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Cardinal Keith O'Brien

(79 Posts)
AgentProvocateur Sun 24-Feb-13 00:18:19

Tomorrow's Observer is reporting that three priests are alleging inappropriate behaviour by the cardinal, the UK's most senior Catholic and Stonewall's "bigotry if the year" 2012. If the allegations are true, he's also hypocrite of the year.

CarnivorousPanda Sun 24-Feb-13 14:35:08

Just read this in the Observer.

If true-words fail me.

bunchamunchycrunchycarrots Sun 24-Feb-13 14:44:40


gobblegobs Sun 24-Feb-13 14:50:08

I am very disappointed... I was raised in catholic traditions and over a period of time all of this erodes all I believe... If true this is very sad.

DreamsTurnToGoldDust Sun 24-Feb-13 14:53:03

The one who shouts loudest really isnt it, and yet no doubt will be covered up sadly.

Do you know, it just brings out a slow sad shaking of my head really and why is it not a shock, very sad.

Animation Sun 24-Feb-13 21:38:40

Always glad to hear of victims coming forward and reporting these powerful men. Must take guts.

scaevola Mon 25-Feb-13 11:05:12

He has resigned with immediate effect.

He was due to step down fairly soon anyhow (age), but not expected like this.

He has been denying the allegations and taking legal advice. There is no explanation (yet) for reasons for taking this step now.

eatyourveg Mon 25-Feb-13 11:14:03

Cardinal Cormac Murphy O'Connor said yesterday he would resign so no great surprise really

scaevola Mon 25-Feb-13 11:20:07

He said he would retire later this year when he turns 75 (ie normal age related, and after the Conclave).

Nothing about going before the Conclave and ahead of normal retirement age.

PessaryPam Mon 25-Feb-13 11:54:57

They are disgusting. I feel so sorry for all the faithful who have stuck behind them only to be let down as they lied. Maybe they should take a lesson from all of this about men in dresses.

Animation Mon 25-Feb-13 12:06:57

Well four priests reported him, so if he did it he should own up and confess particularly if he wants to go to heaven, - instead of chuntering about taking legal advice.

CarnivorousPanda Mon 25-Feb-13 12:38:01

This is the man who was awarded the title of Bigot of the year by Stonewall for his views on civil partnerships.

Reported by 4 priests, I wonder if more will now come forward?

LadyBeagleEyes Mon 25-Feb-13 12:40:17

I'm not religious in any way, but even with all the revelations about the Catholic church, I'm still shocked about this.
What a fucking hypocrite, his views on abortion already sickened me, but I gave him the benefit of the doubt because of his deep faith.
I also feel sorry for the faithful who followed him.

LBsBongers Mon 25-Feb-13 12:42:18

He has resigned and I suspect that will be the end of it as far as the Vatican is concerned, what will them being above the law and accountable to no one.

I hope we learn more about these allegations, just awful

babyboomersrock Mon 25-Feb-13 13:34:59

Any religion which encourages power at the top (ie most of them) is open to abuse by its "leaders". Gorgeous clothes, magnificent churches, uplifting music and lots of ritual may appeal to some people, but it's not what Jesus came to teach, is it? Does it inspire ordinary people to go and feed the poor? To share what they have with others?

I'm no longer a Christian but its followers would do better to live the life advocated by their real leader and abandon the earthly ones. I'm very wary of people who interpret things for us, tell us how to think, how to live our lives - while no-one monitors their own.

Jesus the man didn't go around courting adulation, waving blessings from balconies. The central messages of humility, simplicity and service have long gone.

If these allegations are true, I'll be surprised if it makes any difference in the long run. The priests are brave men indeed to take on a Cardinal with the might of the the Catholic church behind him but I don't think they'll find themselves widely supported, either by their fellow Catholics or their church superiors.

