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5 year old kills his sister with his birthday gun in US

(84 Posts)
Slainte Wed 01-May-13 20:10:38

Title says it all, here's the link.

When will people fucking learn? angry

I've just come back from a weekend in pocono mountains, in Pennsylvania. We were spending the time at an indoor water park, think Center Parcs but American stylee. There were large notices by the main entrance forbidding bringing fire arms onto the premises. The fact that there is a need for a sign telling people this beggars belief.
I will be going on a 'mothers against guns' rally this weekend. Apparently we can expect nra members to turn up and, as licencising permits it in Pennsylvania, to be wandering around carrying guns.

phantomnamechanger Mon 06-May-13 10:01:24

how unbelievably tragic the whole scenario is, and that these sort of people cannot see this is NOT just "a terrible accident" - it was negligent plain and simple. The children are too young to fully understand and in any case, the responsibility lies with the parents to supervise guns properly. That they have pretty pink girly accessories is also worrying that these things are just seen as pretty accessories rather than lethal weapons. The little girl could just as easily have shot herself or brother or her mum.
The crap about "it was her time" makes my blood boil.

Yesterday my 11yo accidently shot her bro in the eye with a foam dart from a nerf gun - they know the rules about not firing in peoples faces or close up, it was an accident while she was loading it - both were shocked and DS was hurt and cried. This sort of thing WILL happen, but no harm done in our case cos the bullet was foam!

We live in the UK and in a quiet sleepy village, but even then I have told my kids if they EVER see a gun in the bushes at the park or somewhere, they DO NOT TOUCH IT

HorryIsUpduffed Mon 06-May-13 08:24:41

The NRA are baffling me. They accuse Obama of using "tragic accidents" to open a debate about gun control for personal or political reasons.

I just can't get my head around a community where gun use/ownership is so commonplace that any attempt to control it is like saying you can't have domestic animals, or lock your own front door, or something.

But if it starts when you're an infant then no wonder I suppose sad

Whatalotofpiffle Sun 05-May-13 23:56:39

That's awful. I can't get my head round guns being all over the place, terrifying.

bollockstoit Thu 02-May-13 15:17:09

It's hard to imagine the mindset of these people. I got a bit nervous because ds was carrying around a well-sharpened pencil the other day. I am probably overly anxious, but still.

CheerfulYank Thu 02-May-13 15:02:53

Right. I mean, my nephew isn't just running around with the guns or anything, BIL lets him shoot at targets if he's right there. But I wouldn't allow my DS to do that at 7 either.

StealthOfficialCrispTester Thu 02-May-13 14:44:32

Thanks. Comments aboutbthe 7yo are scary. Ds is 6, I cannot imagine allowing him ti shoot in a year

CheerfulYank Thu 02-May-13 13:34:03

I've really got no problems with guns for hunting as long as they're properly looked after. But to give them to children is madness IMO and to leave them around like this couple is beyond reprehensible. Criminal negligence for sure.

CheerfulYank Thu 02-May-13 13:29:24

Stealth we actually do have a unloaded hunting rifle in our (locked) garage.

Yes it does seem to be concentrated by state. I lived in a different one when I was very young and I don't remember much wrt to guns. When we moved it was to rural areas and they were everywhere, for hunting. I live in another rural community now and I'd guess the majority have them as the majority of people hunt. But they also take pride in being "responsible gun owners" so you don't ever see them. A gun standing in the corner of the room is unheard of.

My BIL, as mentioned, is a dumbass. And he has all sorts of guns and lets his 7 year old shoot them, which I would not allow. But he would never leave a gun sitting around.

My friends who got the gun for their DD are a bit worrisome. They are both vets and both have PTSD to varying degrees. They see the world as a dangerous place and want their girls to know how to defend themselves. I had let DS play over there in the past but after some comments they've made he is not allowed now because I don't trust that their weapons are locked away.

Startail Thu 02-May-13 12:50:43

The gun control argument is pretty irrelevant here.

This wasn't an accident it was manslaughter by the girls parents.

It's plain negligence to leave a loaded gun, or 101 other dangerous objects in reach of a 5 and a 2 year old.

GladbagsGold Thu 02-May-13 12:48:55


My DC have shot air rifles, in a controlled, very safe environment, aged 6 and 8. Was part of a Cubs things. They enjoyed it and completely understand the importance of safety and supervision. Such a shame the same sort of common sense doesn't apply everywhere.

Poor kids.

