear Sun 14-Jul-13 22:31:00

Wishing someone to rot in hell who clearly had difficulty coping with life is a cruel and callous thing to do.

Don't judge until you have walked a mile in their shoes LtEve

noddyholder Sun 14-Jul-13 22:32:21

'you get my hate' Wow

LtEveDallas Sun 14-Jul-13 22:40:20

So I'm callous? No, callous is killing your children. Callous is giving your trusting son a piggyback then dashing him onto the rocks.

I'm sorry, but I will never understand. What she did was an evil act. Even in the depths of despair it was still an evil act. When a man wipes out his family people are up in arms about how evil he must be, how he must have been doing it to get back at their mother, how he killed just to hurt her. There is never any sympathy for his depression, never any excuses.

Maybe she did it to get back at her partner. Maybe the assault charge was a lie (he was never convicted), maybe she wanted him back and he said no. It's all equally a viable as what is currently being said.

There are very few things in this world that I am black and white about. But child murder is one. I see no shades of grey here. She killed them and in the most horrible of ways. I could not and would not forgive.

noddyholder Sun 14-Jul-13 22:42:19

Are you serious? SO much hate.

LtEveDallas Sun 14-Jul-13 22:44:52

Yes noddy, very serious. I don't see why I shouldn't be?

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