CarnivorousPanda Mon 25-Feb-13 13:43:39

I just hope that if these allegations are correct, others do come forward. This is what happened with the Jimmy Savile case.

yes babyboomer, its all about power.Lovely clothes, ancient rituals. But sickness at its heart.

StephaniePowers Mon 25-Feb-13 13:47:42

Bunch of nutters the lot of them.
How anybody follows any religious leader mystifies me.
It's repellent that nothing will be done, but at least it has been made public and he can repent at his leisure (couple of Hail Marys most likely).

Animation Mon 25-Feb-13 14:15:14

'I'm very wary of people who interpret things for us, tell us how to think, how to live our lives - while no-one monitors their own.'

So am I babyboomersrock. If you think about it it a very powerful position to be in - you can't get much more powerful than that. And I think it attracts men who will abuse that power and will not have to account.

I anticipate that such an autocratic culture will close ranks, push this under the carpet, and ostracise the priests. I'm glad it's made public at least and people will make up their own minds about what to think of such an organisation of men.

BridgetJonesPants Mon 25-Feb-13 14:28:35

What happened to innocent until proven guilty? Thank goodness the 'Hang him high brigade' are not running the country or the Catholic church. That said, I think the Cardinal has done the correct thing in resigning now so the colclave can go ahead, hopefully without this news blighting the election of the new Pope.

At this time, none of us know exactly what the Cardinal is accused of, although my interpitation of the press articles are that he made sexual advances on four young priests. It's certainly not a hanging offence, but if it does turn out to the true, then he has indeed abused his power and it makes him a hypocrite with regards to his views on homosexuality. However, that said, he's only human, and is open to the same failings as the rest of us.

As a Catholic, I'll be praying for Cardinal O'Brien, whether he's innocent or not, the accusers and lastly, that the Catholic church handle this with integrity and transparancy.

Animation Mon 25-Feb-13 14:47:25

'What happened to innocent until proven guilty?'

In a court of law - yes! What sex scandal in the Catholic church has ever reached court?

It's four priests words against one Cardinal. And if true lets not minimize the harm done to these young priests.

Cheddars Mon 25-Feb-13 15:06:10

The timing of this seems weird to my suspicious mind.

The alleged 'inappropriate behaviour' happened 20(?) years ago so why is it coming out now in the same month he was due to vote on a new pope?

Could just be coincidence I suppose. hmm

StephaniePowers Mon 25-Feb-13 15:40:41

He might not have committed a crime, so innocent until proven guilty is perhaps not relevant. A man is allowed to make advances to other men.

It's the utter hypocrisy of it all. Keep the women and the gays in their place, whilst the leaders swan around doing whatever they can get away with - because they know they will get away with it. It's rank.

FlutterClutter Mon 25-Feb-13 16:53:25

StephaniePowers - yes absolutely. Taking advantage of the blind faith and god-fearing ways of their flock to get away with their hypocrisy.

It makes me so angry that these unelected 'leaders' have power over people's lives all around the world.

babyboomersrock Mon 25-Feb-13 18:48:45

Stephanie Powers - I agree.

As for the "hang him high brigade", BridgetJonesPants - I don't see any of them on here. I thought you were telling us not to pre-judge, but you go on to say much the same as the rest of us.

If he is innocent, then let him prove it. If he is guilty of "inappropriate behaviour" then I hope he admits it and doesn't make these men out to be liars. He may be "only human and open to the same failings as the rest of us" but the rest of us are not asked to make pronouncements on major matters (gay marriage) or tell other people how they should behave. At the very least - if the priests' claims are true - his behaviour has been hugely hypocritical.

I wouldn't waste my time feeling compassion, or (were I a believer) offering prayers for him - he'll have the power of the Catholic church behind him and all the prayers he'll need. I do feel compassion for those who have been tormented by his judgemental pronouncements in recent times.

LeftWingTwat Mon 25-Feb-13 18:55:45


I was curious about that too given how things are covered up. He was the guy who a few days before said he thought priests should be able to marry, and suddenly this?

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