StealthOfficialCrispTester Thu 02-May-13 12:42:39

Cheerful, do you know if it is most Americans who own guns? Give their DC guns? Guessing from your comments you don't agree. Is it concentrated in certain states?

everythinghippie29 Thu 02-May-13 12:41:17

Felt physically sick looking at that rifle website and its ' accessories' section. Such a sad and unnecessary incident. How could you not check that a gun was loaded and fireable if it was just left in the corner of a room where a child who had been presumably taught to fire it could have total access.

I don't like it myself, but if you wanted to teach your children to hunt/ use q gun do it when they are older and capable of understanding safety and proper use in a controlled environment, not the home. A five year old should never have access to a lethal weapon.

Poor little girl and poor boy having to grow up knowing that horrible tragedy happened because the people around him were too proud and righteous to simply keep guns out of a family home. sad

ChaosTrulyReigns Thu 02-May-13 12:36:36

"It's just tragic," uncle David Mann told the CNN affiliate. "It's something that you can't prepare for."

Of course you can.


WTFisABooyhooISBooyhoo Thu 02-May-13 12:22:53

i'm guessing that to the people who buy/design/market guns for children it must be the same kind of way people take young dcs fishing and buy them their first fishing pole. obviosuly it is entirely different but to these people that must be what they see it as? just a hobby they do with the kids from a young age?

DesperatelySeekingSedatives Thu 02-May-13 07:46:38

I can't get my head round why the fuck anyone would have a gun just standing randomly in the corner of a room. Even without kids in the house what about intruders breaking in and using your gun as a weapon against you?!

Also "they didnt know it was loaded" makes it even worse. They didnt have the sense or brains to actually check properly.

Poor little boy. His sister too obviously but he's going to have to live with this for rest of his life and it isnt even his fault. It's his stupid parents' fault and the fucked up culture they live in.

CheerfulYank Thu 02-May-13 07:39:54

Even my dumbassed redneck gun-crazed BIL keeps his guns locked away from his kids.

Those idiot parents. Makes me sick.

TeWiSavesTheDay Thu 02-May-13 07:35:06

The rules are not the same re: gun storage, no.

Which makes me very cross. There are lots of countries (i come from one) with just as high rates of gun ownership, even where children (though not that young) would also be given guns. But gun control and storage is very strict - tests to prove you understand safe use before you can have a license for example. Obviously in those countries gun deaths are vastly lower. Just introducing these kind of rules would be a massive head start in solving the problem.

As I understand it many people refuse to lock their guns away because they want easy access in case an intruder arrives.

This is the parents fault, and I would never normally say that when a child dies.

SoupDragon Thu 02-May-13 07:31:34

Truly horrendous.

The parents (or whoever was in charge of the gun) was negligent and incompetent. It was must have been loaded and not secured in a locked cabinet.

I find the grandmother's comments on the CNN page weird. "gone to a better place" and "It was her time/god's will" confused She was shot by her brother FFS!

racmun Thu 02-May-13 07:27:08

WTF a real gun for kids????

I thought it had got mixed up with his dad's or something when I read the op.
Awful awful awful on so many levels and in so many ways.

CheerfulYank Thu 02-May-13 07:19:12

Those poor babies.

My friends bought their daughter a hot pink rifle for her 8th birthday. angry

WorrySighWorrySigh Thu 02-May-13 07:17:04

These accidents are tragic and so avoidable. The problem is not the gun but the attitudes to it.

My DS shoots a rifle at cadets and I have been with him to a gun club. These are .22 rifles in the main so the same as was used in this accident. In both the rules are very, very strict to avoid accidents.

Sirzy Thu 02-May-13 07:14:06

It's scary how a so called civilised society can be so blasé about guns that a child killing another with a gun is accepted as just one of those things.

BinarySolo Thu 02-May-13 07:09:02

don't they have to keep them locked away

But isn't that like the dangerous dogs act wear certain breeds were banned, had to be registered etc? People just flout certain laws. The rifle in this case was kept in the corner of the room, clearly not locked away. And the parents don't appear to be being prosecuted.

Just one of those 'crazy accidents' really minimises the parents' responsibility in this. Wholly preventable.

LtEveDallas Thu 02-May-13 06:57:58

I didn't know that Scavola sad. My SIL is in America with her husband and DNeice - I've never really thought about them having a gun before (no idea if they do or not). Guns don't bother me as much as most people in UK, but only because I am happy with the strict control and storage rules we have. Doesn't the USA have the same? Don't they have to keep them locked away then?

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